Best of "The Interviews" | 19 Day Devil Series Interview with Mom | Previously Unreleased

0:06 Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real victims, whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real? I use my experiences in law enforcement corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal justice educator, dig deep into complex cases of evil acts, some so evil many feel they are unspeakable. Warning.

0:51 Unspeakable as intended for mature audiences. If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl. Listening discretion is advised. Hey, y'all, welcome back to Unspeaking. What's going on, my patron peeps? I have got a bonus episode for you today, and I think that you're gonna enjoy this one because guess who I have in the studio with me, The one and only Miss Ronda Champagne. But how do you pronounce that? For those of us who are coon ass, it's Champagne Champagne for us redneck champagne. Miss Rona Champagne. And she is the wonderful mother of Summer and Tanner Ernest and the former wife of Billy Ernest. And I thought, Hey, wouldn't it be great if I brought her in because we've become friends, right, yes, we have. And I said, let me get this woman in here because we just love you. My husband says you're you're his spirit animal because all the funny stuff you posted on Facebook. But let's talk, you know, and let the people get to know you, babies. And I think, do you think I did an okay job? You did an awesome job?

1:55 Represented them right? You? Did? You know? I love me some Tanner? Oh lord, oh my god, that boy, that boy in our beautiful Summer. Yeah, And so let's talk a little bit about your experience, because I've told the story and all of its horribleness, and I kind of wanted to start with the fact that, you know, a lot of people said Summer and Dakota were dating. I argue they weren't, right. It had only been what a total in nineteen days that they knew each other literally, Yeah, yeah, And so what was your what was your understanding of that relationship? I mean I looked at it like her and Seawn had just broke up. She didn't even know Dakoda. I guarantee you I would hope that if she did know him and learned the true him, that there would have been no Dakota. I agree, you know, because she was smart. Summer wasn't. Summer wasn't don No. And Sean was such a good guy, right he was or is he still is a good guy.

2:54 Tell me a little about Sean. I did reach out to him, but he you know, he's got a lot going on, and so I don't like to pressure people, right, poor little thing, he does work a lot. I couldn't have asked, and I'm telling him that to this day. I couldn't have asked for a better man person for my daughter. You know. They met. Did they meet at the Frearah No, because they didn't work there, right they I think they met online actually, and then they started talking whatever, and then they after a while talking Dayton, so be it. She moved out, moved in with him and his parents, and she was there for I would say probably about a year and a half two years. I know she lived with them for probably about eight months.

3:45 She was looking for work, you know, and then she ended up getting on it Ferrara, So they ended up living together and working together. I think that kind of that's what added to them maybe being together too much and still not having enough time to each other for each other even after everything, and I think that's what kind of led to them breaking up. But Sean just we wanted, I want to be clear that Sean's a good guy and that you know, and then she met this piece of crap and you know the rest of you know, right, So, thoughts about Dakota when you first met him, because you met him just a few days before he murdered your children, like literally the week before, from Saturday to Saturday, like I said, we ran into him Billy Summer and Heaven and christopheran Walmart and maybe in total of maybe ten I'll even say fifteen minutes. To push it, you know, someone was like, hey, this is my friend Dakota. Like I said, Dakota was off, you know, to the side, playing with Heaven and I was playing with the baby and the buggy and we were just kind of standing around talking. He was off to the side and looking at him, you know, with kids these days, you know, he just he just looked grungy, you know. Okay, that's just the stout. Tanner had the wild hair, Dakota had the wald hair.

4:59 Were even joke that Tanner and the Coda resembled each other. We laughed, you know, and then after, like I said, maybe ten, no more than fifteen minutes, we went about our ways. Was he ghetto in the walmart like he was on this interrogation, he is straight ghetto. And even the second time around that Friday evening, which was the night the literally the night before, Yeah, that evening around I don't know, betweenty five and five thirty then came to the house to pick up Tanner. And even with that, even with talking to him, he didn't sound like he did on the interrogation. I was like, what who is that, Yeah, doctor Juckle, mister Hyde, because he did not I mean he literally, you know, introduced himself, reached out his hand, he said, he said, Summer never formally introduced us. I'm Dacode Ontario, and that's what it's nice to media. Summer's mom, Yeah, Honda, you know, and we kind of laughed, you know, and once again went about our business. And so you had also told me too that after the fact, you're their son Hunter who survived because he was not there, Hunter came up to you and said something right about Dakota. So me and Tanner were sitting in the car and Somemer I was fixing the back up and Summer Dakota were coming around the corner of the trailer and I rode down the window.

