May 20, 2025

Two Time Orphan

Two Time Orphan
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Season 7

In this episode of Unspeakable, KJ covers the tragic case of Kathy Griffith, killed by her son Colin.


Chapters
11:29 A Desperate Call for Help
13:54 The Scene of the Crime
20:10 Uncovering the Evidence
27:26 Colin's Unusual Behavior
34:32 The Autopsy Reveals All
40:59 Investigating the Past
47:26 A Mother's Fear
52:06 The Role of Detective Lacey
1:11:17 Tension Builds Between Mother and Son
1:17:35 The Final Confrontation
1:22:20 The Tragic Outcome

Video, Sound and Editing for Unspeakable: A True Crime Podcast by Kelly Jennings is provided by the podcast experts at Envision Podcast Studios in Denham Springs, LA.

Executive Producer: Jim Chapman

WEBVTT

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Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell

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stories of real crimes with real victims, whose cases are

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so shocking that many are left wondering how is this

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even real? I use my experiences in law enforcement corrections,

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and combined with my years as a criminal justice educator,

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dig deep into complex cases of evil acts.

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Some so evil many feel they are unspeakable. Warning.

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Unspeakable as intended for mature audiences. If you are easily offended,

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then I'm not your girl. Listening discretion is advised. Hey, y'all,

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it's kJ You're back for another episode of Unspeakable. And

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I'm having a fantastic day so far. It's beautiful outside,

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and I probably just had the worst parenting fail ever

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because I didn't realize it was my child's award ceremony

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this morning and didn't go, and she looked a hot mess.

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So apologies to anyone who saw my child at the

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award ceremony.

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I swear I love my children. I messed up. But

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let me give you some shout outs today.

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I got two of them for you, and I'm going

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to start in Downington, Pennsylvania, where I have missed.

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Colleen Beswick.

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She said she listens in so much, and her family

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is even now listening to unspeakable.

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So thank you so.

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Much, Colleen. I hope you enjoyed this shout out. I'm

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waving to you on the camera, So go ahead and

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watch me podcast.

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If you're not watching, so I can say.

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Hey to you. And then I've got miss Lisa Presley

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from Carthage, North Carolina.

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What is going on in the North Carolina area? Lisa?

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And you know that name has to be that has

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to be a pretty popular name, Lisa Presley. Huh when

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that Elvis's daughter's name, Lisa Marie. Here's your middle name, Marie.

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How crazy would that be? Lisa Marie Presley.

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I'm saying hey to you.

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I hope you're seeing me wave to you, and I

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hope things are going fantastic in your neck of the woods.

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I want to jump into the story, but before I do,

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I've got to tell you something kind of funny. You

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might enjoy this if you're a parent. So, my one

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of my children, her hamster, she had three die back

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to back to back. It's been a very traumatic situation

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in our household. And so we finally went and we

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got another one. And I'm like, You've got to just

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do everything right with this one. I know it's not

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your fault. They must be sick or something. I don't

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know what was going on.

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So we bought this hamster.

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It turned out to be the absolute devil reincarnate. It

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got loose in our house. I finally found it. It

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attacked me. It bit me in my upper thigh area.

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So I brought that little spawn of Satan back to

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the pet store and was like, look, we're back again.

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I'm sorry, but I need one that's actually nice. So

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we got this little hamster. Guys, his name's Peanut. He

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is so sweet.

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But the kids.

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Started crying, and I'm like, what is wrong. We haven't

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been home but a couple of hours, and my my

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middle child comes out crying, Oh my god, there's something

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wrong with Peanut. Oh my god, I said, what is it.

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There's something wrong that something fell out of his butt.

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I said, bring him to me. You've got to be

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kidding me. So Peanut is brought to me and we

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set Peanut down in my hand and I look him over. Guys,

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it's with heartbreak and sadness in my voice that I

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tell you that Peanut has the largest balls of any

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hamster ever born in the history of ever. And my

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children did not know what balls were. They're girls, and

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so we had to have a long talk about balls

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in my house and what they are, and that it's

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not actually butt cancer and he's gonna be just fine.

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So y'all pray for peanut. He's got a lot of baggage,

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a lot of junk in his trunk to carry around,

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and my children were horrified and scared, and the youngest

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one still.

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Believes it's butt cancer. But he's gonna be Okay.

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Everyone's got a traumatic hamster story, don't they, I think,

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So all right, let's jump into this episode.

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Now we're gonna go to Florida.

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What's going on down there in Florida, cause we're going

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to be in Auburndale, Florida, and that's a city located

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in Polk County, So shout out to all my people

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out in Polk County. And for reference, this is only

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about ten miles from Lakeland, Florida, which you should be

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familiar with because unfortunately we had the school shootings that

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happen out there, and approximately forty miles from both downtown

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Orlando and Tampa. So it kind of gives you a

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little viewpoint there of where we're at. And it's no

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wonder that this area attracts people from all over because

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of its access to places like.

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The famed Chain of Lakes.

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So if you're not familiar with that, this is a

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really really unique waterway system that the people there are

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pretty proud of. And it's got lots of canals that

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connect to multiple lakes in that area. So there's sixteen

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in the southern chain and eight in the Northern chain,

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and basically the waterways allow for the boaters and anyone

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I guess on a watercraft to travel from one side

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of the city to the other and then they all

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connect within and you can go and stop, and you

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can eat, and they have restaurants and all sorts of

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things out that way.

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It's simply beautiful.

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It's a great area to go have just some fun

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for wakeboarding, which I love wakeboarding, And it's right nearby

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Legoland that I know a lot of people like to visit.

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Just a great place for family and friends to go

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and to hang out and have a good time. And

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as far as industry is concerned there, healthcare is actually

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a really big part of what they do. There, specifically

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in the Polk County area, there's multiple hospitals and medical

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centers and they stay busy with the daily medical problems

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that plague all of our communities. Basically, there's an aging

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population in Auburndale two and most of the people in

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that group agree that they like the quiet, slower speed

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of life, so they like their little neighborhood there called

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the Hamptons. There is an age requirement to live in

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the Hampton in the Hamptons because this is a community

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that only allows people sixty five and older to live there.

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It's not that young people are disliked or anything like that.

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It's just that the priorities and the expectations tend to

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be different between these age groups, and they wanted this

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area to be quiet and calm living neighbors in Miss

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Hampton's was They're known to sit on their porch in

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the mornings and in the afternoons, and when the heat

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of the day is too hot, they go inside, but

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they like to have their morning coffee and they like

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to walk in the evenings as the sun goes down.

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And this was the case for Miss Nancy Jones on

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the early evening of Sunday, September eighth, twenty twenty four.

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It was still light outside, but the day was starting

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to come to an end, and the breeze was really

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cool as she sat on her porch. Just like I mentioned,

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she was in her chair rocking along, watching as the

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breeze blew by. And her friend Susan lived just across

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the street kind of k catty corner to where her

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house was, and Susan was out of town, so she

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asked Miss Nancy to watch over her house while she

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was away. And although Susan was gone, it was noted

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that there was a car parked under her car port.

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It was a black Jetta, and Nancy knew that this

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car it was okay that it was. She knew that

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it belonged to Susan's grandson, who would come in from

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time to time. She had seen him jogging in the

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neighborhood of time or two in the past, but they

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didn't really speak. It wasn't like they were on a

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first name basis or anything like that. But Susan's grandson

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was named Colin and he was just about to turn eighteen.

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Colin was still in high school. He was really a

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smart kid, just I guess you would describe him as

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rather unmotivated, but not a dump a dumb kid. He

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stood very tall and on a very thin six foot

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two frame.

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He has black hair.

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It's cut into a typical men's kind of shortcut, the

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bangs a little shorter in the front, and.

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He wore these black framed glasses.

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Looking at him, you would probably say he was probably

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more of an indoorsy type of guy, but his interests

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would kind of back that up, because he loved video

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games and he liked Starbucks. You know, those were the

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things that he enjoyed doing. He also really enjoyed traveling

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with his mother. They had gone on a ton of

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trips together, everything from Disney World to cruises.

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To Washington in DC.

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She even had taken him out of the country, and

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so travel was something that they really enjoyed doing together. Now,

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Colin's grandmother Susan that I just mentioned. This was his

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maternal grandmother. So his mother's name was Catherine, but people

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called her Kathy for short, and Kathy's upbringing, I want

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to focus on her for a second. Kathy's upbringing was

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kind of a lot like the common story of many

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of us today. Her parents divorced when she was a kid,

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and it brought a lot of turbulence to her life.

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So Susan and Cathy's father. His name was Robert Willantis.

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They were married for nineteen years. They had a long marriage,

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but they ended up divorcing in nineteen ninety eight, and

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from youngest to oldest they had three kids, John, Paul, Kathy,

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and then Christy. Well, when they divorced, Susan got custody

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and she raised the kids, but it wasn't without a

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bunch of battles in court over who would get time

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with the kids. But once Robert was really denied custody

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of them, he didn't really have a relationship with any

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of them until after they got a lot lot older.

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So I don't know, this kind of sounds like the

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typical divorce where the mom gets the kids and then

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the dad's kind of like, well whatever, and goes on

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with his own interests. I guess if you want to

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call it that. So after the divorce, Susan would end

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up remarrying her second husband. His name was Enachi Markovich.

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That was difficult for me. I even looked up how

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to spell that one, but Naki Markovich and they together

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had a child named Kevin, and so now they're kind

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of a blended family. And Kathy, her daughter, and Kevin

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were pretty close whenever they were growing up, but now

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as adults, Kathy herself was single because around twenty twenty,

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she and Colin's father got divorced after a very tumultuous marriage,

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and her son was now her focus. So, since I've

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introduced a lot of people here, there's grandmother Susan, who

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was married to Robert. They got they had a bunch

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of kids, including Kathy. Then they divorced and Kathy grew up.

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She got married, but she divorced her husband and she

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had grandson Colin. So I'm hoping you're kind of following that.

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So it was about five pm on this day as

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neighbor Nancy was rocking on her porch and she sees

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a white car pull into Susan's driveway across the street

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at the house. It then backed out of that driveway,

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parked on the roadway in front of the house, and

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then a girl got out of that vehicle. And Nancy

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could tell by the way that this girl got out

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of the car and slammed her door that this girl

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was pretty upset when she pulled up and she didn't

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recognize the young lady, but she did notice that she

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looked really young. So while this girl may have looked

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really young, it was actually a woman. It was Colin's mother, Catherine,

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and her looking young to the neighbor really does make

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sense because Catherine was only thirteen years old when she

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got pregnant with her first child, which was Colin's brother, Christopher,

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So she started having her children as a child herself,

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and then she didn't have Colin until she was around

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twenty two. She really was kind of on the younger

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end of the spectrum. Not to mention she was a

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very tiny woman. She was only about five foot two,

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one hundred and twenty six pounds, so from a distance,

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I guess you would say she looked like an older team.

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So that's why the neighbor thought that she looked pretty young.

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So as Catherine was walking towards the car port of

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her mother's home, Nancy watched her. But then Nancy remembered, oh, man,

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I got a sink full of dishes that I need

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to go take care of. So she jumped up off

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of her porch and she head inside to clean her kitchen.

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Just a little while later after that took place, a

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00:11:32.919 --> 00:11:34.879
call for help would be placed to nine to one

236
00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:39.360
one from Susan's home, and as the dispatcher answers the phone,

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it was seventeen year old Colin on the other line

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and he was desperate for help.

