Part 2 | Hostile Divorce: The Case of Kayla Giles

0:06 Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real victims whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real? I use my experiences in law enforcement corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal justice educator, dig deep into complex cases of evil acts, some so evil many feel they are unspeakable. Warning, Unspeakable as intended for mature audiences. If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl. Listening discretion is advised. Hey Y'ALLKJ You're back with part two of this next episode. This will be the conclusion episode. I do want to start out by telling you that while I am going to conclude the episode this time, there is actually going to be a bonus one as well, because there are follow ups and additions to this case that I think you might find interesting, and I know I certainly did, so my Patreon members, be on the lookout for that bonus episode that will be dropping sooner or later for you to get the follow up on this. You won't want to miss very very interesting and current as of today, so you'll want to know that before I get started, though, I also want to tell you that I've got tons of shout outs that I have to give. Obviously, I don't want to spend thirty minutes doing that, so I

1:37 just do a few at a time each episode, so I know people are excited for those shout outs. I promise I'm going to get to you. Just please give me a little bit of time because whenever you join, I don't record that exact day, and so it may be a little bit before you hear your shout out, but I will get to you. Also, if I miss one by some chance, always reach out to me, because I certainly wouldn't miss you on purpose, and so just bring it to my attention and I'll make sure I handle it. I'm gonna start this time though, right in San Antonio, Texas, where I've got Miss Ronda George. She is a new member of the crime family. And you know I love my Texas peeps. I got family there, and I've got a ton of listeners there that I have to say hello to. So Miss Ronda Hello. I'm gonna then move over to Arlington, Texas, and we're gonna say hello to Miss Mandy Ramirez. Hello, Mandy, thank you so much as well. And then let's see, we've got even Plannersville, Texas here. Jessica, Columbus girl, I missed you somehow.

2:32 I realize the error of my ways. Please accept my formal apology, and I'm saying hello to you. I'm waving in the camera. When I make a promise, I follow through, and so Jessica, please accept my hello and my thank you so much for joining and supporting me. Then we're gonna jump right here into Louisiana, and right here in Port Barry, I've got Molly Joe. Well, hello, Molly Joe. What's going on with you? I hope things are well? And then we can jump all the way to Virginia, where I've got Ashley Snyder. I have never heard of Newport News, Virginia. That's a first for me. So I'm gonna have to look that up and see where you are and what all goes on there. But Ashley, again, so stoked to have you as well. Now tons more shout outs coming, Stay tuned. I will get to you and again message me if you think I may have missed you, No problem there, all right, So quick recap from part one of the Kayla and Thomas Coutis saga and they were as a quick backup story here, they were in the middle of a contentious divorce, and if you haven't listened to the first episode, this is your chance to stop go back and listen to it before I do a whole bunch of spoilers right now. Ready, three two one, Okay. So they were in the middle of the contentious divorce and Kayla ends up shooting him in the Walmart parking lot after she says that he jumped at her and voicing instances of past abuse which made her very, very afraid of him and she feared for her life. Now, police reports had been fun but only by Thomas, and he had claimed in some occasions

4:04 that she had slapped him and that she had become violent in different situations. Their child was interviewed, the oldest one by there, I just mean Kayla's daughter biologically, Thomas was just the stepfather, but their oldest in that situation was interviewed and she stated that Thomas did jump at her mom before she heard that loud boom of the gunshot. And Kayla then explained that she was basically a battered woman and that she feared for her life and that's why she reacted and did the things that she did. So police arrested Kayla, but they continued to investigate exactly what happened and why, because they needed more than just okay, you shot him and this could have gone really either way.

4:51 Once she starts bringing up the battered woman situation. Now, the fact they arrested her, that implies that they think that there was something more nefarious to this, but they still to do their due diligence and continue to investigate. So after that quick recap, let's jump back into what police found in those prior reports that were filed by Thomas against Kayla. So while the police reports, you know, were made, I do want to say that people do lie in police reports. That there's no doubt about that. People do lie, and so the police have to kind of mitigate what they're being told, and they're going to want to try to write the report based in some type of evidentiary you know, value to what they're writing.

5:36 So people are going to often give what I'll call their version of events, which can be somewhat biased. Okay, but that said and acknowledging that that does happen, I can vouch for Thomas that he was likely slapped because he not only filed a police report on this incident that I'm talking about, but he also had photos of his face which were submitted to the officer who was writing the report. Now, this photo showed his face. There was a red mark right on his jawline, and it was right below his ear. So if you can kind of picture a hand slapping across the bottom of your jaw. Now, someone's probably gonna ask me, well, why was a photo given to the cop. Why didn't the officer just look at his face and write based on that great question. Well, the answer I found to that, because I wondered too, was that there was a one week delay in Thomas filing the report. I have a guess about why that was. Again, I have no proof of this, but I think I have an educated guess. I think that Thomas was documenting everything as he had been advised for court purposes. But I think whenever he spoke with his attorney and said, look, this is what happened and I took pictures, I'm thinking that attorney then said, look, you've got to file an official police report on this. This is a battery and it needs to be on floor normal record. So it's not just he said, she said, once we get into court, there's no law that it says that you have to