6:17 I said, what are y'all doing? And then we were coming to get Tanner and I said, well, I was fixing a back up. And some were said, well, I gotta go squeeze the limbon. I said, well, go ahead, I want to go squeeze the lemon. So meaning she had to tea t see exactly, you know, just tell me you gotta go pits. Okay. So she went on in the house. The Coda was outside, and I mean he was walking around. He was smoking a cigarette, you know, and I when you see kids like mouthing to their cell for I thought maybe he had a song in his hand and he was just singing. And Hunter told me he had opened the door because he was like, you know, okay, you know, Summer came in. Where's everybody else at, you know whatever, And he said, Dakota was talking to himself. So I don't I mean, it could have been obviously he probably was looking back and like, okay, maybe he really was talking to himself, you know, But it wasn't like in your face, raw scary type anything, because like I said, me and Tanner were sitting in the car, and I was actually talking to Tanner and messing with him, and the windows were kind of up, so I didn't actually hear him.

7:18 I could just see him lips moving, and he was walking around and he was smoking. So but he kept, you know, pasting back and forth, you know, like he couldn't sit still, all right, And did you think he was under the influence of anything of that time at that time? No, No, because everything just whatever you would call normal, you know, he's normal at that time. I got you, all right, So let's go to the day of the murders. And you told me that you're just bebopping through your day and then you saw it pop up on Facebook and you even shared it, correct, So tell me about that. So I don't remember what all I was doing, but I remember seeing it on TV and looking at it, reading it, you know. Then it of course popped up on my phone and just seeing it, not really paying attention, not paying attention to the trailers and recognizing that, hey that was Billy's trailer, Hey that was Jacob's trailer. Never clicked, never put two and two together, saw it, shared it, and I was like, what's going on? I was like, dang, let me sit in ascension both at the same time. What in the world and at the same time.

8:24 And what's crazy is we didn't even know each other then. And I remember where I was when I first read that. I know exactly where it was. And I thought, my god, two parishes, what is happening? That was mean right? And then you walked outside and what happened? So I went outside and I was walking to the car and truck pulls up and I'm like, who in the world is this? A man and a woman? Get out? I mean, I see the banch on the woman and uh just kind of look and I go, okay, you know, I want to get ready to start walking again. And they said, are you brought a champagne? And I said yes, you know what in the world? Well, you know you got a minute. Can we talk to you? And I said show And I'm like, oh on what you know?

9:05 What did I do? Now? What's going on? And uh, you know, can we go inside? And I said, okay, So we go on inside and we get inside. Oh you know, you want to have a seat, And then the boys at this time, the boys being hunted Darren, Truvor and Coke and they were all home. So they asked, you know who all was real quick, that's Kelvin's boys and my son. Okay, correct, So you know, Kelvin's in his chair. I sit down in mind and then the boys we get them to come in and they're all sitting and that's when the detectives you know, oh, you know, there's been an incident. And my first thought at that time was never my kids or Billy. It was actually my mom because mam might had breast cancer, okay, and Mama wasn't home. I saw. You know, you don't ever think something like that, and it's gonna be your children, right, So you know, there's been an incident, and here I haven't been shot and killed. Yeah, And it was that quick, that quick. Yeah, everybody in the house did what did? Y'all just stare at each other, yes, because it was like, you know, poor total disbelief, you know, And of course I holler and scream for a minute, and then you know, Kelvin grabs me and then I you know, then it's like I stopped for a minute, you know, and of course, you know, Trevor got up and stormed off, and you know, Hunter just completely shut down, you know, I mean, how do you process that? You know, not just your dad, not just your

10:37 brother, not just your sister, but your dad, your brother, and your sister all at one time, you know, and all all of our kids. They were close, they clicked from the beginning, and I think people kind of miss and not taking away from Darren, Trevor and Kobe's pain. Obviously they loved their brother and sister. Hunter got that extra blow though, that it was his dad too. Yes, and that's a lot. I don't know how you. I don't even know how you. I don't know how any of you. I don't even you know what the words are. I just wow. And so you had told me too that right before the police showed up, a woman or a girl had messaged you asking you who Summer's what Summer's boyfriend's name was, And I was like, what, like, who are you? Right? So immediately I text Summer, not knowing and right because she's already deceased, correct, not knowing. So I gave it about maybe about fifteen twenty minutes. Maybe I just assumed she was either at work or getting ready for work. She may have been sleeping.