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So go ahead and listen. This is just a portion

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00:11:46.600 --> 00:11:47.120
of that call.

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00:11:47.320 --> 00:11:48.799
And I do want to say I apologize for the

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00:11:48.840 --> 00:11:50.759
quality of the call, but it is what it is.

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I don't know the idea of fucking I don't know

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this AGAs.

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My mom's got the t m us.

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Now to bleeding out, So you tell your mom is

247
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showing what my mom's bleeding out.

248
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So he's to bleeding out.

249
00:12:08.759 --> 00:12:11.480
Okay, let's see what do you think you are?

250
00:12:11.720 --> 00:12:14.440
What road are you at? What the cross is that road?

251
00:12:14.879 --> 00:12:17.360
She'll say, you had them into border you you go

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00:12:17.519 --> 00:12:19.559
through the gates and take the first right and it's

253
00:12:19.600 --> 00:12:21.519
the house to the black get out. But I'm trying

254
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to go the dale.

255
00:12:35.480 --> 00:12:36.559
Okay, how do I look someone?

256
00:12:36.799 --> 00:12:38.039
How did you get into the hospital?

257
00:12:38.159 --> 00:12:38.759
And I look someone?

258
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Okay, number one and.

259
00:12:41.639 --> 00:12:45.480
We're off, Anglance. He doesn't have time.

260
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He's looking at GEC's fucking fails here's that time. So

261
00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:52.399
now okay, I'm even I guess I seek you out?

262
00:12:52.440 --> 00:13:09.519
Is that okay? Yeah, he's being said, there are no

263
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I'm time alcome for the astoners. I am, I don't nothing?

264
00:13:16.240 --> 00:13:20.720
Did you as being set? Okay? I can help being

265
00:13:20.879 --> 00:13:28.399
set because I see bleeding outing sound being from the

266
00:13:28.480 --> 00:13:29.759
nest man see me to my mother?

267
00:13:30.799 --> 00:13:31.000
Time.

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00:13:31.600 --> 00:13:35.480
I'm the person.

269
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I'm with?

270
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Yet, yes, I'm with an ask all your the pent

271
00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:41.440
friend he's putting one years old?

272
00:13:41.559 --> 00:13:43.080
You have a you have a hawking sins.

273
00:13:43.120 --> 00:13:47.759
He has the US rank. No, SE's the gun pocket

274
00:13:48.000 --> 00:13:56.240
the outside paper. No, I don't think why.

275
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Where So as you somewhat heard, Colin is absolutely desperate

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for help, and the dispatcher does what she thinks is

277
00:14:16.480 --> 00:14:20.440
best considering the information that he gave. And you didn't

278
00:14:20.480 --> 00:14:22.799
hear this part because it's a very long nine one

279
00:14:22.840 --> 00:14:25.919
one call, but at one point she starts telling Colin

280
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that she's got to give compressions to his mother.

281
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We've got to do this now.

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And so the sound of a dispatcher counting out compressions

283
00:14:34.399 --> 00:14:36.879
is so stressful to me because when you hear that,

284
00:14:37.519 --> 00:14:40.279
you know immediately how serious this call is. And this

285
00:14:40.480 --> 00:14:45.000
is likely life or death. And you can hear one, two, three, four, five,

286
00:14:45.240 --> 00:14:47.919
and it goes on and on and on. Now, what

287
00:14:48.080 --> 00:14:50.879
Colin explained to that dispatcher was that his mother was

288
00:14:50.919 --> 00:14:53.440
bleeding out of her neck because she fell on a

289
00:14:53.519 --> 00:14:57.879
knife during a fight with him. But the problem with

290
00:14:58.039 --> 00:15:00.919
that type of wound she had is that she was

291
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suffering from a gaping neck wound with severe arterial bleed

292
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that was occurring from it. And in cases like this,

293
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a person can bleed out in as little as three minutes,

294
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and that's exactly what was happening. Colin even tells the

295
00:15:16.399 --> 00:15:19.440
operator at one point that she stopped bleeding. She's not

296
00:15:19.519 --> 00:15:23.360
even bleeding anymore. There's no color, she's pale, she's not

297
00:15:23.480 --> 00:15:26.759
bleeding anymore. And that's because she had no more blood

298
00:15:26.799 --> 00:15:30.639
to bleed out, y'all. Her heart had stopped pumping and

299
00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:34.240
her blood was all out of her body, all of it.

300
00:15:35.600 --> 00:15:37.039
So a few things about that call.

301
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:44.320
Obviously, stopping the bleeding should have been priority, not necessarily CPR.

302
00:15:44.799 --> 00:15:46.879
But I want to tell you this, it's very important

303
00:15:46.919 --> 00:15:51.120
to note that an operator has to clarify exactly what,

304
00:15:51.440 --> 00:15:53.960
tell me exactly what happened. This operator didn't word it

305
00:15:54.039 --> 00:15:56.159
that way, that would have been something she probably would

306
00:15:56.320 --> 00:15:58.720
have been discussed with about this in reviewing that call.

307
00:15:58.840 --> 00:16:00.600
But when he said she felt the knife and she

308
00:16:00.720 --> 00:16:03.840
was bleeding and she wasn't responsive, that's why this dispatcher

309
00:16:03.919 --> 00:16:07.159
jumped straight into CPR, when in reality it probably should

310
00:16:07.159 --> 00:16:09.799
have jumped more into stop the bleed. But she was

311
00:16:09.879 --> 00:16:12.480
bleeding so quickly that never even really had time to happen.

312
00:16:12.679 --> 00:16:14.240
And I don't think that he could have saved her

313
00:16:14.279 --> 00:16:16.840
even if he wanted to, because of so much bleeding

314
00:16:16.919 --> 00:16:20.240
that was occurring, that's my opinion, and he wasn't able

315
00:16:20.320 --> 00:16:23.080
to save her. So officers in a paramedics they did

316
00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:27.080
arrive on scene really really quickly, but police showed up

317
00:16:27.120 --> 00:16:29.120
and knowing that they believed this call to be a

318
00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:32.919
type of assault with a knife, they were dispatched and

319
00:16:33.159 --> 00:16:34.960
showed up, but they had to clear the scene before

320
00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:37.120
the paramedics could even come inside because they didn't know

321
00:16:37.159 --> 00:16:41.120
what the situation was on the inside. So Deputy Alexander

322
00:16:41.159 --> 00:16:42.840
Walker was the first one that was on the scene.

323
00:16:43.200 --> 00:16:47.080
And I have to say here that I clearly am

324
00:16:47.159 --> 00:16:51.320
getting old at this point because every officer that showed

325
00:16:51.399 --> 00:16:54.440
up on that scene looked no older than sixteen years old.

326
00:16:54.960 --> 00:16:57.120
I'm not kidding you. These look like children. These officers

327
00:16:57.159 --> 00:16:57.720
are so young.

328
00:16:58.159 --> 00:17:01.720
But they showed up and they Colin yelling, I'm in

329
00:17:01.799 --> 00:17:04.759
the kitchen, I'm in the kitchen, and so Deputy Walker

330
00:17:04.880 --> 00:17:08.000
opened the door. As he opened it, he immediately saw

331
00:17:08.079 --> 00:17:10.839
Kathy lying on the ground in the kitchen and Colin

332
00:17:11.119 --> 00:17:14.400
was sitting on the floor and leaning over her head,

333
00:17:14.480 --> 00:17:17.000
so he was above her head, leaning over it, very

334
00:17:17.079 --> 00:17:21.240
frantic about what was happening there. Colin was shirtless, he

335
00:17:21.319 --> 00:17:25.559
had blood all over his hands his forearms, and the

336
00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:28.400
officer noted that he was rather manic when he first

337
00:17:28.720 --> 00:17:30.400
got up on him to see what was going on.

338
00:17:30.960 --> 00:17:32.839
So he told the other officer that was with him,

339
00:17:32.880 --> 00:17:37.359
his name was Deputy Pibernick, to take Colin outside, which

340
00:17:37.519 --> 00:17:41.200
the deputy did, and Colin calmed down once he was

341
00:17:41.279 --> 00:17:44.240
outside of the house. At that point, EMS was already

342
00:17:44.240 --> 00:17:46.440
on scene. They were staging or waiting right off scene

343
00:17:46.640 --> 00:17:48.960
to be called in, and the officers waved them in

344
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and fire Captain James Parker and another firefighter and paramedic

345
00:17:53.279 --> 00:17:56.880
Owen Mullen entered the home together to try to assist Kathy,

346
00:17:57.279 --> 00:17:59.400
and when they entered the home again, they found her

347
00:17:59.480 --> 00:18:01.480
line on the gri She was in the kitchen area

348
00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:05.400
and she was on her back, showing no signs of life.

349
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She was very pale, very white, and clearly she wasn't breathing.

350
00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:13.160
So they kneel down beside her, and they could both

351
00:18:13.240 --> 00:18:17.559
see all the way into her neck when they approached

352
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to try to help her, and paramedic Mullen immediately said

353
00:18:20.920 --> 00:18:24.359
to the other one, this injury is incompatible with life.

354
00:18:24.480 --> 00:18:27.960
This is a horrendous injury to her neck. But they

355
00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:30.119
either way, they're not going to just say that. They

356
00:18:30.240 --> 00:18:32.880
got to work, and they tried in a last ditch

357
00:18:32.920 --> 00:18:35.160
effort to give her CPR and to try to get

358
00:18:35.200 --> 00:18:39.240
her heart pumping, but the wound was so bad. Every

359
00:18:39.400 --> 00:18:43.160
time they would do a chest compression, air could be

360
00:18:43.279 --> 00:18:46.359
heard just pushing out of the wound, so they knew

361
00:18:46.839 --> 00:18:49.799
that it was fatally deep and that this.

362
00:18:50.039 --> 00:18:50.799
Is not good.

363
00:18:50.880 --> 00:18:55.119
This is horribly bad. So they could see well within

364
00:18:55.240 --> 00:18:57.240
her neck too. While they were doing this. They could

365
00:18:57.240 --> 00:18:59.680
see her veins, they could see her artery, they could

366
00:18:59.680 --> 00:19:02.920
see deep into the neck, and their efforts were futile.

367
00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:07.079
So eventually they ceased working on her because there was

368
00:19:07.160 --> 00:19:10.279
no more blood. There was only air leaving her body

369
00:19:10.359 --> 00:19:13.519
from that neck, and she was shortly thereafter declared deceased.

370
00:19:14.200 --> 00:19:17.079
But based on everything they knew from experience and what

371
00:19:17.160 --> 00:19:19.920
they were seeing, she had already been dead before they

372
00:19:19.960 --> 00:19:23.759
were even waved into the house. So they all slowly

373
00:19:23.799 --> 00:19:26.720
got up to their feet, and they had defeat basically

374
00:19:27.000 --> 00:19:30.680
in their minds, the gravity of the reality pulling down

375
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:33.799
on them as they solemnly gathered all their medical supplies,

376
00:19:33.920 --> 00:19:37.440
got their things together, and exited the house, knowing that

377
00:19:37.680 --> 00:19:42.279
this young man's life would never be the same because

378
00:19:42.319 --> 00:19:44.640
his mama was dead and there was nothing they could

379
00:19:44.640 --> 00:19:47.960
do about it. So while deputies began to tape off

380
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:52.240
the area, they called for a detective to come on scene,

381
00:19:52.240 --> 00:19:56.279
and he did arrive, and that deputy Walker, while they're

382
00:19:56.279 --> 00:19:58.519
waiting on the detective to get there, was kind of

383
00:19:58.559 --> 00:20:01.319
surprised to look up and see them at ems was

384
00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:05.880
renting off Colin's arms, and it was strange to him

385
00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:07.839
because it's like, well, damn, I mean, that's the only

386
00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:09.880
real suspect that we have right now as to what

387
00:20:10.039 --> 00:20:13.519
might have happened, So why are they washing off his arms?