7:08 make the police report the instant that something happens like this. So there's nothing wrong with that, is what I want to make clear. Now. It took place in May of twenty eighteen in a tattoo shop parking lot during a custody exchange, but Thomas told the cop when he arrived to write that report, look, I don't want to press charges. I just want to make sure that this is documented whatever. Okay, I need it for court, but I'm not interested in her going to jail. And the decent side of me thinks that Thomas did this out of love for those children, and that if she went to jail, then these three children don't have the other half, you know, that would be taking care of them. So again those are my guesses, but I think that a prudent person would probably agree with that information. Now, Kayla would also have her own plaints against Thomas. During a following court proceeding that they went to, she told the courts, look, he jumped at me in prior incidences, and this is before the shooting ever took place. By the way this is something else that he jumped at me and that he scares me, and whether this jump was intended to intimidate her, or whether she's saying he jumped at her like to pusher or something that isn't one hundred percent clear to me, but it sounds at minimum like she's trying to describe that he was what I would call peacocking, so basically fluffing up, making himself big when he got mad, and

8:39 something along those lines. Needless to say, based on this alone, things are not going very well between the couple and it was just becoming increasingly problematic. However, this is where text messages become super insightful. Because after that slapping incident that Thomas claimed happened, and he even filed a police report, Kayla had texted her friend not the week after, whenever Thomas made the report. I'm talking about when it happened, and that's when she texted her friend that she quote knocked the shit out of Thomas and it felt good end quote. And that's what we call a clue, y'all.

9:20 That's why I stand on business when I say that I do believe that she hit him. Why there was photo evidence, he fought a report and then she says it with her own mouth, and then it felt good. And this is also one of those times where I want to take a second here, and I think it's so important that we reflect on male domestic violence. And what I mean is specifically domestic violence against a male. Okay, true talk, real story, just getting down to the nutcutting. If a woman slaps a man in the face, and I need you to hang with me here for a second with what I'm about to say. But if a woman slaps a man in the face, he's supposed to take that on the chin. He is. And what I mean is, I know right now you're going wow, whoa, whoa. Wait, Mike Kelly, No, no man should should be slapped in the face. You're right, No man should ever be slapped in the face or hit or punched or anything for that matter. But what I'm talking about is socially okay, because when she hauls off and slaps him across the face, what is he supposed to do? What is he supposed to do? Because the second that a man slaps a woman, he's cooked, he's done. He's going to jail, do you He is going to jail. But when this small woman slaps a man, society does. And I know you might be arguing with me right now, but you better really do some soul searching because society expects him to basically just turn the other cheek. I'm not saying it's right, but I'm telling you it's true. Men don't hit women.

10:50 They don't. They shouldn't, but women shouldn't hit men either, but they do. And social standards alone, until recent years, have almost laughed at men whenever they say that a woman abuses them. Think about that, Oh, a woman abused you, because what happens here is that it starts involving the man card. Okay, because I want to point this out. Studies show that there are higher victimization rates for males than females starting in high school. And my guess here is that guys are convinced that if they say something, oh, the girl pushed me, Oh the girl slap me, then in some way they're not manly if they're gonna complain a girl, Oh you were hit by a girl, You were beat up by a girl. Think about that. We grow up with that. And so I have seen personally, I have seen female students slap male students in high school, and those girls do it because they know deep down in their soul that men that are boys that are raised right, they're not gonna slap those girls back. They're not gonna push those girls back. They can't or they lose their man card. Okay, so I'm all about protecting women, but I'm also going to say this that mama's of high school boys, you'll better have that talk. Trust me when I'm telling you this, because if a girl hits you, you must handle it by telling an adult, because she won't stop when she realizes she can get away with it,

12:23 and she's going to continue and continue until you explode, until the guy explodes, and then the guy gets labeled the abusive guy. It happens over and over again. I've seen it way too many times. And this is part of the issue I see right now in this case, because then these boys grow up to become men still raised on those values of we don't hit women, which is right and it's just and it's good. However, these men marry women who if those women continue to slap them or push them when they get mad, will the daughters that are born guess what they see the young girls see that their mom is slapping or throwing things or whatever, and then those young girls are bound to repeat that same behavior, and the guy who responds in a physical way is going to be deemed an abuser.

13:13 Women are more likely to perpetrate violence and then claim self defense than men ever will be. You can research that yourself. Men are not going to say self defense because it makes them look like a sissy and men want to be men, and the reason, y'all, it's just so clear masculine men would have to admit or imply that they were vulnerable if they were to claim self defense. And simply put, no man wants to say that girl almost beat me up or that girl tried to beat me up. Really think about that in way that it matters in this society. It matters. So while this isn't one hundred percent accurate in all cases, I'm telling you Thomas was a masculine guy, and he was larger than Kayla, he trained in mma. What kind of sissy would he have looked like if he were to claim that he was being abused by a tiny little woman. How do you think people that didn't know them would view that, or people they did know him, but didn't know what went on behind closed doors. Possibly, Okay, a thought to ponder, And this obviously was a distressing situation for her because she's saying I fear him, and you know, this is now at an all time high level and all this kind of stuff. So the next question, or the next thing I'd like to bring up, is that Kayla in August went to a hearing and told the court that she was now even more afraid of Thomas because he

14:44 brought a gun to one of the exchanges of their daughter. This was escalating that stress again for her. I mean, it's sky high according to her and what she said in the in the courts. So why would Thomas need to bring a gun to exchange their child in a custody turnover? Sure they fought, okay, but a gun seemed over the top and scary considering why they were meeting up in the first place, which is a child. So safety concerns were now paramount if that was even true. Again, I wasn't there. I'm just recounting the accusations that were made in court at those hearings. I can say this, Thomas's mom is Kathy. She did acknowledge that she knew Thomas to carry a weapon, and Kayla's sister also said that she saw Thomas with a gun when he picked up their daughter on a prior occasion. So I'm just telling you what I found in my research. So for this, I'm inclined to think that Thomas probably was the type of guy who always carried her weapon or was common to carry a weapon. I don't seem to get the gist of that he just brought a gun to intimidate Kayla at custody exchanges. But again, that's a personal opinion met Thomas, so I can't I can't say that for sure.