11:41 So that's when I perceeded outside, and that's when I was met with the detective's correct. So, how long did the detective stay after they broke the news to you? Or were you asking questions and they couldn't answer you? I did, yeah, and of course you know, everything had just happened. So and there's only so much they're gonna tell you, right, they are only going to tell you the basics, you know. Of course I asked, you know, well, where's this, where's that? Who's the you know, where were who and who? You know? And when they asked, who's da coda? I stopped and I'm like, he did it? I just it was like I knew. I was like, when they said, where's the code? I was like, oh, he did it? So so he was your first thought, ish, Yes, I mean of the choices you had, right, you knew Billy didn't kill your kids, and then myself, right, and I knew the kids hadn't done it, right, the babies didn't do it, and the kids didn't kill each other exactly. And I knew Summertainer, you know, I knew Billy Summertown.

12:35 I knew they weren't involved, right, You know, and so they stayed what an hour, I don't even think it was that long. It may have been literally maybe thirty minutes, enough to tell us what had happened, you know, enough to ask about the code, and we kind of you know, went through the steps so to speak, right, and you know, gave me their cards and was it detective that broke it to you or no, it was I know it was detective Lips. And there was the female and I cannot remember her name. Okay, so and lipscumb I believe is in the interrogation with with about aldu until you can see his head, he doesn't really say much. So, so that happens, and then do you start calling people or what? What do you do in that situation?

13:22 It's like all of a sudden, the word got around, you know, and everybody started hitting me out. And then of course, you know, normal react and not normal reaction, I guess, but you know, I'm like, oh my god, you know, I get on Facebook and I'm like, oh my god, it's my baby's you know. Yeah, so then everybody knows because of course I think I was like the last uh family member that found out. Really, so once I found out, then they were able to post names, and that's when everything started hitting the news and was it people started I'm sure bombarding you. Was that? What's that feeling? Like? It's overwhelming, you know, and to just once again, you're still in such a state of shock and awe and you're trying to process, you know, and it's still even four and a half years later, it's still it's th real, but it's not, you know, you still you live one part in your body and one part out. That's the only way that I can explain it. Like I'm half here, like literally yeah, yeah, you know, and you just like your feet keep moving right because they have to almost correct, and I can, you know, literally, if it wouldn't be for God, I don't think I would be here. Yeah, you know, I have other children obviously, you know, not that I would take myself out, but you know, just with the process and having to deal with everything and having to function, I guess, you know, And I can honestly say that, you know, if

14:52 it wasn't for him, I wouldn't be here. Yeah, I would literally. I mean I still grieve every day. I have good days and bad days, good moments and bad moments, But I think I literally would have grieved myself to you dad by now. Yeah, So I have to say this real quick. So when I chose this story because I wanted to tell it because I was just so shocked by it. You know, it's very hard even as a storyteller because it's your story, it's not mine, you know what I mean, And so to it's so different when you have the victim looking at you, and then not only are you the victim, but you're the mother of the victims. That's you don't want to hurt feelings and you don't want to say the wrong things, but I also want people to understand the reality of what you dealt with. And part of that too was those photos, those crime scene photos. And I hope since you're sitting here, you can back me up on this that I asked. I didn't have to ask permission, right, it was public record. But those are your children, and how do you how do you look at someone's children in that state and just I'm going to put them out there. You know. It really changed some things in my mind too about true crime, and when I see it on TV for its entertainment purposes, it really is you know, people are out there, but to me, it's not. This isn't entertainment.

16:07 These are the facts. This is the cold hard truth of what people are living. And when you're looking at someone and you know them, it's such a different feeling when it comes to photos and videos and crime scene, right, And you know, and I love true crime. I watch true crime and ghost stuff, you know, all the time. That's my thing. But you know, you tend to forget that somewhere these were real people and this really happened. This isn't just a story, you know, and stuff like this, you know, happens to other people. Stuff like this doesn't happen to me until it happened to me, and then you're like, oh my god, this happens every exactly, yes, everybody and nobody, if that makes sense, right, right, Because it doesn't matter who you are. You can be famous, you cannot be famous. You can be you know, some small town, you know, whatever, it doesn't matter, and it does happen, and walking past you just so on assuming so you know, there's no red flag hanging off of you that says mother of two murdered children, and that that's not lost on me. And I hope it's not lost on other people. You don't know what people are dealing with, you know, And I try to be kind to people for that reason because you just don't know. You have no idea that people are that seem so happy and doing their thing or suffering, you know, and in this instance because of somebody else. So you do know, Just so everybody knows, you do know that I shared those photos and I had your permission because I wanted them to know that. I'm not just putting them on display.