388
00:20:13.599 --> 00:20:16.319
But in that moment, it was kind of like he thought, well,

389
00:20:16.359 --> 00:20:18.359
maybe they were just checking him for wounds because there

390
00:20:18.400 --> 00:20:21.000
was blood. They didn't know whose blood it was. But

391
00:20:21.279 --> 00:20:24.240
in hindsight, this probably wasn't something that should have happened

392
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:26.640
before they could take photos of him in the condition

393
00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:29.799
that he was found. So he walked over and he

394
00:20:29.920 --> 00:20:32.519
retrieved Colin and he placed him in the back of

395
00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:36.039
his patrol unit as he was directed by a supervisor

396
00:20:36.680 --> 00:20:37.079
to do that.

397
00:20:37.279 --> 00:20:38.720
And while they waited to be told what do we

398
00:20:38.799 --> 00:20:39.519
need to do next?

399
00:20:39.880 --> 00:20:42.400
So in an offer, in an effort to calm Colin

400
00:20:42.519 --> 00:20:44.960
down or keep him calm in the car, they started

401
00:20:45.000 --> 00:20:48.039
making small talk. They talked about video games and just

402
00:20:48.400 --> 00:20:52.559
nothingness while he sat in the car. So homicide detective

403
00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:55.680
Danny Peters arrived at the home and he went inside.

404
00:20:56.480 --> 00:21:01.119
When he walked in, he was somewhat shot by how

405
00:21:01.240 --> 00:21:05.960
horrifically bloody the scene was. It was in stark direct

406
00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:09.200
contrast to the rest of the home, which was very

407
00:21:09.319 --> 00:21:13.039
clean and very organized, and then there's Kathy laying here

408
00:21:13.160 --> 00:21:16.799
with blood all over the ground. He noted that there

409
00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:20.920
was a pool of coagulated blood or almost solidified or

410
00:21:21.000 --> 00:21:24.680
drying blood up around Kathy's upper half, and there was

411
00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:27.759
also blood on the island in the center of the

412
00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:31.559
kitchen as well as on the cabinets, but the blood

413
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:34.119
didn't go up at all. The blood just kind of

414
00:21:34.160 --> 00:21:37.599
seemed to spatter along the lower portions, not very high

415
00:21:37.720 --> 00:21:40.000
up the walls. Now, I want to tell you too,

416
00:21:40.079 --> 00:21:42.039
while you're kind of thinking about what this crime scene

417
00:21:42.079 --> 00:21:45.599
looked like. This is a mobile home, so the kitchen

418
00:21:45.680 --> 00:21:49.160
area and the washer and dryer and the living room

419
00:21:49.559 --> 00:21:52.480
all were kind of really near each other, if you

420
00:21:52.559 --> 00:21:54.400
want to think of it in that manner.

421
00:21:55.319 --> 00:21:56.240
So he also noted that.

422
00:21:56.279 --> 00:21:59.799
There was a white towel and a gray shirt that

423
00:21:59.960 --> 00:22:02.720
was kind of bunched up next to Kathy's neck. But

424
00:22:03.319 --> 00:22:07.599
he also could see that very obvious, open, gaping wound

425
00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:09.000
on the right side of her neck.

426
00:22:10.680 --> 00:22:13.359
Her arms, her upper forearm.

427
00:22:13.079 --> 00:22:16.680
And her elbow was laying out kind of to her side,

428
00:22:16.720 --> 00:22:20.839
and it was slightly underneath the island counter that was

429
00:22:20.880 --> 00:22:21.400
in the center.

430
00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:23.519
There was blood near the.

431
00:22:23.640 --> 00:22:27.519
Dishwasher, but the dishwasher was on the opposite side of

432
00:22:27.599 --> 00:22:31.960
the island from where the body actually was laying, which

433
00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:35.680
was interesting, right, So scanning the countertops, he's kind of

434
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.000
looking around and trying to figure out what is going on.

435
00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:41.440
The detective noticed that there was a kitchen knife block

436
00:22:41.759 --> 00:22:43.839
right to the left of the stove, and all of

437
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:47.559
the knives were in that kitchen block except for one,

438
00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:51.480
and that was the one that was used to kill Kathy.

439
00:22:52.119 --> 00:22:54.079
It was laying on the floor in the very same

440
00:22:54.160 --> 00:22:57.839
room where Kathy was, but it was feet away, like

441
00:22:58.039 --> 00:23:00.839
down at the other end of the room, closer to

442
00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:02.839
the washer and dryer, and it looked as if it

443
00:23:02.920 --> 00:23:06.000
had been slid like someone shot it across the room

444
00:23:06.680 --> 00:23:08.720
and it was over by that washer and dryer. Now,

445
00:23:08.799 --> 00:23:13.759
the knife itself was twelve inches one foot long. This

446
00:23:13.920 --> 00:23:15.759
is a big ass knife, is what I'm trying to

447
00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:19.680
tell you. The blade of it was seven inches of

448
00:23:19.839 --> 00:23:23.039
that twelve So this is a big knife that had

449
00:23:23.119 --> 00:23:26.640
gone into her neck. And the knife was completely silver,

450
00:23:27.119 --> 00:23:28.880
the whole thing, with even the handle. It was completely

451
00:23:28.920 --> 00:23:32.640
a silver knife. And there was blood on the full

452
00:23:32.920 --> 00:23:34.680
length of the knife. It was a little thicker on

453
00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:37.160
the blade, but there was very clearly blood from one

454
00:23:37.240 --> 00:23:38.119
end of the knife.

455
00:23:38.000 --> 00:23:41.039
To the other. So he looks back at Kathy.

456
00:23:41.359 --> 00:23:44.559
He notices that she's barefoot, but it didn't look like

457
00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:47.480
she came in the house barefoot, because there was blood

458
00:23:47.599 --> 00:23:51.039
on the bottom of Kathy's bare feet, as well as

459
00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:54.920
a pair of under armor flip flops just knocked off

460
00:23:54.960 --> 00:23:57.519
of her feet but in the kitchen, but those two

461
00:23:58.039 --> 00:24:01.920
had blood on the bottoms of them. There were various

462
00:24:02.079 --> 00:24:06.119
marks and bruises all over Kathy. Her legs and her

463
00:24:06.240 --> 00:24:10.160
arms specifically had lots of marks and scratches and bruises,

464
00:24:10.680 --> 00:24:13.240
and then there was lots of blood near her arms

465
00:24:13.599 --> 00:24:17.400
and near that lower shelving area where she lay. So

466
00:24:17.599 --> 00:24:21.000
they lifted the island and moved it to see what

467
00:24:21.160 --> 00:24:24.400
was going underneath there, and that's where they could see

468
00:24:24.759 --> 00:24:26.799
clearly that Kathy had completely bled out.

469
00:24:26.880 --> 00:24:30.359
There was a ton of blood underneath that island.

470
00:24:31.400 --> 00:24:33.680
And he also saw what appeared to be a leather

471
00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:37.759
booksack that was used as a must have been used

472
00:24:37.799 --> 00:24:39.480
as a purse. It wasn't under the island, but he

473
00:24:39.599 --> 00:24:42.680
just noticed it next to Kathy that it was.

474
00:24:43.079 --> 00:24:45.000
It looked like it had been her purse, but it

475
00:24:45.240 --> 00:24:46.240
was covered in blood.

476
00:24:46.799 --> 00:24:49.799
So as they're processing the scene, they opened up that

477
00:24:50.039 --> 00:24:54.319
leather booksack and they noticed that so much blood it

478
00:24:54.480 --> 00:24:57.200
had not only covered the outside, but it was filled

479
00:24:57.240 --> 00:25:00.759
the inside of this book sack, and there was a

480
00:25:00.920 --> 00:25:03.519
makeup bag and a wallet that they were able to

481
00:25:03.599 --> 00:25:06.839
pull out of the book sack. It too was saturated

482
00:25:07.359 --> 00:25:10.200
in her blood. And I hate to keep saying the

483
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.880
word blood, but you have to understand, this was all

484
00:25:12.960 --> 00:25:16.519
the blood of her body that was out. But on

485
00:25:16.680 --> 00:25:20.119
top of the kitchen island was Kathy's cell phone, still

486
00:25:20.200 --> 00:25:23.640
laying there. On the screen of the phone, there was

487
00:25:23.680 --> 00:25:26.440
a notification that was still up. Even though there was

488
00:25:26.480 --> 00:25:29.079
a lock screen, there was this notification was still up

489
00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:31.599
on the screen and he could look at it and

490
00:25:31.759 --> 00:25:35.880
see that it included a missed call from Susan's mom

491
00:25:36.079 --> 00:25:39.480
or from her mom Susan, and there was a text

492
00:25:40.079 --> 00:25:44.160
from a Detective Lacy on the screen. Now it was

493
00:25:44.279 --> 00:25:46.720
just a preview of the text because like I said,

494
00:25:46.759 --> 00:25:49.599
the phone was locked, but on the screen he could

495
00:25:49.640 --> 00:25:52.880
read that it said I tried to call you. So

496
00:25:53.200 --> 00:25:56.519
they took the cell phones from not only taking Susan's

497
00:25:56.559 --> 00:25:59.839
off the counter, but they took or Kathy's of the

498
00:25:59.880 --> 00:26:02.480
caak excuse me. They took Kathy's cell phone into evidence.

499
00:26:02.799 --> 00:26:06.599
They took the grandmother Susan, who arrived later, they took

500
00:26:06.640 --> 00:26:09.480
her cell phone into evidence, and they also took Collin's

501
00:26:09.759 --> 00:26:14.119
cell phone into evidence. Now, on the screen of that phone,

502
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:17.119
like I told you, they could see that the mother

503
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:20.400
must have tried to call her and she never answered it.

504
00:26:20.720 --> 00:26:23.680
And then this detective was saying, I tried to call you.

505
00:26:24.279 --> 00:26:26.880
It was noted too after they took the cell phones,

506
00:26:26.920 --> 00:26:30.039
and he's kind of talking to everybody that Colin seemed

507
00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:35.359
to not be upset, but more than that, it was

508
00:26:35.400 --> 00:26:38.119
more like he was annoyed that the officer was even

509
00:26:38.160 --> 00:26:41.039
trying to ask him any questions, and he came across

510
00:26:41.079 --> 00:26:45.920
as really almost argumentative with the officers, which experience overall

511
00:26:46.839 --> 00:26:50.160
told this officer that it was strange because usually people

512
00:26:50.200 --> 00:26:54.839
would be either hysterical or crying or at least disturbed

513
00:26:55.680 --> 00:26:58.200
by a death, especially their mother, and they were in

514
00:26:58.279 --> 00:27:01.039
a fight and she fell on this night. But Colin

515
00:27:01.279 --> 00:27:05.519
wasn't following that typical pattern. Really, annoyance was how he

516
00:27:05.640 --> 00:27:08.680
came across. And I know that people can react differently

517
00:27:09.119 --> 00:27:10.680
to traumas. I'm not going to say that we all

518
00:27:10.680 --> 00:27:14.079
would react the same, but there is this standard that

519
00:27:14.160 --> 00:27:15.720
you usually see in.