16:03 But based on the accusations that were flying and the factoring in of this history between the two of them getting physical, the Ninth Judicial District did issue a mutual protective order against them both. That means both of them were seen to be problematic in the eyes of the court, and the accusations that were flying back and forth, so many people reach out to me. I can't tell you how many people have reached out to me with questions about protective orders. And while I'm not a lawyer, people sometimes miss that I'm not a lawyer. And I'm not giving legal advice. I can tell you a few things real quick about protective orders. Protective order, restraining order, injunction against abuse, peace bond, criminal order of protection. All of those are terms used in general to refer to these court orders that require one person to stay away from the other person. And the intention of these orders is to prevent abuse and to enhance the safety of the person who is seeking the court's protection. Well, when they are both ordered to stay away from each other, obviously the courts feel like they are both contributors to the abusive or inappropriate behavior in some fashion. Now, right now, I am not standing here and saying Thomas abused Kayla, and I'm not saying Kayla abuse Thomas. I'm saying the courts felt that there was the potential for something to escalate.

17:31 That's why they issued it in both directions. Now, these orders are not just the blanket piece of paper that are filled out. They can come with additional factors outside of just be nice and stay away from each other. But those situations are specific to that case and they're not blanket factors. They have to be specifically stated by the judge or ordered by the judge Another fun fact about protective orders. A protected person cannot violate their issued order of protection. Not meaning like the rules. I'm saying, it's not possible and they can't get in trouble. What do I mean? This is so important? Okay? If I say that Jim is harassing me and he's abusing me and blah blah blah blah blah, the courts may issue a protective order telling Jim to stay away from me. Okay, and he gets served and everything the cops tell him about it. However, Jim and I decide to let bygones be bygones, and we're gonna We're just gonna make up with all of our problems. And then the following week, I invite Jim to come over and hey, let's do a podcast together. If he comes over, even though I've invited him over, if he comes over and then we start arguing for some reason, I can call the police and Jim is going to jail. He is going to jail for violating that protective ordered issued by that judge, even if I invited him over. People for some reason

19:06 don't seem to understand this. You've got to know this information. If a protective order is ever placed against you, you have to follow it until it's dropped, even if you and the person kiss and make up. So here we are with orders for the two to stay away from each other obviously minus this custody exchange, and the bickering is just insane between the two. The order likely said something of the nature of allowing brief and peaceful contact during child custody exchanges or something like that. So other than that, leave each other alone. Well. On September seventh of twenty eighteen, Kayla was served papers letting her know that there was going to be another hearing about custody and that she would need to be in attendance of that court hearing. It just seemed like nothing was ever over.

19:56 There was always another court hearing, always more money to dole out to pay a lawyer. And matter of fact, in that hearing that new one that was coming up, Thomas was now going to be asking Kayla for a reimbursement of money from something that Kayla he said owed him, as well as claims that Kyla should be held in contempt of court for her behavior and her actions since the last court order. So as you can tell, this was just an extremely exhausting situation on both ends. Regardless, the very next day after she was served those papers, that's when that custody exchange took place. Thomas was shot and now he's dead. And there's a reason that I took the time to explain protective orders to you, because if you paid attention, or if you are familiar with protective orders, right now, there is a very very glaring issue at hand, and if you haven't picked up on it yet, it's because you aren't familiar with protective orders.

21:00 And that's a good thing. Okay, It's not a small thing, y'all. This is huge when you are served with a protective order. Part of that order, which is state law, specifically revised Statute forty six Colon two Pet. Three six point three in Louisiana, it explicitly states that you cannot and shall not own or possess a firearm if you have been considered by the courts to be a valid and viable threat to the other person's safety. That's that's like common, that's the way it is. Now. This in and of itself, starts begging the question, why did Kayla even have a gun at the custody exchange? Because guess what, when she's served these orders of protection, it's explicitly stated. When you are served, it is signed off one, it's initialed. You know that you're not supposed to have a gun. Now, I'm also not a hypocrite, and I know you've heard me say a million times that a protective order is just a piece of paper and it won't protect you.

22:09 So if Thomas had been abusing Kayla, this still stands true. But understand this, she was the person served in this instance, as was Thomas, so that means they both cannot have firearms. So, during the initial investigation prior to Kayla being arrested, she was directly asked by the investigator if or when she purchased the gun that was used to shoot Thomas, and her answer was that she didn't know offhand when she bought it. All right, cool, y'all. I have the memory of a goldfish. As soon as I bump into the glass, I forget something. Everyone who knows me knows that. Okay, for some reason I can remember. I can remember true crime facts meant little ones. I can remember true crime forever.

23:00 But for some reason, just basic things like when I bought something, I probably couldn't nail it down either, So I'm not holding that against her, But in this exact moment, you do have to wonder what was Kayla's memory like, because when it was researched and documented, Kayla had bought the gun just twelve days before the shooting. Twelve day you can't remember twelve days before the shooting. Okay, well, not quite buying that. But she also went and bought the gun in Dallas, Texas. She did not buy the gun in Louisiana. So around August twenty eighth, that's when she buys the gun. Mind you, the order of protection had already been signed by the courts, so she knew better.