17:33 I want them to They should get angry, yes, they should when you see that. And so my question, my next question is basically when we when you realized that Dakota had mental illness, which you do agree with that correct that he had something going on or no, I wouldn't agree, But that still doesn't excuse what he did. There we go, that's what only the fact that he does have mental illness, you know. And I'm gonna get on my mental ill this kick for a minute. And it's not to defend him. This is to defend everybody with mental illness that aren't actually out there killing people. But the mental health system sucks and it's failing people all over, you know, And I truly believe that if he would have got the help that he needed, he wouldn't have self medicated. Most people with mental illness or you know, they can't get the mess and they need.

18:26 They feel like nothing's working, they're not getting the help, So what do they do. They self medicate, whether it's drugs or alcohol. What did he do? He turned the drugs, you know, and I think that playing a part. Regardless, I'm not once again excusing me, which right, because he still chose to do what he did. He didn't have to shoot them. He could have held billion gunpoint and said, hey, give me your truck, or he could have shot himself. Well, this is true too, and I'm not trying to be ugly. Take yourself out. You didn't have to hit hurt. He really wanted to do that, which I don't think he really wanted to do that, because when it comes down to it, he could let the cops take him out. But he did everything he was to post to do, right, you know, right, And part of me always wondered, like when they were going after him, you know, okay, is he going to kill umself along the way?

19:07 Are they gonna you know, what is he going to do, you know, and it sounds crazy, but regardless of what he did, I don't wish death on him. And I literally told him that, you know, oh wait, talk you talked, You spoke to him in court. I'm talking about in court. Yeah, I know, I'm jumping the gun. That's okay, Yeah, hey go there. I mean this is the way it is. So so when you saw him in court, you had a chance to speak at the very end. Yes, all right, so this is our impact statement. So he took a plea deal. We can jump forward. That's fine. So he took a plea deal, like I mentioned at the end of the last episode, which I just closed it out like a few minutes before you got here, all right, And I told him that he took a plea deal. He avoided the death penalty. And my my statement in my episode was that in a way it was beneficial to you and as a family, because if not, then we're looking at constant hang up because of his mental illness, right, documented mental problems that he wouldn't have been executed anyway, which is a bit stuck in litigation. And that's the hand they would a fan with all the For the rest of my life, his life, our lives, whatever, and it would have never ended, right, right, So how was that posed to you? So I want people to know as a victim, how was that? How did it come to be? The plea deal? Did they call y'all in? They did? They did, We already you know, with each coortinate and of course everything got pushed back because of COVID, and then he had to be evaluated. First it was by two doctors, then it was by three, and they all had their agree and blah blah blah, you know, and it drove us crazy, but it's the process we had to go through to get to where we needed to be. So they did, you know,

20:40 inform us that that's probably what they were going to be doing. So they did, they you know, kind of talked to us individually, gave us a heads up, and then they let us all come in, me Evelyn Christy, which Evelyn is Billy's mom. Christy is Billy's sister. So we all went in and sat down with the DA and you know, they and this is what we're gonna do. When we said, well, you know already kind of talked about it and we all agreed, you know, for this to be over as long as he can't get out ever, we're good. Let him sit and rot. Okay, good, So, ma'am. So y'all were on board, Yes, and you understood that you kind of had to be on board in this right way. But I think it was the best decision too. And had it been to against one, it still would have been majority roles. So if one of us were to say, no, we want to go to trial. But to go to trial, we had to sit and listen to all that, and to listen to them defend him as to why he did what he did and victim blame right, and you never know right, you know, they could have tried to blame your kids or try to blame whatever. And he claimed that Billy was raping him, and sure, sure, yeah, And here you are the ex wife where you could sit here if you wanted to and bash him. You're the ex wife. I mean hello, and you you've never said an ugly thing to me about Billy, not one time. And I'm telling you, We've had many conversations and to me that spoke, you know, But I mean, I know divorced people they would look for the opportunity to bash their X. Yeah, no. I mean he loved he loved his kids, you know. Yeah, and you know, the whole every other weekend,