520
00:27:15.880 --> 00:27:17.359
Some fashion or form.

521
00:27:18.279 --> 00:27:21.839
But even the firefighters on scene kind of screwed their

522
00:27:21.880 --> 00:27:23.079
faces up and looked at each other.

523
00:27:23.079 --> 00:27:25.480
Like he hadn't act them like we would expect him

524
00:27:25.519 --> 00:27:25.839
to act.

525
00:27:26.839 --> 00:27:29.240
So when the police started trying to question him more

526
00:27:29.599 --> 00:27:34.039
through his annoyance, he immediately became uncooperative and he asked

527
00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:38.559
to speak with a lawyer immediately off the top. All right,

528
00:27:39.039 --> 00:27:43.039
you've invoked that, we'll get you a lawyer. But while

529
00:27:43.160 --> 00:27:46.680
the detectives were outside and they're looking around, they realized,

530
00:27:46.759 --> 00:27:50.440
wait a minute, there's possible evidence outside of the home too,

531
00:27:51.279 --> 00:27:54.519
because the steps that were leading into the house, they

532
00:27:54.680 --> 00:27:59.240
found drops of blood on those steps. And then as

533
00:27:59.319 --> 00:28:01.480
they walked a little little further on the front of

534
00:28:01.559 --> 00:28:04.359
the trailer, they noticed that there was a flower bed

535
00:28:04.400 --> 00:28:06.240
there with some mulch in it, and there was an

536
00:28:06.319 --> 00:28:09.599
air pod in the mulch. So the detectives went ahead

537
00:28:09.640 --> 00:28:12.519
and they documented all of this and they were going

538
00:28:12.599 --> 00:28:14.759
to review it later when they tried to make.

539
00:28:14.680 --> 00:28:15.599
Sense of what was going on.

540
00:28:16.519 --> 00:28:19.160
So when it came time to process the scene forensically speaking,

541
00:28:19.599 --> 00:28:22.079
there was a forensic investigator by the name of Brandy

542
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:29.279
Bange that showed up and she noted that Colin was

543
00:28:29.480 --> 00:28:32.640
rather emotionless when she was dealing with him, and she

544
00:28:32.759 --> 00:28:34.799
dealt with him for about thirty minutes on the scene

545
00:28:34.839 --> 00:28:38.319
because she had to photograph everything, photograph him. She took

546
00:28:39.240 --> 00:28:42.960
blood swabs off of him. She did the swabs for

547
00:28:43.000 --> 00:28:46.079
his DNA through in his cheek. She noted that there

548
00:28:46.200 --> 00:28:49.039
was blood on his right ear, the right side of

549
00:28:49.119 --> 00:28:52.039
his glasses, his right arm had blood on it, there

550
00:28:52.119 --> 00:28:54.759
was blood on his shoes, it was on his shorts.

551
00:28:55.400 --> 00:28:58.680
And what she didn't know at that time when she

552
00:28:58.839 --> 00:28:59.400
was taking her.

553
00:28:59.400 --> 00:29:02.960
Photos was that she was taking those photos after he

554
00:29:03.039 --> 00:29:05.960
had already washed off a majority of the blood, which

555
00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:09.680
that officer did see happen when ems was cleaning him up.

556
00:29:10.519 --> 00:29:13.799
He had an abrasion on his knee, and he had

557
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:15.559
abrasions and scratches on.

558
00:29:15.720 --> 00:29:17.119
Both of his forearms.

559
00:29:18.000 --> 00:29:21.519
He had no wounds or cuts or damage whatsoever on

560
00:29:21.640 --> 00:29:24.000
the palms of his hands or on the back of

561
00:29:24.079 --> 00:29:26.359
his hands. Well about that time that all of this

562
00:29:26.559 --> 00:29:29.839
was taking place, neighbor Nancy Jones came back outside of

563
00:29:29.960 --> 00:29:32.839
her home from cleaning the kitchen and was shocked to

564
00:29:32.960 --> 00:29:35.680
see that there were police all outside of the house

565
00:29:35.960 --> 00:29:38.279
when she just when she went inside everything was fine.

566
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:41.119
So she made a phone call to Susan to say,

567
00:29:41.559 --> 00:29:43.960
oh my god, Susan, something's happened at your house. There's

568
00:29:44.039 --> 00:29:47.519
police here, there's crime scene tape up, and Susan said,

569
00:29:47.519 --> 00:29:49.240
oh my god. You know she was on her way,

570
00:29:49.359 --> 00:29:52.160
she'd be there in a couple hours. And so Miss

571
00:29:52.359 --> 00:29:55.119
Nancy yelled out to Colin. She looked at him and

572
00:29:55.200 --> 00:29:57.279
she saw him standing out there. He had read all

573
00:29:57.319 --> 00:29:59.359
over his arms, and she yelled out to him, Hey,

574
00:29:59.400 --> 00:30:02.880
your grandma's be here in just a little while. So

575
00:30:03.079 --> 00:30:06.880
she sits down on her porch and she continues to

576
00:30:06.960 --> 00:30:09.000
watch what's going on, and all she could think to

577
00:30:09.079 --> 00:30:12.440
herself was what in the world has happened in this

578
00:30:12.720 --> 00:30:18.519
last hour in our neighborhood, This quiet, older person neighborhood.

579
00:30:19.119 --> 00:30:23.319
This is wild. So it's about seven.

580
00:30:23.119 --> 00:30:26.680
O'clock when another neighbor, her name is missus Sally Bell,

581
00:30:27.319 --> 00:30:29.839
she pulls up and she's trying to get into her home,

582
00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:33.079
but she couldn't because the roadway was blocked off, and

583
00:30:33.240 --> 00:30:35.440
she was really scared. She didn't know what was going on,

584
00:30:35.880 --> 00:30:37.480
but she told the police, I need to get in here,

585
00:30:37.519 --> 00:30:39.799
and they said, no, you can't, we've got it blocked off.

586
00:30:39.839 --> 00:30:40.839
And she said, but I live here.

587
00:30:40.920 --> 00:30:43.599
That's my house right there across the street from where

588
00:30:43.599 --> 00:30:46.720
all that commotion's going on. So the officer moved his

589
00:30:46.839 --> 00:30:49.599
car so that she could pull into her driveway, and

590
00:30:49.759 --> 00:30:52.200
she and her husband, it turns out, were just returning

591
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:56.799
from church. So she's watching this happen, and she wondered

592
00:30:57.400 --> 00:30:59.839
if what was happening had anything to do with what

593
00:31:00.200 --> 00:31:03.799
she had seen earlier that day, just a few hours prior.

594
00:31:05.519 --> 00:31:07.480
So let me tell you about Miss Sally real quick.

595
00:31:07.519 --> 00:31:11.640
Miss Sally is a lovely little black woman with short

596
00:31:11.720 --> 00:31:16.079
gray hair. She's got her little black framed glasses, very sweet,

597
00:31:16.480 --> 00:31:20.039
very quiet in nature, and just a very put together

598
00:31:20.160 --> 00:31:24.960
little lady. And she earlier that day had walked into

599
00:31:25.039 --> 00:31:27.720
her kitchen and set her purse down on the kitchen counter,

600
00:31:28.039 --> 00:31:29.720
and she just so happened to look out of her

601
00:31:29.759 --> 00:31:32.920
front door window, and it was time for them to

602
00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:35.799
leave for church. So since it was almost time to go,

603
00:31:35.880 --> 00:31:37.680
she knew it was about four forty five that she

604
00:31:37.839 --> 00:31:41.440
looked out the window. Now her house was directly across

605
00:31:41.480 --> 00:31:44.799
the street from Susan's home, and so she watched as

606
00:31:44.839 --> 00:31:48.880
a lady came out of the house. So the woman

607
00:31:48.920 --> 00:31:50.559
had gone in the house, she saw her come out

608
00:31:50.640 --> 00:31:55.640
of the house down those little concrete steps, and behind

609
00:31:55.720 --> 00:31:58.400
her there was a young man that had come out

610
00:31:58.400 --> 00:32:01.799
of the house. So the woman had some clothes and

611
00:32:01.880 --> 00:32:05.880
some items in her hand, and the woman went around

612
00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:08.920
the back of this black jetta that was under the

613
00:32:08.960 --> 00:32:12.440
car port, and she threw open the door on the

614
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:14.920
passenger side of the jetta, and she was throwing the

615
00:32:15.000 --> 00:32:17.079
clothes and the items into the jetta while the young

616
00:32:17.200 --> 00:32:20.000
man stayed on the driver's side of the car. And

617
00:32:20.160 --> 00:32:23.279
she could tell that they were obviously talking over the

618
00:32:23.400 --> 00:32:25.960
hood of the car as the woman was putting the

619
00:32:26.000 --> 00:32:29.359
clothes into the car. And Miss Sally recognized the young

620
00:32:29.480 --> 00:32:31.920
man because she had seen him before. She knew that

621
00:32:32.079 --> 00:32:34.839
he was somehow related to the neighbor across the street.

622
00:32:35.440 --> 00:32:38.440
And she could not hear what they were saying, but

623
00:32:38.599 --> 00:32:40.799
she could tell that the woman and the young man

624
00:32:40.920 --> 00:32:44.519
were talking back and forth, pretty animated about whatever they

625
00:32:44.559 --> 00:32:47.559
were speaking about. And the woman was really animated using

626
00:32:47.599 --> 00:32:49.880
her hands to speak to the young man and was

627
00:32:50.079 --> 00:32:52.559
very you know, kind of I don't want to say aggressive,

628
00:32:52.599 --> 00:32:55.359
but very animated in her hands as she was speaking.

629
00:32:55.640 --> 00:32:57.880
And she walked around the back of the car back

630
00:32:57.920 --> 00:33:00.200
towards the young man while she was talking and she

631
00:33:00.279 --> 00:33:02.799
got closer, almost face to face with him, while she

632
00:33:02.920 --> 00:33:06.279
continued with her hand motions to talk to that young

633
00:33:06.359 --> 00:33:09.000
man in front of her, and it caught her attention

634
00:33:09.160 --> 00:33:12.000
so much that she watched them for just a moment

635
00:33:12.720 --> 00:33:16.680
when out of nowhere, the young man snatched that woman

636
00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:20.039
up by the back of her hair, by the ponytail,

637
00:33:20.640 --> 00:33:23.000
and it startled Miss Sallie when she saw him just

638
00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:25.759
snap and just snatch that woman up by her hair,

639
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:29.279
by her ponytail, and the woman screamed. She screamed so

640
00:33:29.599 --> 00:33:32.559
loud that Miss Sally could hear it from inside of

641
00:33:32.640 --> 00:33:35.519
her house. And the woman screamed, and she quoted what

642
00:33:35.640 --> 00:33:38.440
she heard. The woman scream, let go, you're hurting me

643
00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:42.440
as he was snatching up on her ponytail, and oh

644
00:33:42.519 --> 00:33:46.039
my god, Miss Sally thought, what is going on? But

645
00:33:46.160 --> 00:33:48.920
in that split moment as he grabbed her by the hair,

646
00:33:49.319 --> 00:33:52.799
he then began dragging the woman up those stairs, and

647
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:56.519
he drug her straight into the house by her hair,

648
00:33:58.079 --> 00:34:01.319
but minding her own business and going, my god, I

649
00:34:01.359 --> 00:34:03.599
don't know what is going on over there, and not

650
00:34:03.799 --> 00:34:08.840
wanting to mess with it. She kind of stunned stood

651
00:34:08.840 --> 00:34:11.400
there for a second. Then she yelled over to her husband.