23:48 She would have known better, So she did this in direct violation of that protective order. On September seventh, she was served paperwork, but that was of the upcoming court hearing. She already had the protective order. The very next day after she was served that court hearing paperwork is when she shot and killed him. So why was it bought in Texas? That became the next question, why not Louisiana. You live in Louisiana, So detectives were curious too. Well, it wasn't quite necessarily as nefarious as it seems, because Kayla had retained her residency in Texas, so to purchase a handgun she had to do so there, which she did during a visit back home, she said again, just twelve days before she actually shot it. She also purchased in that timeframe a self defense insurance policy through USCCA, which this will come into play here shortly, but not quite yet. I just want you to hold onto that information because she bought both of the gun and the policy at the same time. So we all know this, or we should. By now, all jail records or jail calls are recorded. Okay, I would think everyone knows that by now, but alas here we are. So Cayla has been arrested, she's in jail, and during one of her jail calls, she she was being housed at the Rapids Parish Detention Center. She made a call to her sister and they began discussing things like where her kids were going to be staying, and did she have an attorney yet,

25:20 things along those lines, And as the call continued, cayleb started referring to something as the flowered thing. The flowered thing, So what was this? Flowered thing that they were discussing because detectives certainly wanted to know, because she seemed very adamant about this flowered thing being located. Specifically in those conversations, her sister wanted to give the quote unquote flowered thing to somebody else, and Kayla replied, no, hear me out. Kayla goes, look, nobody's looking for it. And since nobody's looking for it right now, that means it doesn't exist exist.

26:01 So upon that statement of Kayla going, look, it doesn't exist, don't do anything with it, her sister became worrisome in tone, and she's kind of like, well, wait a minute, I don't want to get myself in trouble or anything of that nature. So Kayla goes, okay, okay, okay, fine, give it to Jennifer. Give it to Jennifer. So who is Jennifer? What is this flowered thing? The whole conversation was kind of odd. Well, Jennifer would be determined to be a friend that Kayla had had since childhood and the two were close even now into adulthood. Now, Jennifer lived in Washital Parish, which is North Louisiana, the Monroe area, which by the way, shout out to my grandfather because he held the longest rushing yard record in Washittal Parish for a very long time. All right now, Kayla's sister then later advised her that Jennifer was going to meet her in Natchet and that's where they were going to do this exchange. So obviously detectives now wanted to have a word with these two women, and they followed up immediately after.

27:09 They listened to these jail calls, so detectives would question Jennifer, who at first would kind of play the role of not really knowing much, but after she was able to secure an attorney, she eventually opened up about like the whole truth in detail. I do want to say this, I don't blame Jennifer for this at all. I'm sure she was nervous. I'm sure she didn't want to get caught up in something and she was starting to feel like something wasn't right here, so she got an attorney and bringing one in that does not make her guilty of anything by any means. I think it was just self preservation in that moment. Jennifer was a trusting person. She specifically was trusting in her friend and she was believing everything that she was being told. But now at this point she seemed to understand that something was possibly a miss and that she needed to be completely forthcoming, and she knew she did, but she's still wanted to have an attorney present in case things kind of went sideways. Well, following both interviews of Jennifer and Kayla's sisters, detectives were able to identify what the quote unquote flowered thing was.

28:13 And y'all, it actually had a very very common name, something that I would have expected it to be called by other than the flowered thing, unless you're trying to keep a secret, of course, because the flowered thing was identified as a bag with flowers on it that held her laptop. So why wouldn't you just say laptop or the bag with my laptop in it instead of just saying the flowered thing. Well, Kayla obviously owned that laptop, However, she was not in direct possession of it because she had given it to her sister roughly two weeks before the shooting ever took place. So why was she being so covert about it? Really? Why did she give it to her sister? And was it possible that it may hold something very damning inside. Of course, these are the questions we have. Well, the way that things had unfolded, Kayla's sister, Jessica met up with Kayla's friend Jennifer in Georgetown the day after Kayla was arrested for shooting Thomas. Now, the reason that they were meeting up was because she was going to take care of Kayla's dogs since Kayla was now in jail. Well, during that meeting, Jessica gave the flowered laptop bag to Jennifer, but she was adamant that she did not know she was going to be picking up the laptop. She only thought that she was picking up the dogs. But when they got there, she

29:44 got the dogs and she got the bag with the laptop in it. Only after speaking later with Kayla was she given these instructions to use the laptop to check on things like her emails and other like personal business. But I will state this, they were never directed to destroy or delete anything on that laptop. The women, neither Kayla's sister nor Kayla's friend Jennifer ever did anything like deleting or throwing away or whatever. None of that happened. They just checked general things for her, so she was then contacted. Jennifer was contacted by the Washitaw Sheriff's office and she voluntarily gave over the laptop upon request. She didn't hold out or try to hide it or anything.

30:30 So investigators were able to secure a warrant and they began searching all of Kayla's electronics and this would include her search history obviously, because they wanted to see what could they find in there. They also wanted to say, hey, is there something interesting in there that might lend itself to back up Kayla on what she was saying from kind of a behind the scenes look that things that weren't put in front and on display for everybody to see it might justify the shooting. Well, Kayla was obviously attempting to hide the laptop in some fashion and so because of that, they slapped an additional charge on her of obstruction of justice for that attempted concealment of the laptop.