22:11 it didn't matter for his weekend, his weekend or not. You know, we always came together and agreed. You know. If he said, hey, I got something going on this weekend, I know it's not my weekend. Can I get up? I never said, oh no, you know, so if they chose to go, And that's just like Tanner and Hunter. That weekend they have some kind of conference at church, and Tanner had talked about going to church, and then that Thursday, I mean I asked Tanner for days up until, you know, and he was going to go to church, and he said, now I'm gonna go. I'm I going to go to dance, you know. And I asked him again that Thursday, and I asked him again that Friday before he actually left, you know, and he said, no, I'm gonna go on and go to Dad does does Hunt in this? We're going all over the place. But it's our interview. We can do what we can do what we want. But Hunter, he chose not to go. How is that? Do you do you mind? Yeah? How was that? Of course? You know survivors guilt, you know. And I've had to tell him from the beginning.

23:11 Had you went, you would be dead too. He would have killed you too. There's nothing any of them could have done to stop it. They didn't get a chance. They didn't have a choice, you know. And of course you know he took out Billy first because Billy was his biggest threat, correct, you know, and conveniently when Billy was just resting looking at a TV, right, so convenient. Tell me that's not planning, you know what I mean, Honestly, I do, sitting back and looking and after hearing stuff that I you know, of course, we didn't know any of the extra details. You know. We had heard about him, you know, being previously married, We heard about him, you know, being in the military. We heard about him, you know, beating the ex wife and stuff like that. But I I mean the actual other details we never heard, you know. And going back to Kim, the ex wife, you know. And I mean I told you that, you know, I wanted because I know you had talked to her. I mean, you had kind of mentioned about her. Because my goal was to not have you feel in any bad way towards her or you know, This is sticky.

24:22 You know, it's hard when there's a lot of players involved. And I didn't want to make anybody upset with anybody else because I was asking questions. And that's why I want to make sure she understands too, that there's nothing she could have done to stopped this. Had she went and picked him mop, he would have killed her too. That could have been here instead of Summer. And I don't I don't wish death on anybody. I wouldn't have wished that on her or her family or anything. You know, it could have went the other way, right, you know, So you do think he was a ticking time bomb regardless, Yes, and your kids just paid the price, I think, yeah. Wow, definitely. Do you have any anger towards his parents? No, because I mean none of us are perfect. Yes, you know there were probably some issues there with the family function, you know, however you want to call it, you know, but I mean they didn't do it right. I mean, I understand he had issues, you know, and maybe they could have done something when he was younger, but who's to say you know that that would have helped.

25:22 And then once your children reach a certain age, you know, you can't make them once they reach eighteen. You can't make them take their medicine. You can't make them go to therapy, you can't make them do this, can't make them do So who's to say if he wouldn't got the help, that he would have did what he needed to do anyway, you know, has anyone in his family reached out to your family? I don't know if there's anyone to reach out. I mean, we'd heard he had a one brother. We didn't know about the rest of the brothers. I just found that through records, so I don't you know there were supposedly three other siblings. And see that's more than we knew. And we heard we heard he had one and something about the military. That's all we'd heard. Right. Would you want to speak to anyone in his family? Is it kind of irrelevant at this point they did, you know, I mean outside of talking, just let them know luck, you know, I mean, if they feel like they're to blame, hey, you're not to blame. You can't control what another grown person does, because it balls down to he made that decision regardless, you know, and obviously it was something he wanted to do.

26:21 For him to do what he did to Billy Summer and tender and then drive all the way well, and he stole the gun first, So that tells me you planned that, you had something up your sleeve from the beginning, right, Yeah, you plan that, And to the very people that open their home to you, I just cannot. So I read in a report. I did not actually speak on this during my recordings, so only my patron members are going to really hear this. But there was a reck a report in there that Casey, the wife of Billy, knew that Dakota had the gun because she saw him with it and then he put his fingers up over his mouth like sh and according to her report, she told him, don't get the gun back out right, What did you know? The story to us that was, of course, you know, and it's all he said, she said, And you never know what's what? You know?