652
00:34:11.679 --> 00:34:12.199
We needed to go.

653
00:34:12.360 --> 00:34:15.800
It's time for church, and she and her husband, never

654
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:18.199
imagining that they would return to their house shortly there

655
00:34:18.280 --> 00:34:20.800
later to see a coroner's van loading a woman's body,

656
00:34:21.320 --> 00:34:22.960
drove off and went to church.

657
00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:24.639
Well.

658
00:34:24.719 --> 00:34:29.000
Kathy's body was removed from the scene by doctor David Garavan.

659
00:34:29.079 --> 00:34:33.079
He's the medical examiner who would perform her autopsy, and

660
00:34:33.519 --> 00:34:38.320
during that autopsy he was seeing some very telling signs

661
00:34:38.400 --> 00:34:41.480
that there had been this had been a struggle. First

662
00:34:41.519 --> 00:34:43.400
of all, he noted that there was a sharp, force

663
00:34:43.599 --> 00:34:47.119
gaping wound to the right side of her neck. There

664
00:34:47.239 --> 00:34:51.800
was bruising to all of her limbs, her arms, her legs,

665
00:34:51.840 --> 00:34:54.840
there was bruising and scratches all over them. Her right

666
00:34:55.000 --> 00:34:57.559
shoulder had a wound to the back of it. Her

667
00:34:57.719 --> 00:35:00.760
left elbow was damaged as as well as both of

668
00:35:00.840 --> 00:35:02.960
her hands. And when he picked up her hands and

669
00:35:03.079 --> 00:35:07.000
looked at them, between her thumb and her index finger,

670
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:12.599
he found a gaping, insize wound, like a slice in

671
00:35:12.719 --> 00:35:16.280
that webbing between your fingers, the one that nobody wants

672
00:35:16.320 --> 00:35:19.079
to get even a paper cut. There it was just

673
00:35:19.559 --> 00:35:23.599
a gaping slice between her fingers. Now real quick, a

674
00:35:23.719 --> 00:35:26.760
stab wound is usually going to be deeper than it

675
00:35:26.920 --> 00:35:29.440
is long because you think of it's like a stabbing motion,

676
00:35:29.880 --> 00:35:32.440
but an insize wound is usually going to be longer

677
00:35:32.840 --> 00:35:36.039
than it is deep. They're opposites basically, basically because that

678
00:35:36.159 --> 00:35:39.760
insize wound across this is kind of like across the

679
00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:43.199
skin like a slice, where a stabbing is going to

680
00:35:43.239 --> 00:35:46.719
go into the skin. So I know a lot of

681
00:35:46.840 --> 00:35:50.360
us know or have heard the term defensive wounds, and

682
00:35:50.440 --> 00:35:55.039
that those happen whenever there's a struggle, But defensive wounds also,

683
00:35:55.119 --> 00:35:58.079
I think people sometimes miss this point that defensive wounds

684
00:35:58.119 --> 00:36:02.599
are usually present in certain locations too. And so what

685
00:36:02.760 --> 00:36:06.360
I mean is that as human beings, we're designed to survive. Okay,

686
00:36:06.440 --> 00:36:10.320
we're gonna fight back, even if it's instinctively when we

687
00:36:10.400 --> 00:36:11.280
are under attack.

688
00:36:11.400 --> 00:36:13.679
And it's typical that if someone.

689
00:36:13.920 --> 00:36:18.639
Is swinging something at you, you're gonna protect yourself with

690
00:36:18.880 --> 00:36:23.679
certain body parts. So for example, if you're being attacked

691
00:36:23.880 --> 00:36:25.920
on your upper half, it makes sense that you would

692
00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:29.519
throw up the outside of your arms, like your forearms.

693
00:36:29.559 --> 00:36:32.559
And so usually you'll see defensive wounds on the forearms

694
00:36:32.840 --> 00:36:35.920
or you'll see them on the hands. Because people will

695
00:36:36.039 --> 00:36:39.519
put the hands up, or sometimes people will grab at

696
00:36:39.559 --> 00:36:42.679
a knife, even though that's not smart, you just instinctively

697
00:36:42.719 --> 00:36:46.039
will do whatever you can to defend yourself. Also, if

698
00:36:46.119 --> 00:36:48.800
someone attacks you in your lower half, which we all

699
00:36:48.880 --> 00:36:51.360
know that's where our sex organs would be, it's common

700
00:36:51.400 --> 00:36:54.920
that people turn their thighs inward to try to protect

701
00:36:55.400 --> 00:36:58.199
that lower area, So you don't usually see defensive wounds

702
00:36:58.280 --> 00:37:01.320
on the insides of the thigh. You usually see defensive

703
00:37:01.360 --> 00:37:04.760
wounds on the outside of the thigh. And so those

704
00:37:04.840 --> 00:37:08.840
knife injuries that you see, or that Kathy had on

705
00:37:09.000 --> 00:37:13.480
her hand, he noted, is very consistent with someone who

706
00:37:13.599 --> 00:37:17.119
tries to reach up and grab a knife whenever someone

707
00:37:17.239 --> 00:37:19.400
is trying to stab at them, and then the knife

708
00:37:19.480 --> 00:37:23.079
just passes through their hand and it slices their hand.

709
00:37:24.119 --> 00:37:26.840
So the neck wound that he looked at, like I

710
00:37:26.960 --> 00:37:29.480
keep telling you, was very large and gaping, and I

711
00:37:29.599 --> 00:37:32.960
keep telling you it's gaping because it was wide open, okay,

712
00:37:33.400 --> 00:37:36.360
And it was about at the level of her where

713
00:37:36.400 --> 00:37:39.800
your Adam's apple would be, but midway to the side

714
00:37:39.840 --> 00:37:41.039
of the neck. So I'm trying to give you a

715
00:37:41.119 --> 00:37:43.679
good visual of the location there. And not only was

716
00:37:43.719 --> 00:37:48.000
it through or into the neck. But it also went

717
00:37:48.800 --> 00:37:51.880
from a front to a back angle as it went

718
00:37:51.920 --> 00:37:54.760
through her neck, and from left to right. So I

719
00:37:54.880 --> 00:37:58.000
want you to kind of gather what that would look

720
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:01.159
like through the neck, so as he's looking at it,

721
00:38:01.719 --> 00:38:03.400
this cut didn't just go.

722
00:38:03.639 --> 00:38:04.719
Into the neck, y'all.

723
00:38:05.400 --> 00:38:11.920
This wound transsected the trachea, meaning it passed through her esophagus,

724
00:38:12.320 --> 00:38:16.159
It went through her windpipe, It severed her vocal cords,

725
00:38:16.519 --> 00:38:20.360
and it went all the way through her neck. It

726
00:38:20.519 --> 00:38:25.599
went through her neck. A one foot knife went all

727
00:38:25.679 --> 00:38:29.079
the way through her neck. It literally poked out the

728
00:38:29.239 --> 00:38:33.079
other side. There was a hole in both sides. It

729
00:38:33.199 --> 00:38:37.599
went straight through her neck. And once you you cut

730
00:38:38.119 --> 00:38:40.880
through the throat and you cut through the nerves, like

731
00:38:41.079 --> 00:38:45.079
her neck was cut, you can no longer breathe, nor swallow,

732
00:38:45.239 --> 00:38:49.320
nor speak because the tube of the throat that goes

733
00:38:49.400 --> 00:38:55.480
down into the diaphragm hers was split. So she couldn't

734
00:38:55.519 --> 00:38:59.039
do anything other than probably reach up to grab her

735
00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:01.960
neck the tip of the knife for that to go

736
00:39:02.119 --> 00:39:04.360
through skin. And to put it into perspective, if a

737
00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:07.320
knife is very, very sharp, the tip of the knife

738
00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:10.719
will go through your skin a lot easier than you

739
00:39:10.760 --> 00:39:14.559
would probably think, But to go through the trachea, to

740
00:39:14.679 --> 00:39:17.679
go through all of the cartilage that holds up your

741
00:39:17.760 --> 00:39:20.960
head and all of that, that's gonna take a shitload

742
00:39:21.039 --> 00:39:23.239
of force. I know that's probably not a medical term

743
00:39:23.280 --> 00:39:25.360
you'll see on anything, but that's the best way I

744
00:39:25.440 --> 00:39:27.440
know how to describe this to you. This is not

745
00:39:27.719 --> 00:39:32.280
gonna be something simple. She had bruising on her calf,

746
00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:36.280
she had bruising on her shins, and based on the

747
00:39:36.519 --> 00:39:42.039
number and the location of the bruises, the doctor felt

748
00:39:42.119 --> 00:39:45.440
like these weren't accidental bruises from like working around the

749
00:39:45.559 --> 00:39:49.280
house or doing yard work or something like that, those

750
00:39:49.320 --> 00:39:51.280
little ones that we get, because there were so many,

751
00:39:51.960 --> 00:39:56.920
and they were also newer bruises, so they weren't older,

752
00:39:57.039 --> 00:39:59.440
and they weren't from doing something and accidentally.

753
00:39:59.440 --> 00:40:00.480
You know, hitting your shin.

754
00:40:01.159 --> 00:40:04.039
So the cause of death he would put was a

755
00:40:04.159 --> 00:40:08.159
stab wound to the neck, and the manner was homicide

756
00:40:08.199 --> 00:40:11.920
because this was clearly an unnatural death inflicted by her

757
00:40:12.679 --> 00:40:17.800
by someone else. So considering that Colin said Kathy fell

758
00:40:17.840 --> 00:40:22.360
on the knife during that altercation, the doctor was specifically asked, this,

759
00:40:24.119 --> 00:40:27.199
does it look like she fell on the knife, And

760
00:40:28.719 --> 00:40:32.119
his words were, I just simply would not believe that

761
00:40:32.960 --> 00:40:35.519
she could have fallen on the knife. And he said,

762
00:40:35.719 --> 00:40:38.239
if she would have fallen on the knife, this would

763
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:41.800
have had to have been the most extraordinary of circumstances

764
00:40:41.880 --> 00:40:44.960
he had ever experienced in his thirty years as a doctor,

765
00:40:45.800 --> 00:40:49.039
he said, in all of his years of doing this,

766
00:40:49.199 --> 00:40:52.920
which were many, he said, he had never done an

767
00:40:52.960 --> 00:40:56.559
autopsy on someone who accidentally fell on a knife and died.

768
00:40:57.079 --> 00:41:03.880
Ever think about that, so flat out he said, she

769
00:41:03.960 --> 00:41:06.239
didn't fall in the knife like this. This couldn't have happened.