31:12 So it would have to do their thing in seeing what if anything was on the laptop that Kayla may not want anybody to know. In the meantime, an autopsy was completed on Thomas and this was done by doctor Christopher Tape. He was the forensic pathologist who did this, and he did recover as you can imagine, one single bullet from Thomas's chest. The bullet was center mass, that means bullseye, you know, right in the center of his chest, and it was definitely a kill shot. There was not much chance of survival with where this bullet was located. So either Kayla had incredible luck in her rushed removal of the gun from her door pocket, or she had it much sooner with more time to aim to be able to make such a good shot. Another finding was that there was stippling around the wound, and stippling is going to be basically burned gunpowder from the gunshot, because the gun was close enough to his skin that it hit his skin as the powder was still burning off of the shot. Now, typically if a shooting happens more than two to three feet away from the subject that's struck, stippling won't be found. So that tells you this was a very very close shot, very close. He also had abrasions Thomas did. He had abrasions on his face, but how he got those abrasions wasn't clear. Maybe it was

32:43 from the fall, or maybe something happened you know, whenever he was closer to Kayla's car, but flat out there was no way to determine how he got these abrasions, but I do want you to know that they were there well. As the data from Kayla's electronic was recovered, this is where things became even more interesting and timelines will matter, at least they do to me. So I'm going to try to organize this for you so it's not all over the place. Search history in relation to a shooting may be completely irrelevant, Okay, it's just something that they're going to look at, But in some instances like this one, it was definitely worth considering. Why was Kayla being so covert and not just saying give my laptop to Jenner, to Jennifer. Why was she moving to moving it to someone else in the first place. Why did she think that was so important? Why couldn't she have just left her laptop at home? Kayla lived, she had a home. Why did she have to give it to her sister? And then why did her sister need to transfer to someone else? It just it just was weird, Okay, No one needed to borrow it for any reason that I know of. Her sister didn't ask to borrow it, and she gave it two weeks before the shooting. Well, let's look at multiple things that were recovered with some insight that I'm able to give because of some research that I did. All Right, all three children at the

34:14 center of this case, all three of them were enrolled at the Monassory Educational Center in twenty eighteen. That year was the first year of attendance for the child that they shared biologically though. Okay, now, the tuition agreement was on record for all three children, and I look this up. Tuition per child is about five thousand dollars a year. This means, according to my Stellar College calculations, it was going to cost about fifteen thousand dollars for the year for all three kids to go to school there. And Kayla was the one who set all of this up. She's the mom. It makes sense to me that she would set all this up. Well, the school management system, and I got a break in here real quick from Louisiana.

35:01 You know this case, but this never seemed to be big in the news. And so this is why research to me is worth so much. All Right, The tuition management system that the school used to collect the payments for tuition. It required a bank account be on file. You weren't just gonna bring a check up there whenever it was due. You had to have an account on file. Well, on August nineteenth of twenty eighteen, all three children's tuition payments were charged to Thomas's bank account. There was an issue though. Thomas called the school and he told the school, why did y'all take all of this money out? I never approved paying tuition for all three kids. I mean, you know, I'll pay for my child, but you know, I don't understand why all three were taken out of my account. Well, after the principal and Thomas had an in depth conversation, even the school agreed that they needed to refund him the charges because that tells me something.

36:05 The school is willing to give up money when they have three kids enrolled there. That's a red flag. Well, upon further look, Thomas never paid the older two girls tuition in the past. So why all of a sudden, now that he's already filed for divorce, in the middle of a bitter divorce you know situation, why would he now agree to pay for the kid's tuition He's divorcing their mother, he never paid in the past. Hmm. Interesting, right for your knowledge too. This is one hundred percent true what I'm telling you, because Thomas even went to the extent after he spoke with the principal, He went to the extent of filing a complaint in early September of twenty eighteen. This was confirmed by the financial crimes detective Caleb Watson with the Alexandria PD who originally was the person who spoke to Thomas. The thing was he he was never able to follow up on that complaint because Thomas was killed the very Saturday after they initially spoke, so it was like it had just been filed and they didn't get to follow up on that. Well. What was found on the laptop though, were some messages between Kayla and a friend, and there were a series of messages on August the second, and Kayla said this direct quote in that message quote, I found his new bank info end quote that says something else. She didn't say, Thomas gave me his new bank info. She didn't say

37:37 Thomas agreed all of a sudden to pay tuition for the other two girls. She said, I found it as in Lucky me when she followed up with how she was going to use it to process the kid's tuition payments, and her friend's response to that was, quote, ha ha ha, it will be the best money you have ever spent. End quote. This sounds to me like some shady ass bullshit, And she knew she was dead wrong. She was using his money knowing that they were still legally married, just to see if she could get away with it and to put him on the hook with it and give him problems. Those messages don't lie. And another thing about those messages that are very important to me is that if I was scared for my life, if I was scared for my life, I can promise you I'm not gonna borrow trouble from the one person who I'm saying I'm afraid is gonna kill me. What do you think in this situation, like you ponder that she's terrified, she keeps going to court, she's scared of him, she's scared of him, she's scared of him. A protective order was approved against him, Yet you're willing to go jack his money from him. If ever, there was a reason not to fuck with somebody, it's don't take their money, especially if you're afraid they're gonna kill you. That goes against everything I would think anyone would do. Kayla's search history was analyzed and that is where that concealed Carrie insurance

39:09 I mentioned previously will come into play. I'm talking about the gun insurance that she bought. So for starters, Kayla had been searching self defense laws and stand your ground laws in the weeks prior to the shooting and killing of Thomas. And while people right now can argue, look, she was terrified of him and that's why she was doing all of this. I possibly could have gotten on board with that argument until I learned something else in my own research, and it all is going to go back to that damn laptop. That's where she was doing her searches for self defense. But you have to ask yourself, if you looked up something innocently on the Internet because you were afraid for your life, would you then go in and delete that search history, like specifically just that search history. I kind of sat on that for a second because I thought, have I ever gone in and deleted my search history? And the answer is like, no, I've never done that. I mean, I've cleared the cachet or whatever. But I don't go in and delete my search history. Who bothers with that? But Kayla did, and I can't understand why it was her laptop. She's arguing that this was allegedly a legitimate a concern of hers, so why delete it? And then just so happened to give that laptop to your sister, while also telling her it doesn't exist over a jail phone call. The totality of circumstances here, it matters to me. And then there