27:15 You're just hearing because da is only telling us so much because they can't tell us anything because we're in the middle of, you know, trial. They didn't want him getting away on their technicality, they didn't want anything getting out. So we had heard that it was actually Heaven that saw it and he told to Heaven, don't tell anyone. That's what we were told, so didn't know that that was Casey. We thought it was heaven. And then talking to my ex sister in law, Jonathan's wife, which Jonathan's Billy's brother, you know, it come to be that she was told through a coworker of Billings that Billy had found out about the gun m h. And when he found out, he was livid. So he I think in his mind he was trying to protect his family or he knew something might happen.

28:08 They were off that Monday because it was Martin Luther King. He went to work that Tuesday. That's when he pitched a fit and was talking about Dakoda and the gun. He stayed home that Wednesday and Thursday, and they were always off on Fridays and then on Saturday morning they were killed. So yeah, I agree. I mean I never met Billy a day in my life, but just knowing what I know about him, I think he was trying to be diplomatic about it, but you got to go. Yeah, right, And we heard that he spoke to Jonathan, his brother, and was like, I need help. He did. He called Jonathan and he said, you know, I don't know what's going on with Dakota, and he's winking out something's wrong with him. You know, he's going from talking and laughing to crying to just sitting there. You know. He was like he's all over the place, you know. And Johnthan's like, you need to get him out of your house now. Yeah. And Casey's cousin called me that Saturday when he found out about Billy and the kids. He called me on Facebook and he was so he was so upset. He loved Billy and the kids. He loved my kids. And he said, Billy just in his living room days before told him that Dakota had till Saturday to get out, and so he finally was like, you're getting out. And I think that's which happened makes sense right of why they were both up early on a Saturday, and why Billy was dressed right and like his even had his work looked like his workds. Yeah, he lived in those I wonder if it had gotten down to the nutcutting of him saying all right, let's get your stuff, you gotta go, and he said nope, And won't never know

29:41 what really happened and how it all happened. If you know what was said was said because you know we heard that. You know, it was said that everything was normal that morning, And I'm just trying to think, how can you go from everything was normal so you just decide, Okay, this is what I'm gonna do, and you just go shoot everybody. So I think he might have just he might he planned it and he just figured, Okay, I'm just gonna play it cool and I'm just gonna, you know, time it out, and this is what I'm doing, right, And then drove to kill the parents, and then to grandma's house, I supposedly just to go say he loved her, right, I'm sure right, And that makes me wonder if he was actually gonna kill the grandmother too. I mean, that's always been in our mind. I think he was here the gun in his hand when he pulled up, right, I think he would have told her the same thing he did his mom. Oh, I love you, you know right. It's insane. Yeah, that's insane. Absolutely So. Do you ever wonder why your kids didn't make it and the other two did or do you think it just is what it is? That they were young? Yeah, I mean, and that boils down to you know, once again, and this is just me and the way I feel, but I don't. I wouldn't have wished death on them babies either, right, you know. And for him to say, oh, they were too young to know any different, Okay, So you're just gonna go randomly shooed adult people just because you think they know better. Yeah, you know, no, and you're not that crazy if you can figure that out, right, if you know the difference ontween and once again that I'm not saying, oh, you should have killed the babies too, No, but once again,

31:15 you could have chose to do something differently, right, And I'm still going to go back to that you could have killed yourself. I know it sounds ugly, but if it's that, if you're that, yeah, take yourself out, and like why you got to go hurt other people? And it's some people too. So let me talk about this too, because I had people ask me this, you know, and I know the answer partially, but I want to get you to expand on this. So you had to plan two funerals and you also cared about Billy, right, and so how did that? How does that work? What was the plan? So you know you never plan to burying one child much less, too much less at the same time. So I actually had a woman, a friend of mine that I've known for quite a few years, and she asked me, could she prean to go fund me? And I was like, if that's what you want to do, that's fine. And of course this was nationwide news, like you said, CNN, and and for me to see it, I'm seeing in I was like, oh my god, you know, this is big harness. Once again, the one of the hardest things I've ever had to do. And Casey had talked about having billis services in Gonzales, which is a parish that kind of neighbors the parish we're in, right and that's you know, that's where he worked and that's where most of his friends were. So I'm assuming that's why she would have chose there. But I asked her, for the sake of honor the son, your son,