770
00:41:06.239 --> 00:41:08.639
The angle isn't right. None of this is correct for

771
00:41:08.760 --> 00:41:11.719
what you're asking me could have happened. Now, I want

772
00:41:11.719 --> 00:41:14.679
to tell you something. Colin was six foot two, Kathy

773
00:41:14.880 --> 00:41:18.840
was five foot two, so he was much taller with

774
00:41:19.000 --> 00:41:22.960
a much longer armreach. So the knife was at a

775
00:41:23.360 --> 00:41:28.840
downward angle, and so it just wasn't possible for her

776
00:41:28.920 --> 00:41:32.800
to physically take for the knife to stab her in

777
00:41:32.840 --> 00:41:35.159
the way that Colin explained it to be. It looked

778
00:41:35.239 --> 00:41:37.199
more like it would have been a stabbing wound in

779
00:41:37.239 --> 00:41:42.440
a downward direction from someone holding the knife stabbing it downward. So,

780
00:41:42.559 --> 00:41:45.199
based on all of these findings, detectives continued to look

781
00:41:45.840 --> 00:41:49.000
further into the lives of Colin and Kathy to see

782
00:41:49.159 --> 00:41:53.239
what could have possibly provoked this altercation that ended up

783
00:41:53.320 --> 00:41:57.199
in such an absolute just tragedy. Now, when they took

784
00:41:57.280 --> 00:42:00.400
Kathy's phone, they found that this phone was a newer

785
00:42:00.519 --> 00:42:03.840
model and so local police had a limited ability to

786
00:42:03.920 --> 00:42:06.840
be able to process her phone. They could see her text,

787
00:42:06.880 --> 00:42:08.960
they could see her call log, but it was really

788
00:42:09.079 --> 00:42:12.880
limited to using the cellbright system that police use. So

789
00:42:13.079 --> 00:42:15.280
since they couldn't really get into the phone like they

790
00:42:15.320 --> 00:42:18.159
wanted to, they sent her phone off to Homeland Security

791
00:42:18.400 --> 00:42:21.119
who was able to further process the phone and able

792
00:42:21.159 --> 00:42:22.840
to get into it and get more data out of

793
00:42:22.880 --> 00:42:26.280
that phone. And Kathy's phone held a ton of photos,

794
00:42:27.360 --> 00:42:31.840
all of which pretty much showed a happy, smiling photo

795
00:42:31.920 --> 00:42:36.679
group of a son and his mother. There was lots

796
00:42:36.719 --> 00:42:39.880
of traveling photos together. They just seemed happy, they liked

797
00:42:40.079 --> 00:42:42.320
being around one another, and it just looked like any

798
00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:44.920
of our phones the photographs that were in there. But

799
00:42:45.199 --> 00:42:50.480
topping the investigator's curiosity wasn't really the pictures in Kathy's phone.

800
00:42:50.800 --> 00:42:53.559
It was actually the text that was from a police

801
00:42:53.599 --> 00:42:57.840
detective right before she was found dead that said, I

802
00:42:58.000 --> 00:43:02.079
tried to call you. So they looked into that number

803
00:43:02.559 --> 00:43:07.760
and the name of that detective was Lacey Zenoniani. I'm

804
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:11.960
gonna call her detective Lacey for pronunciation ease for me.

805
00:43:12.679 --> 00:43:13.960
But it was a detective Lacey.

806
00:43:14.800 --> 00:43:15.760
So what was.

807
00:43:15.840 --> 00:43:18.880
Lacey's job and why was she texting a woman who

808
00:43:19.000 --> 00:43:20.079
was dead shortly thereafter?

809
00:43:20.239 --> 00:43:22.519
Well, it turns out that.

810
00:43:24.119 --> 00:43:28.639
She worked in a position where she monitored troubled juveniles,

811
00:43:28.719 --> 00:43:33.119
ones that were struggling at home, typical like runaways, and

812
00:43:33.239 --> 00:43:36.840
she did basically this upkeep to help with intervention purposes,

813
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:39.199
to make sure that troubled youth we were on the

814
00:43:39.280 --> 00:43:44.199
right path. And her goals with Colin, because she was

815
00:43:44.320 --> 00:43:49.159
directly working with Colin, was to provide resources and to

816
00:43:49.480 --> 00:43:52.000
help families that are struggling with their kids, to help

817
00:43:52.039 --> 00:43:55.280
the parents too, because parenting's hard, and I think that

818
00:43:55.360 --> 00:43:57.760
we anyone who's been a parent for any amount of

819
00:43:57.800 --> 00:44:02.519
time will realize that teenagers is really hard and not

820
00:44:02.639 --> 00:44:05.679
all of us are equipped with the skills that it

821
00:44:05.760 --> 00:44:10.079
takes to deal with, especially strong minded and strong willed

822
00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:12.039
kids who don't want to do what.

823
00:44:12.199 --> 00:44:12.960
They're supposed to do.

824
00:44:13.639 --> 00:44:17.199
And so she had gotten involved with Colin and Cathy

825
00:44:17.679 --> 00:44:21.280
in September of twenty twenty three, the year prior, after

826
00:44:21.800 --> 00:44:27.440
a domestic violence call at their home. So the officer

827
00:44:27.559 --> 00:44:31.679
that had responded to that call was named Deputy Alexander Sharp,

828
00:44:32.239 --> 00:44:35.480
So he responded. He was radioed and dispatched to a

829
00:44:36.079 --> 00:44:38.440
domestic violence call that he was told was between a

830
00:44:38.599 --> 00:44:41.440
mother and a son and there was a grandmother there.

831
00:44:42.639 --> 00:44:46.639
So when Deputy Sharp got there, Colin was not there

832
00:44:46.760 --> 00:44:49.920
at the scene, but he did end up returning to

833
00:44:50.000 --> 00:44:52.719
the scene after the deputy got there. When Colin was there,

834
00:44:52.800 --> 00:44:55.440
he was calm and he was collected. He was just

835
00:44:55.519 --> 00:44:59.039
kind of almost I guess, stoic standing there when he arrived.

836
00:45:00.079 --> 00:45:03.159
On the other hand, the deputy said was very nervous.

837
00:45:03.559 --> 00:45:07.360
She was quiet, She seemed very scared and very teary

838
00:45:07.440 --> 00:45:10.639
eyed when talking with her, and she had injuries to

839
00:45:10.800 --> 00:45:13.719
her body. He noted that there was redness and bruising

840
00:45:13.920 --> 00:45:18.079
on her stomach and on the abdomen area, and she

841
00:45:18.400 --> 00:45:23.239
explained to the officer that, yeah, my son, Colin, he

842
00:45:23.480 --> 00:45:26.440
need me in the stomach like he need his mother,

843
00:45:26.639 --> 00:45:29.000
very hard into the stomach. And he saw that there

844
00:45:29.079 --> 00:45:32.039
was also some scrapes and some bruising on her hands

845
00:45:32.280 --> 00:45:36.039
from him stomping on her hand. So he's like, why

846
00:45:36.280 --> 00:45:38.239
was he needing you and stomping you in the first place,

847
00:45:38.559 --> 00:45:41.320
Like I need some more information, and Kathy explained to

848
00:45:41.400 --> 00:45:44.440
him that she had been fussing at him because of

849
00:45:44.519 --> 00:45:47.480
his bad behavior, and she told him, I'm taking away

850
00:45:47.519 --> 00:45:50.559
your xbox and I'm taking away your phone since you

851
00:45:50.679 --> 00:45:53.719
can't seem to behave and get your life together. She

852
00:45:53.880 --> 00:45:58.159
also told him that they had a Thanksgiving Day or

853
00:45:58.159 --> 00:46:01.320
a Thanksgiving week cruise planned as a family for the

854
00:46:01.400 --> 00:46:04.239
grandmother and her and Colin to go on, and she

855
00:46:04.400 --> 00:46:06.440
explained to him that they were going to cancel that

856
00:46:06.559 --> 00:46:09.079
and he would not be going on a cruise either.

857
00:46:09.239 --> 00:46:10.719
Because of the way that he was acting.

858
00:46:11.079 --> 00:46:13.599
And when she said you're not going on the cruise,

859
00:46:13.639 --> 00:46:16.119
I'm taking your xbox and I'm taking your cell phone away,

860
00:46:16.719 --> 00:46:21.159
Colin then stood up quickly from the dinner table, shoved

861
00:46:21.199 --> 00:46:22.400
his chair back, and he said.

862
00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:25.280
Well then let's just do this. Let's do it, and

863
00:46:25.480 --> 00:46:26.400
he attacked her.

864
00:46:27.320 --> 00:46:31.199
He need her his mother in the stomach and then

865
00:46:31.400 --> 00:46:33.760
stopped her hand as she tried to pick up his

866
00:46:33.920 --> 00:46:37.440
cell phone from the ground, and that's why her hand

867
00:46:37.639 --> 00:46:44.039
was injured. So this account seemed kind of huge, I

868
00:46:44.079 --> 00:46:45.920
guess for a teenager to do that to his own mother.

869
00:46:46.480 --> 00:46:50.480
So he also the officer questioned the grandmother there, which

870
00:46:50.559 --> 00:46:53.039
was Susan, and said, you know, can you tell me

871
00:46:53.320 --> 00:46:56.440
a little bit of what went on? And the grandmother,

872
00:46:56.559 --> 00:47:00.679
Susan's account lined up perfectly with what my Kathy had

873
00:47:00.760 --> 00:47:03.639
just said. She said, we were having dinner when all

874
00:47:03.719 --> 00:47:06.639
this took place, and exactly what I just told you

875
00:47:06.840 --> 00:47:11.000
is what Susan said. There were no injuries either on Colin,

876
00:47:11.079 --> 00:47:13.079
when when the officer looked at him, looked him over,

877
00:47:13.360 --> 00:47:15.960
there were no injuries. There was no marks on him, nothing.

878
00:47:16.639 --> 00:47:20.320
And so as they continue talking, Kathy told that officer, look,

879
00:47:20.440 --> 00:47:23.599
I'm afraid of my son. Please know that I'm afraid

880
00:47:23.639 --> 00:47:25.960
of him, and I really don't think I want him

881
00:47:26.000 --> 00:47:28.119
living with me any longer. And I don't want him

882
00:47:28.119 --> 00:47:31.039
near my mother because he's hurting us. He's dangerous.

883
00:47:31.880 --> 00:47:32.039
Now.

884
00:47:32.119 --> 00:47:35.760
Whenever the officer talked to Colin, Colin said, no, that's

885
00:47:35.800 --> 00:47:39.920
not what happened at all. My mom punched me. And

886
00:47:40.039 --> 00:47:42.599
when she got up and she punched me, that's when

887
00:47:42.639 --> 00:47:45.320
I grabbed her and I threw her off of me.

888
00:47:46.119 --> 00:47:48.400
But while Colin is explaining what all his mother had

889
00:47:48.440 --> 00:47:50.760
done to him. The officer again is looking at him

890
00:47:51.159 --> 00:47:55.199
and if she punched him, he wasn't seeing anything from.

891
00:47:55.079 --> 00:47:56.920
That or to indicate that that had happened.

892
00:47:57.559 --> 00:48:00.119
So the officer decided, and it was his discretion that

893
00:48:00.199 --> 00:48:03.599
he believed that Colin was the aggressor, and so he

894
00:48:03.760 --> 00:48:06.719
placed Colin under arrest and he placed him in the

895
00:48:06.800 --> 00:48:10.039
back of his cop car. Well, while that was happening,

896
00:48:11.880 --> 00:48:15.960
Kathy was then asked a few questions by police, and

897
00:48:16.199 --> 00:48:19.360
all of this was caught on body cam, but I

898
00:48:19.440 --> 00:48:22.400
want to give you a snippet of her responses. Whenever

899
00:48:22.519 --> 00:48:26.679
that officer was asking Kathy a few questions about her son,

900
00:48:28.000 --> 00:48:29.000
a couple of quick.