40:43 was trusty old Snapchat. Okay, everyone thinks Snapchat messages disappear after thirty seconds. Bullshit. Go read the fine print, every picture you've ever taken, everything you've ever written. It's in the cloud. They have it, cops can get it. Just know that. Okay. But there were messages between Kayla and Jennifer that were recover her friend, and in early twenty eighteen, Jennifer and Kayla were chatting it up when Kayla said to her friend she wanted to kill Thomas. Uh, that's convenient considering this investigation. So now what's gonna happen is people can argue that, oh, it was just an off color joke. But you know, saying like, h I could kill him for this. But after she said she wanted to kill Thomas, she then directly asked to borrow Jennifer's gun, which Jennifer politely refused. Okay. Then in August, after she refused to give her the gun, she sent a picture of the gun that she went and bought in Texas to Jennifer. And then she went on and asked Jennifer if she knew anything about self defense insurance. And this is why that USCCA insurance becomes interesting. Now it's common ish that people purchase this type of insurance. Basically, it's for people who want to be responsible gun owners and if they ever get in a situation where they have to use deadly force, this company will provide coverage and monetary support should you have to go to court and defend yourself or your property or whatever financially. Now, USCCA

42:14 stands for United States Concealed Carey Association, and I will tell you that as of the date of this recording, they do have over eight hundred and sixty thousand active members. All Right, They hold workshops, they give advice as well as training modules and things like that. Well, Kayla had purchased the platinum membership when she purchased that little Ruger three eighty in Texas. Specifically, she got that contract for the insurance on September the first. Follow this real quick. She got that insurance on September the first. On September the fourth is when she researched self defense laws okay, and again reminder, she shot and killed Thomas four days after that. Now continuing with those snapchats in August, Kayla also told her friend that she had deleted all of her social media accounts and that she might direct quote make the news and might need a fundraiser for bail money.

43:16 There was also another interesting find on the laptop which was dated September fourth, again the same date as the self defense law research she did, and the name of this document was a notice of intent to relocate with child. So obviously she was wanting to take their child elsewhere. I mean, I shouldn't need to really explain what that means any further, but let's talk about that for a second. That kind of would become probably an issue between her and Thomas. And that's when a light bulb went off on something that I had read and didn't initially have in this podcast, see when that whole slapping incident happened.

43:57 Thomas told the reporting officer that the reason Kayla slapped him was because she got upset with him because she was wanting to move to live with her new boyfriend, and Thomas was pissed about it because the new boyfriend, he said, was a drug addict. Kayla claimed that that slap was in retaliation to Thomas slamming her leg in the door, but she never mentioned the boyfriend argument. However, the letter to relocate was found in the laptop, so that to me, screams, Thomas was telling the truth. Thomas was telling the truth. And then another officer, his name was Lynn Hall. He had investigated another alleged incident of violence between Kayla and Thomas, and this again was during a custody exchange, this time at a Kroger parking lot.

44:47 And this is that incident where the door accidentally bumped Kayla's butt okay or her thigh or whatever. Officer Hall personally saw quote red markings on top Thomas's face and noted that he had a knot above his eyebrow end quote a knot. So while writing up the report again Thomas didn't want to have her arrested, He just wanted it documented. And when asked, what did you do whenever she was hitting on you, Thomas told the officer he didn't retaliate and that he basically quote held himself back end quote until Kayla quit hitting him. Even More text messages exchanged between Kayla and that friend. This friend's name was Natasha. This was on August thirteenth. This was a few days after Thomas reported that he had again been hit by Kayla. Natasha said, quote, hopefully his eye is still black end quote, to which Kayla replied, quote we have to meet our daughter's teacher in the morning. His pride is dead. Then she used a racial slur right there, says racial slur has a black eye. Okay, so she's proving basically or these instances have physical proof witnessed by others.

46:10 And then messages that now coincide. I can't ignore that she was hitting Thomas. She was hurting Thomas. Additional messages from Kayla's phone would also show that the morning of the shooting, Thomas wanted to meet at a police station, but Kayla said, no, let's just meet at the walmart close to my house. He wanted to go to a walmart. If you were terrified, absolutely terrified of your soon to be ex husband, and you're soon to be ex husband, said, let's meet at a police station the very day of the shooting. Wouldn't you agree to go to the police station.

46:51 Wouldn't you agree? YEA, let's do that. I would unless you possibly had other plans and you didn't want to be at a police station. And I'm only looking at these individual circumstances as I would expect any other prudent person to consider. And you know, I'm not just convinced of her fear at this point of needing to use deadly force at this juncture. As I'm podcasting to you right now, how do you feel? Think this through? Now? Here's the other kicker to this whole debacle. Uscca was immediately contacted by Kayla after the shooting. And I know what you're thinking, Oh, within a week or so, or a day or a week or so, But no, as in the moment she shot him, she called nine one one.

47:36 She did then hang up on nine one one early and would not repeat answer repeated attempts by dispatchers to call her back. She ignored them because she then called us CCA, Like, think that through for a second. You just had to shoot for your life. You had to kill somebody that was jumping on you, and you thought that they were going to end your life. You pulled a gun and you were willing to shoot and kill somebody. You were so afraid. Yet you still have the presence of mind to not answer the nine one one calls that are trying to come in repeatedly, and then you call an insurance company on scene. Does that even Does that even sit well with you? Because it doesn't with me either way. This USCCA paid out fifty thousand dollars at first. Okay, this was probably the retainer fee for the initial attorney. I'm assuming I don't know that, but they did give her fifty grand, but then damn near immediately afterward, they dropped their coverage of her, and people who were gun owners and people who are like, wait a minute, that's what the policy was for. How can they drop her? That's what they were promising was to cover her and to ensure her if she ever had to use deadly force. How could they possibly do this? Well?