32:51 if we could put them together, you know, and just do one big one and you know, everybody could come whatever. How old was Haunter. So Hunter was sixteen at the time. So this sixteen year old boy has to walk into a funeral home with a brother, a sister, and a father. I mean not to take away from you as the mother. I'm just my god, he's a kid. Literally did he how did he do? So? He kept it together? Oh wait real quick? So she did not go to Gonzales and Green? Yeah, when he sat down and for two weeks, you know, we went back and forth to the funeral home. You know, got with Cat about the flowers and you know, arrangements and everything and how we were doing everything. And you know I had billion the middle summer on one signed teneral the other, you know, and we had everything and we did all one service. Well, I mean, I know you probably cannot put into him, you can't quantify it, but what what is the thought when it was too much? When you walk in that you just can't process it. You you just you shut off. It's like everything was like almost everything just like a robot. And I'm still once again like that to this day, like part of us here, part of use, you know, out of body. It's almost like it's somebody else.

34:17 And everything was just like you're on autopilot, you know literally, And so so y'all had the services? Did y'all have to Someone asked me this, it's probably very horrible. I'm about to ask this, but someone had asked me were they able to have open They did, and I thank God for that because I mean, just keeping it real. Had he used any other gun, had he used a bigger gun because of working something right, we would not have had an open casket, got it. So y'all got to say, you guys, yes, I was able to look at my children one lifetime right. And so you had told me too in another we were talking and you said her jewelry choice. Yes, you know, I buried my children like they lived, and you know I wanted them to be remembered how they lived. And so somemmer always had. Uh. My sister in law, my brother's wife, had given they had given her a ring I think for her birthday or for Christmas was her birth home, so I made sure she had that on Sean had given her a ring, which Saun was that ex boyfriend at the time they were together. He had gotten her, but not an engagement ring, just like just a just a ring.

35:38 He had given her a ring. And then she had a necklace that she always wore. And I he may have given her the necklace too, I just know she always wore. So when I got her stuff from her dad's house. I went through her jewelry and picked out what I knew she always wore, and I made sure that she had it. And then, you know, poor Tanner he found out literally a month before that he had to have glasses. And I'm smiling in the video if you're watching right now, because this little turkey, this little boy, I'm telling you, Tanner, just I love that boy. He so literally you know, it would have been a month Monday. He was actually due front an I check up the Monday, but they were killed on the Saturday, so I had to call Monday morning and tell them he wasn't gonna make his eye appointment because he was deceased. But when he got them glasses, they were only reading glasses.

36:31 He only needed them for class to read or to see. But when I'm telling you, he wore them twenty four to seven except to take a shower and go to bed. That was it. You said you couldn't tell me he thought he looked good day Bay when he thought he was buddy, Holly, you I'm telling you. In fact, the lion's picture that I took of him was at the dentist office. We were waiting. I think on on Hounter maybe r Hounter and Dan one of them. And Tanner was wearing his glasses. Is that the picture of him laid back? You had sent me a picture he's in a chair. No. Yeah, yeah, he's sitting chair with the blue hoodie on and he's got his glasses on. I'm look, I'm gonna go find it. I'll post it in my Patriots so people can see it. But that was that was the actual last picture and that I took. But he just thought he was hot stuff within glass and he thought he was the coolest thing. Well he was. He was looking good with them glasses on, he thought he was. And the hair too, he has the hair going on. But yeah, So do you have you joined any type of groups or anything. I have not. I've actually talked to why I had talked to you with one of the groups I think you had sent me. Yes. So my so my mother in law, she's deceased now, but she my he would have been my brother in law.

37:53 So my husband's brother was killed and one of our mutual friends his brother was and so they had a group they went to called Compassionate Friends, where it was mothers basically of children that had been killed, and I had mentioned that to you, if you you know, I haven't actually joined. It's something that I've thought about and you know, and I'm gonna get on my You can call it by Jesus kick if you want to. It's just the way I feel. It's the way I cope, you know. And I once again, if I didn't believe what I believe, I wouldn't be here. But God does. Yeah, you know, God's real. The Devil's real. But I believe that God turns strategy, tragedy into triumph. And I think certain things happened for a reason, and I think what has happened and for me, because this is what I feel, that that it's for me to go and help other people, other parents who have lost their children, to say, hey, you know, we can get through this.