901
00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:31.159
Yes or no questions can almost fringing out before we go.

902
00:48:32.840 --> 00:48:35.760
And do you think he's capable of killing you because

903
00:48:35.800 --> 00:48:46.480
he have access to a farmer? And all right, okay,

904
00:48:46.840 --> 00:48:48.119
all right, well, thank you for your time.

905
00:48:48.880 --> 00:48:49.239
All right.

906
00:48:49.360 --> 00:48:52.880
So that's Kathy, in her own words, saying that she

907
00:48:53.119 --> 00:48:55.480
was afraid of her son and that, you know, things

908
00:48:55.639 --> 00:48:59.800
just weren't going well. So body camera continued to roll

909
00:48:59.880 --> 00:49:03.840
on the officer, and it also captured the police officer

910
00:49:03.920 --> 00:49:06.360
when he was walking back to the police car. When

911
00:49:06.400 --> 00:49:09.599
he got back to the police car, Grandma Susan was

912
00:49:09.880 --> 00:49:12.639
already at the cop car and she was talking to

913
00:49:12.760 --> 00:49:16.480
Colin before he was taken away, and that body cam

914
00:49:16.719 --> 00:49:20.239
caught that entire conversation. So I've pulled a little bit

915
00:49:20.280 --> 00:49:21.840
of that for you because I want you to listen

916
00:49:21.880 --> 00:49:24.840
to it for yourself. Go ahead and give this a listen.

917
00:49:24.960 --> 00:49:27.960
This is gonna be Grandma Susan talking to Colin after

918
00:49:28.039 --> 00:49:30.599
he's already been arrested and he's in the cop car.

919
00:49:32.159 --> 00:49:33.280
Why did you stand up?

920
00:49:34.159 --> 00:49:36.679
Why did you stay on a shore basic cars?

921
00:49:37.480 --> 00:49:38.400
No you didn't.

922
00:49:38.599 --> 00:49:41.440
He stood up, said Okay, let's steal it.

923
00:49:41.679 --> 00:49:42.320
Let's steal it.

924
00:49:44.280 --> 00:49:48.639
Yes you did. I was fairly well, I'm not a

925
00:49:48.719 --> 00:49:51.719
son of I'm not this murderer. I mentioned trying to

926
00:49:51.960 --> 00:49:55.760
just ceasefully using but paciently. No, exist to just figure

927
00:49:55.760 --> 00:49:57.880
yourselfing out. She can't. Don't need to shut up, chever,

928
00:49:58.119 --> 00:49:58.719
I want to shut up.

929
00:49:58.719 --> 00:49:59.159
She needed me.

930
00:50:00.360 --> 00:50:03.840
That's not when happened, Colin. That's not what happened.

931
00:50:04.239 --> 00:50:06.320
The f Sigy went into peacefully.

932
00:50:06.480 --> 00:50:08.760
Colossiests I did saying that you.

933
00:50:08.840 --> 00:50:10.760
Said that in the car of if not a dinner

934
00:50:10.880 --> 00:50:11.199
with her.

935
00:50:12.480 --> 00:50:14.880
So from that you can also tell that there is

936
00:50:15.000 --> 00:50:18.519
a stark contrast between what Colin says happened and what

937
00:50:18.639 --> 00:50:21.320
the two adults at the scene say had happened. So

938
00:50:21.480 --> 00:50:25.400
Colin was arrested for domestic abuse, battery, and against his

939
00:50:25.519 --> 00:50:29.760
mother and he was taken to jail. Now, the event

940
00:50:30.119 --> 00:50:33.559
was so violent, I guess you would say that the

941
00:50:33.679 --> 00:50:37.159
officer even felt it necessary to give the mom some

942
00:50:37.360 --> 00:50:40.119
paperwork that was that's called the Marcy's Law paperwork.

943
00:50:40.159 --> 00:50:41.639
Well, I want to explain it to you to understand

944
00:50:41.639 --> 00:50:41.920
what it is.

945
00:50:42.039 --> 00:50:45.239
But Marcy's Law was a law that was enacted after

946
00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:48.599
a girl named Marcelice Nicholas was a student at the

947
00:50:48.719 --> 00:50:52.480
University of California in Santa Barbara and she was stalked

948
00:50:52.559 --> 00:50:55.480
and murdered by her ex boyfriend back in nineteen eighty three.

949
00:50:56.000 --> 00:51:00.559
And after that happened, her own family was fronted at

950
00:51:00.599 --> 00:51:04.119
a grocery store by the killer a week after the

951
00:51:04.199 --> 00:51:06.440
murder because they did not even know that he had

952
00:51:06.480 --> 00:51:08.840
been released, and it scared them. It shocked them and

953
00:51:08.920 --> 00:51:13.719
everything that you can imagine. And so Marcie's Law came

954
00:51:13.760 --> 00:51:17.639
into play after that because victims should have rights and

955
00:51:17.719 --> 00:51:20.880
they should be notified of those rights. And those rights

956
00:51:20.920 --> 00:51:24.039
include things like being notified of court proceedings against an

957
00:51:24.039 --> 00:51:28.519
aggressor in a domestic situation, the right to have to

958
00:51:28.639 --> 00:51:32.159
have their safety considered, the victims safety considered whenever an

959
00:51:32.199 --> 00:51:35.800
aggressor makes bail or there are release decisions that are

960
00:51:35.840 --> 00:51:39.280
being considered, and they also have a right to be

961
00:51:39.400 --> 00:51:45.199
protected from these people. So that is why now Marcy's

962
00:51:45.239 --> 00:51:48.119
law paperwork is given to domestic abuse victims because they

963
00:51:48.159 --> 00:51:50.000
need to know these things. If you're not familiar with

964
00:51:50.039 --> 00:51:52.320
the court systems, or you don't have interactions with police,

965
00:51:52.360 --> 00:51:55.559
you may not know this. So they gave that paperwork.

966
00:51:55.559 --> 00:51:57.239
They felt it was serious enough for her to know

967
00:51:57.360 --> 00:52:01.519
these things. And after that incident, that's when Detective Lacey

968
00:52:01.920 --> 00:52:04.880
became involved with the family, the one that had texted

969
00:52:04.960 --> 00:52:07.400
on Cathy's cell phone, I tried to call you. That's

970
00:52:07.440 --> 00:52:10.320
when she became involved with this family and with their

971
00:52:10.400 --> 00:52:14.079
struggles to help Colin to remain on a better path

972
00:52:14.280 --> 00:52:17.360
so that he didn't end up in jail. So she

973
00:52:17.559 --> 00:52:21.320
worked with both Kathy and Susan, both in person and

974
00:52:21.519 --> 00:52:23.880
on the phone because she knew the grandmother was very

975
00:52:23.960 --> 00:52:28.360
involved in this family dynamic, and she said Detective Lacey

976
00:52:28.440 --> 00:52:31.880
said she would speak pretty much daily to this family,

977
00:52:32.199 --> 00:52:34.480
whether it was the parents or it was Colin or

978
00:52:34.639 --> 00:52:38.119
the grandparent. So Detective Lacey knew this for a fact.

979
00:52:38.559 --> 00:52:42.800
He knew she knew that Colin was an issue in

980
00:52:42.960 --> 00:52:47.360
that he had told her personally, like in person voice,

981
00:52:48.079 --> 00:52:50.960
that he would harm his mother and that he may

982
00:52:51.039 --> 00:52:53.519
not be able to control his behavior. And he even

983
00:52:53.559 --> 00:52:56.360
told her I may even kill my mom because he

984
00:52:56.400 --> 00:52:59.800
gets so mad at her. And he expressed this multiple

985
00:52:59.840 --> 00:53:03.960
time on different days over a period of a year

986
00:53:04.480 --> 00:53:09.159
that she was dealing with him. DCFS Child Protective Services. However,

987
00:53:09.159 --> 00:53:11.559
you want to look at that DCFS had been involved

988
00:53:11.599 --> 00:53:16.880
in the past too, because Kathy the mom was being

989
00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:20.400
aggressive towards other family members. Okay, so there's another layer

990
00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:23.559
to this or another element, But this was all before

991
00:53:23.840 --> 00:53:28.559
this incident that had taken place, the domestic abuse battery incident.

992
00:53:28.639 --> 00:53:30.599
And this was before obviously the fact that she was dead.

993
00:53:31.480 --> 00:53:34.320
But this incident happened whenever her kids were young, when

994
00:53:34.400 --> 00:53:38.599
Colin and his brother were young. So to say that

995
00:53:39.360 --> 00:53:43.159
Kathy was an absolute angel would be a lie. And

996
00:53:43.280 --> 00:53:46.400
I'm here to tell you a story. The whole story

997
00:53:46.840 --> 00:53:49.000
to the best of my ability as it went down.

998
00:53:49.519 --> 00:53:51.760
And so I'm gonna honor that and that I'm not

999
00:53:51.840 --> 00:53:53.840
gonna pick and choose what facts I tell you. I'm

1000
00:53:53.880 --> 00:53:56.760
going to tell you all of the facts. But although

1001
00:53:57.000 --> 00:54:01.639
she had been in trouble before, there was no doubt

1002
00:54:01.920 --> 00:54:06.599
ever that Kathy loved her children, even though there was

1003
00:54:06.719 --> 00:54:11.039
a history of instability with her. Kathy had her own demons,

1004
00:54:11.079 --> 00:54:13.679
and I'm not going to deny that, which included the

1005
00:54:13.800 --> 00:54:18.519
fact that she was abused by her ex husband, who,

1006
00:54:18.599 --> 00:54:21.119
by the way, is the guy that got her pregnant

1007
00:54:21.119 --> 00:54:23.880
at thirteen years old. And there's a backstory of that,

1008
00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:27.360
but basically, she was messing around with him, went to

1009
00:54:27.400 --> 00:54:32.079
a hotel, and got pregnant by him. Now, that relationship

1010
00:54:32.840 --> 00:54:37.400
was abusive, and she struggled with growing up very young

1011
00:54:37.559 --> 00:54:38.840
becoming a mom at thirteen.

1012
00:54:39.039 --> 00:54:39.800
Can you imagine.

1013
00:54:40.760 --> 00:54:43.199
But not only was she struggling in that aspect, but

1014
00:54:43.320 --> 00:54:46.159
she was married to the very guy that got her

1015
00:54:46.199 --> 00:54:50.559
pregnant at thirteen, and he mistreated her. They were not

1016
00:54:50.679 --> 00:54:53.360
a good match. This was an accidental pregnancy that resulted

1017
00:54:53.400 --> 00:54:57.199
in a marriage, and the fighting and the bickering and

1018
00:54:57.280 --> 00:55:00.719
the mistreatment was very clear that that happened. And there's

1019
00:55:00.760 --> 00:55:04.000
a report that shows that Kathy stabbed her ex husband,

1020
00:55:04.119 --> 00:55:06.079
Chuck with a corkscrew.

1021
00:55:06.159 --> 00:55:08.599
In front of Colin as well.

1022
00:55:08.719 --> 00:55:12.559
As they went outside, the argument just got bigger and

1023
00:55:12.599 --> 00:55:15.480
bigger and bigger, and she ended up penning her ex

1024
00:55:15.639 --> 00:55:20.239
husband with her car like up against the house. Okay,

1025
00:55:20.320 --> 00:55:23.400
and clearly that is violent and that should not happen.