48:53 The answer is that the case was reviewed by USCCA attorneys, and when they saw everything, including like I guess, the video and all of that, they kind of went, whoa, whoa, whoa, this looks like murder. This does not look like self defense. And to me, that's pretty huge. I mean, after all, the policy was intended to defend people, that's what it's for, and they were like whoa. So when people then got in arms about this locally, they can't do that. They're an insurance company. Well, I guess what I can tell you is that there is a clause in the contract if you look it up, and it excludes coverage for what they call quote unquote criminal acts. The coverage is more intended to protect you from losing everything you own for having to shoot somebody, but that doesn't include if you do so with criminal intent. And the cops obviously felt like she had criminal intent because they arrested her, But now so did USCCA, who prides themselves on defending gun owners. So they dropped her immediately because they felt that her actions were basically indefensible. This did not look like a self defense case to them. So Kyla's now in jail and she's tasked with mounting her defense without the financial assistance of USCCA. So she sits in jail until the following year when she contacts Red River Bank.

50:22 Now why do I bring this up? Well, she was wanting to withdraw some funds from the bank. But here's the thing. Thomas banked with Red River Bank, not her. So the bank manager and Kayla are basically emailing back and forth because the bank manager is kind of like unclear on whether Kayla is in charge of his estate or whether his parents are in charge of his estate. Well, Kayla became very upset during this communication, and she said, okay, So basically the bank, y'all are unwilling to cooperate with me, even though Louisiana law says that his parents only have to be notified that I am, you know, the widow here. You know, I'm the one that's that's left for the estate.

51:06 But Kayla conveniently never mentioned to the bank that she had already already been denied succession of Thomas's estate that had already been established. She also never mentioned that she was the one in the pending criminal case for his murder. She never brought any of that up. Yet She's mad at the bank because they won't hand over the cash. Matter of fact, she also never mentioned that back in June of twenty eighteen, the ex couple now they had already signed their separation of property agreement. She had no right to his money, and she knew it, and she still was fighting with the bank. That's what I would call fraud, not to mention the anguish that she was now putting on Thomas's already grieving family. Always it seems like they were fighting a battle with this chick. Imagine someone charged with killing your son, killing your brother, you know what I mean. She took his life, and now she's trying to wipe out his bank account a year later.

52:05 I cannot imagine how that would feel, but I can tell you I would be pissed. I would be so enraged. And by the way, just in case you're someone who's friends with Kayla and you are going to try to call bullshit on what I'm telling you, an attorney for Red River Bank also verified that there are laws in place that the spouse of a decedent can have access to their bank account, but there are also laws in place that prohibit that if you are the spouse that caused the death of the other spouse, Okay, so she was breaking the law by what she was attempting to do. Well, this had me curious, and I did some more digging on Kayla. Okay, and you're going to see, if you look at this up on your own at all, that they're going to say that she had no criminal record, that she was a law abiding citizen. Even her own attorneys stated that at one point in something that I read.

53:02 But I found something that is documented where Kayla had a burglary charge on her record, but this had been some years prior and she was able to get that expunged. So while this means nothing by itself, it does seem to show me a history of problematic behavior and taking what's not yours. So eventually the murder trial made its way to court, and Kayla's defense would basically be based on the stand your ground doctrine that I know a lot of us have heard a lot about in recent years. Basically, it was a self defense claim and she's saying that she stood her ground. But I want to just learn you something real fast, that there's basic criteria on stand your ground laws, with some adjustments here and there. Okay, but I want you to listen and weigh what I'm explaining to you with what you know to be a core truth. Number one, you have to have reasonable fear.

54:04 You have to reasonably believe that you are imminent danger of death or great bodily harm. Number two, the danger has to be immediate, and it states explicitly a verbal threat alone is usually not enough unless accompanied by actions showing immediate harm. The next one, you have to have a legal right to be in the location where the force is used, so you're home, your car, or whatever. It says you have no duty to retreat, which means you're not required to try to escape before using force, which is different from traditional self defense laws. It says you cannot have started the confrontation or be engaged in criminal activity. And then the main thing here is the force has to be reasonable and proportionate to the threat faced, meaning you can't use deadly against a minor threat. Well, based on her own statements after the shooting and continuing in through the investigative process, she continued to reiterate the lesser standard is what occurred. She said, he called me a bitch, and he jumped at me. Those are her own words, Even those two claims that I've told you don't meet the muster of needing to kill someone. Not to mention the video evidence does not support her claim.

55:31 There's a presumption of reasonableness in stand your ground laws, okay, And it's not a license to kill because you were just scared. It's not how this works, and people seem to mis understand that. So while Kayla was well within her rights to stand her ground and protect herself if necessary, she was not entitled to orchestrate a situation wherein she then falsely exercised those rights. And the prosecution agreed with what I'm saying to you right now now because they then put on a masterclass of laying out everything in order for the jury, which I'm going to do for you right now. And it's all going to make sense when I put it in order and I outline everything that happened in just twenty eighteen, You're ready. Thomas filed for divorce, and that custody battle ensued. On August nineteenth.