38:54 You can do it. Hey, an ounce of prevention too is worth a lot. And so I know when I go to about right now. But you and I have spoken on some things that we might work on together to try to help other people in the future, you know, And that's something too. You know, you never can you never can measure, You never can measure if you've saved somebody's life, because it never happened, you know what I mean, And so you got to believe just because you don't see numbers doesn't mean that what you're sharing right now might not be helping another parent who you know has had to our will and sadly one day have to deal with it. And even if this leads to hopefully something with more mental health, you know, yeah, because obviously I would like to think that if maybe things were different, my children would still be here. So there's some form of you know, reform for mental health or something you know, yeah, that can help future. Right, And this happened once, This won't happen again, and it'll be somebody else and somebody else's children, right, somebody else you know will kill their parents, or their parents might kill the child or whatever, you know, right, And so something's got to be done. We've got to figure something out. And is it a mix of the criminal justice system and mental health laws or how do we do it?

40:07 But we know that we need it, and I think most people would agree, yeah, you know which or something like this, Yeah, because this is beyond and then it doesn't just happen in the beity. It happens in small Towns in Country Bumpkin, Denim Springs, USA. Right, I'm like, what's going on in Walker? You know? Walker? Really? But yeah, it happens so and I guess i'll kind of was there anything you wanted to add before I go on my last question that maybe you wanted to all right, So my last question is forgiveness. And let me say this though I am not sitting here saying I would be able to forgive anybody, because I don't think I would. I'm not big enough. I just don't. Has forgiveness crossed your mind at all? Or is it so? And this was all part of my victim impact statement, you know, because going to court all them times before, you know, he was just sitting there like a bump on a log like he was, you know, he wouldn't look and he just looked like, you know whatever, like he could care less. And I don't know maybe if it was because of the medication or because of he was actually facing life that he actually looked at us, and I was able to look at him, you know, and I told him I forgive you. I have to forgive him, you know. If if I say I believe in God and my children are in Heaven. If I want to get there, you know, I have to forgive him. You know, who wouldn't want to see their children again, you know, So

41:37 for me, I have to forgive me. And I know that I don't have to, I mean, but that's the process. And I'm okay with forgiving him. I forgave him, and I'm good, you know. And I literally looked at him, you know, and I told him, my eye feel sorry for you. And I know that sounds crazy, but I mean, you know, you felt that you had to kill everybody. You had to kill your parents because you had nothing else. You know, you couldn't do anything else, you know, and I don't know. You know, we all make choices. And like I told him, you know, Summer will never get married, Tanner will never graduate high school. Tenner will never get married, they'll never have grandchildren. You know, they never got to buy their first car. Tanner never got to get a driver's license.

42:24 You know, all those Truvor just got married last year, and my children should have been there, right, you know, Tanna and Trevor were close. You know, Tanner probably would have even been one of his best men, but he didn't get that chance. You know, and like I told the cod and you know you've thrown your life away too. You're gonna sit and rod. You won't get no first whatever, You get nothing after this. So you know, not only did I lose my children lost, their dad lost, but you know he's lost two. But he did it to hisself and he did it to everybody else. A thousand chances to make different decisions of a billion, thousand different times and didn't do it. So that's a lesson right there too. If you don't change your ways, you get what you get what you give. Yeah, well, I wanted to tell you thank you for coming in and talking to me about your most prized possessions.

43:17 You know, your children, I think, and to open up to share, to allow me to say their story. I just appreciate that, you know, because you didn't have to do that, and I appreciate it as a parent. You know, whose children are no longer here. You want their story told. You want them to be remembered, And I don't want them to be remembered how they died. I want them to be remembered how they lived. You know, goofy, silly funny, you know loving. I mean, you've seen the pictures in the videos, and Summer was older, so she had moved out, so I didn't have a lot of the videos of her cutting and making silly faces. You know, I have a few, you know, but she was the same, she was the thing. Well, we love them. I love them. I'm telling you, I've never been of a day in my life, but that Tanner just tickles me. I just cannot even. And then, sweet sweet Summer, you know, well, thank you so so much. And if you ever need anything, you know, we're friends for life now and Patroon members.

44:24 If there's any questions you have, you're welcome to reach out. Let me, let me know and we'll ask him, we'll answer. Will you have a great weekend and until next time, take care, Bye Bye. Warning unspeakable as intended for mature audiences. If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl. Listening discretion is advised.