56:23 Kayla found Thomas's bank information and then fraudulently made payments for all of the children's tuition. She then confirmed this by bragging to her friend about using the account she found The next day, a judge ordered that the couple would share custody of their biological child during the month of August. That entire month, Kayla was researching specifically shooting related scenarios on both her laptop and her cell phone, and I want to give you the exact searches. These are quotes self defense inside a car. She also looked up arrested after self defense, and she also searched details about another Louisiana case where a person had escaped criminal liability in Louisiana for shooting somebody. She then deleted all of that history on her devices. In the meantime, the custody exchanges were continuing, Kayla was assaulting Thomas, who then would report these incidences to police, and they were documented.

57:29 One at the Kroger's, one at the Tattoo Shop parking lot, which I covered. One instant she slapped Thomas in the face and another she punched him. The wounds were obvious, and then she bragged and she laughed about it to her friends. Kayla and Thomas continued to argue. The tension escalated. That's when Kayla asked to bar the gun. Her friend said no. Kayla deleted all of her social media accounts, and I'm assuming this was because they were unbecoming and likely contradictory to her whole battered and scared woman claims she would later make, and then she told her friends about it, followed up with the fact that she was going to make the news and need bail money. Protective orders were then signed against both of them. Kayla gave her laptop to her sister after she deleted that search history just two weeks before the shooting. Twelve days before the shooting, she purchased the gun in Texas, as well as the self defense insurance. Then she sent pictures of the gun to her friend. She got that gun, by the way, just a reminder in direct non compliance of the protective order rules and laws. She was also asked in Texas when purchasing that gun if she was currently under any type of criminal case, including protective orders, to which she answered no on the application, and because she owned a concealed carry permit in Texas, she was able to get the weapon without a formal background check. That's devius now that you look at it in perspective. September fourth, she created that document of intent to relocate her child

58:59 September seventh, she was served with that paperwork for the possible custody agreement adjustments and that she would owe Thomas money. And then September eighth, Thomas says, let's meet at the police station. She says no, They go to Walmart and she shoots and kills him. She then attempted to withdraw his bank funds the following year, not to mention, I did some more digging where I found reports that she also stole Thomas's sister's identification and fraudulently took out credit cards or something of that nature, and was violating his sister basically. And as the result of that arrest, warrants in multiple states were issued for Thomas's sister. It wasn't until the Attorney General for Louisiana had to get involved and called these other states to advise them of the situation and that Thomas's sister was not a criminal. The jury listened intently during the trial and even more came to light for Starters. Her own child's testimony changed when she went the oldest daughter when she went and testified in court, she said she never saw Thomas jump at her mother. The day of the shooting. Kayla's friend also testified she never saw Thomas abuse Kayla. Some forensics in terms of the casing for the bullet that struck and killed Thomas were very interesting to me as well during this trial, because she told police over and over that

1:00:32 he was on top of her. Remember, he jerked the car door open, he jumped on top of her, and she had to shoot out of fear. Well, when a gun is shot, that casing ejects up out of the gun and to the left, up and to the left. Okay, that would mean that if he was on top of her in the car and she took the gun and she had to shoot, where would that bullet casing land Let me guess, up and to the left, which means it would have fallen inside the car. Well, let's add to that also, not to mention the whole calamity of if he jerked the door open and her gun was in the holster in the door, how did you even get it out of the hole sster? How did you reach it that fast? How could you do any of this if you're trying to pull the door back shut and it happened in less than three seconds, how could any of that happen either way. You know where the bullet casing was found on the ground outside of her vehicle, not on the inside. That's interesting to me. Kayla Giles went out of her way to make Thomas Kouti Junior miserable, and she was physically abusive to him in the process.

1:01:42 Thomas did everything he should have or that he could have to document the situation and let the courts do their job, but Kayla would never let that happen. She planned his murder ahead of time and took steps to hide her planning before she enacted her plan to mention the very thing she researched became the very events that took place. And we all know I don't believe in coincidences. The jury agreed with that opinion too, and Kayla Giles was found guilty of the second degree murder of Thomas Cootie Junior. She was sentenced to life in prison for his murder, plus thirty years for obstruction of justice. Now, I wouldn't be a good podcaster if I didn't let you know that there is a fundraiser online. It's on spot fund for Kayla, with a goal of raising twenty five thousand dollars to help her continue to defend herself in court. Okay, I need you to know that so far in the past few years, they have raised a total of thirty five dollars towards that goal. Oh. Also, by the way, they means her, because I looked into who the creator of that fundraiser was and it was Kayla.

1:02:56 She did it. Also, if you want to speak to Kayla yourself, if you feel so led, you can do so on what's called Wire of Hope. It's a website and there she has made a profile and she states that prison is lonely, and she declares herself a Christian as well as an Aquarius. And to that note, I would let you like to let you know that if you want to speak to Thomas, it's gonna be a little bit more difficult. I'm sure it's lonely in the cemetery as well. Also, you can't email there, so you'll have to actually drive like his parents and his sister and his friends and his cousins do if they want to visit him. You have to get in your car and you're gonna have to travel to Alexandria Memorial Gardens.

1:03:39 If you want to do that also, he was not able to interact obviously or give any details about anything. So there's just his name on a cold stone, and that's what you have to look at if you want to do that. Now. I noticed this too. Kayla described herself pretty well hell on her pinpal website. Getting down to the details, she describes her brown eyes and her brown hair. But where she lost me was when she described herself as a widow, because that implies you lost your husband. But she didn't lose him, y'all. She murdered him.

1:04:22 So if color matters in terms of her eyes and her hair, I think it important that we color her marital status as well, because maybe I can tell you one thing. I know a black widow when I see one.