1026
00:55:23.480 --> 00:55:26.519
So I'm telling you that there is instability here. But

1027
00:55:26.639 --> 00:55:29.559
I also want to add that Chuck, her ex husband,

1028
00:55:30.039 --> 00:55:33.280
was a problematic character himself, and I feel compelled to

1029
00:55:33.360 --> 00:55:36.039
add all of that so you get the full picture here.

1030
00:55:37.119 --> 00:55:40.480
So Kathy grew up, though she had her children, she

1031
00:55:40.639 --> 00:55:43.760
grew up and she became an English teacher by trade,

1032
00:55:44.159 --> 00:55:47.199
and her students absolutely loved her.

1033
00:55:47.280 --> 00:55:50.639
There's no question about this. They loved her so much.

1034
00:55:50.800 --> 00:55:53.760
And she loved her students so much that she had

1035
00:55:53.840 --> 00:55:56.119
one student one time that had such a bad home

1036
00:55:56.199 --> 00:56:00.159
life that she allowed that child to move in with

1037
00:56:00.360 --> 00:56:03.960
them temporarily just to help that kid out. Even though

1038
00:56:04.079 --> 00:56:06.880
her home life was in shambles, she still allowed this

1039
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:09.320
kid to come home and tried to give some sense

1040
00:56:09.360 --> 00:56:11.880
of normalcy to this child who was just struggling so

1041
00:56:12.079 --> 00:56:17.519
terribly in that child's home life. Now, how was she

1042
00:56:17.719 --> 00:56:21.079
repaid for this goodness that she tried to help this

1043
00:56:21.239 --> 00:56:26.199
child with. Well, Chuck, the ex husband, allegedly had an

1044
00:56:26.280 --> 00:56:32.599
inappropriate relationship with that minor female child that she moved

1045
00:56:32.639 --> 00:56:35.199
into their home and was trying to help out. And

1046
00:56:35.480 --> 00:56:38.760
this just threw her over the edge. It made her

1047
00:56:38.840 --> 00:56:42.199
absolutely sick. Not only that, but it broke her heart.

1048
00:56:42.760 --> 00:56:46.719
And so all of this was gasoline on fire in

1049
00:56:46.840 --> 00:56:50.119
a life that toxic is just an understatement of what

1050
00:56:50.280 --> 00:56:52.679
is going on here. I mean, no wonder they divorced,

1051
00:56:52.880 --> 00:56:55.320
It's just nothing good is going on here. But it

1052
00:56:55.440 --> 00:57:00.800
wasn't for lack of trying. Kathy worked so hard with Colin,

1053
00:57:01.840 --> 00:57:04.920
and she wanted him to succeed. For example of this,

1054
00:57:05.440 --> 00:57:08.159
not just saying that to be nice. For example, in

1055
00:57:09.000 --> 00:57:13.800
the year that he was with her before she died,

1056
00:57:15.079 --> 00:57:19.159
he was three years behind in school because he had

1057
00:57:19.199 --> 00:57:23.000
been living with his dad for those years. He was

1058
00:57:23.360 --> 00:57:27.280
three years behind where he should have been academically. She

1059
00:57:27.559 --> 00:57:29.599
was able in the year that he when he came

1060
00:57:29.639 --> 00:57:31.360
in he moved in with her, she was able in

1061
00:57:31.519 --> 00:57:35.239
one year to move him up and to meet grade

1062
00:57:35.360 --> 00:57:38.119
level she was a teacher at heart, and she did.

1063
00:57:38.599 --> 00:57:41.039
She tried her best to pour into her son. She

1064
00:57:41.239 --> 00:57:44.280
believed in him. And my personal feelings, which you may

1065
00:57:44.360 --> 00:57:48.159
not care about, but my personal feelings are that Kathy

1066
00:57:48.360 --> 00:57:52.480
was a mix of emotional issues mixed with a bit

1067
00:57:52.559 --> 00:57:55.400
of I guess what you would call arrested development. And

1068
00:57:55.559 --> 00:57:58.119
I think that that comes from becoming pregnant at thirteen

1069
00:57:58.159 --> 00:58:00.760
as a child and becoming an adult when you're not

1070
00:58:00.840 --> 00:58:04.280
even an adult yourself, and growing up together basically with

1071
00:58:04.400 --> 00:58:08.320
your children. That's my personal feeling, and I did a

1072
00:58:08.360 --> 00:58:12.440
lot of research on this, and part of Kathy's issue

1073
00:58:13.039 --> 00:58:16.400
in that respect when it came to parenting was that

1074
00:58:16.519 --> 00:58:18.800
she would just get in her own way sometimes and

1075
00:58:18.880 --> 00:58:21.400
it's almost frustrating, but she would get in her own way.

1076
00:58:21.400 --> 00:58:22.679
And I'm gonna give you an example of what I

1077
00:58:22.800 --> 00:58:23.920
mean when.

1078
00:58:23.840 --> 00:58:27.559
Deputy Christopher Ellis arrived to the house after that domestic

1079
00:58:28.119 --> 00:58:34.360
violent situation. When the deputy arrived, Colin acted very sheepish

1080
00:58:35.119 --> 00:58:37.280
and says, you know, I didn't want to hurt anybody,

1081
00:58:37.440 --> 00:58:39.880
and you know, blah blah blah blah, blah blah blah,

1082
00:58:39.920 --> 00:58:42.400
and this is just so horrible, and I'm a victim here.

1083
00:58:42.840 --> 00:58:47.480
But if you know Colin, like his probation officer knew Colin,

1084
00:58:48.239 --> 00:58:50.760
then you would realize that that was part of the

1085
00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:55.000
game that Colin played. Because Colin would show respect to

1086
00:58:55.239 --> 00:58:58.480
hire authority such as police or someone that could do

1087
00:58:58.639 --> 00:59:01.599
him something. If someone had money, for example, that they

1088
00:59:01.639 --> 00:59:05.320
would spend on him, if they could do something for Colin.

1089
00:59:05.880 --> 00:59:11.679
He was sheepish and mild and whatever, but he would

1090
00:59:11.800 --> 00:59:16.039
turn on you in a second in terms of respect

1091
00:59:16.159 --> 00:59:20.519
and everything if he did not get his way. So

1092
00:59:21.039 --> 00:59:25.360
this was proven, okay, because Colin acted so mild when

1093
00:59:25.400 --> 00:59:28.440
that male adult showed up, that male cop showed up

1094
00:59:28.480 --> 00:59:31.440
in that domestic violence situation. But once he was sent

1095
00:59:31.559 --> 00:59:33.960
to jail and he wasn't getting his way and he

1096
00:59:34.079 --> 00:59:37.920
was going to be locked up, his tune completely changed.

1097
00:59:39.480 --> 00:59:41.440
And this is what I mean right now. When I

1098
00:59:41.519 --> 00:59:43.639
say Kathy got in her own way, hear me out.

1099
00:59:44.280 --> 00:59:48.480
So Colin was nice and polite when his mother bought

1100
00:59:48.559 --> 00:59:52.320
him coffee, or when his mother bought him video games

1101
00:59:52.800 --> 00:59:56.519
or his Xbox or his computer, or when she bought

1102
00:59:56.599 --> 00:59:59.480
him that brand new Jetta that he drove. He was

1103
00:59:59.679 --> 01:00:03.280
very when that happened, but he hated being told what

1104
01:00:03.440 --> 01:00:06.039
to do, so he would show tons of love when

1105
01:00:06.079 --> 01:00:09.159
he was getting things, but the second that he did

1106
01:00:09.239 --> 01:00:12.679
not comply with basic requests at his house, like clean

1107
01:00:12.760 --> 01:00:15.000
your room or I need you to go wash those dishes,

1108
01:00:15.639 --> 01:00:20.199
he would turn into a complete ass. And so Cathy

1109
01:00:21.039 --> 01:00:24.159
couldn't seem to understand this. She did not seem to

1110
01:00:24.400 --> 01:00:28.360
grasp the fact that her love for him was unconditional,

1111
01:00:28.679 --> 01:00:32.960
but his love for her was absolutely conditional. It was

1112
01:00:33.079 --> 01:00:35.480
only when he was getting something, or he was having

1113
01:00:35.599 --> 01:00:38.679
fun or going on a vacation or getting a car,

1114
01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:42.280
that he was so loving towards her, and she took

1115
01:00:42.480 --> 01:00:47.800
the bait every damn time. Then she would become overwhelmed

1116
01:00:47.800 --> 01:00:51.880
with anger whenever he would defy her, or because the

1117
01:00:52.000 --> 01:00:54.320
flip flop of the way he treated her was just

1118
01:00:54.440 --> 01:00:57.719
so emotionally jarring to her, someone who already had all

1119
01:00:57.760 --> 01:00:59.000
of these emotional troubles.

1120
01:00:59.360 --> 01:01:01.760
She just did know how to deal with it. And

1121
01:01:01.920 --> 01:01:04.679
so Kathy was abused by her ex, and.

1122
01:01:04.800 --> 01:01:07.760
Now her own son is showing some of that same

1123
01:01:07.880 --> 01:01:12.199
abusive type of manipulation in behavior, but she just couldn't

1124
01:01:12.199 --> 01:01:15.360
see what it was. And so when Colin was sent

1125
01:01:15.480 --> 01:01:19.760
to this Charlotte Behavioral Health Center for his misbehavior under

1126
01:01:19.800 --> 01:01:23.119
what's called a Baker Act. Okay and real quick, the

1127
01:01:23.239 --> 01:01:28.199
criteria to meet for a Baker Act commitment is having

1128
01:01:28.320 --> 01:01:32.079
either mental illness, you're exhibiting bizarre behavior that you may

1129
01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:36.400
pose a risk of harm to someone else or even yourself,

1130
01:01:37.360 --> 01:01:40.239
or refusing to receive treatment even though you understand that

1131
01:01:40.280 --> 01:01:42.559
there are high risks here and you're not behaving correctly.

1132
01:01:43.039 --> 01:01:46.159
If that's what can get you committed under a Baker Act, well,

1133
01:01:46.679 --> 01:01:50.559
Charlotte Behavioral Health was only more of an acute or

1134
01:01:50.639 --> 01:01:54.280
a short term facility for mental health issues, and it

1135
01:01:54.400 --> 01:01:56.400
wasn't long term, which means they would only hold you

1136
01:01:56.519 --> 01:02:00.159
for about seventy two hours to stabilize your behavior or

1137
01:02:00.239 --> 01:02:05.320
your mood. Well, when Colin was sent there, they then

1138
01:02:06.400 --> 01:02:11.920
released him. So the facility just a few hours after

1139
01:02:12.079 --> 01:02:14.360
the domestic violence thing, and they brought him there and

1140
01:02:14.480 --> 01:02:17.239
they did admit him under that Baker Act because of

1141
01:02:17.440 --> 01:02:20.559
being harmful to other people or put and potentially going

1142
01:02:20.599 --> 01:02:24.159
to do more harm. When the facility went to release him,

1143
01:02:24.719 --> 01:02:27.119
they were so worried that he was going to be

1144
01:02:27.159 --> 01:02:31.000
an issue that they called an officer to assist with

1145
01:02:31.119 --> 01:02:33.880
his release. Like they're letting him out, and they wanted

1146
01:02:33.920 --> 01:02:37.000
an officer to be there. So that officer was Sergeant

1147
01:02:37.079 --> 01:02:40.360
Michael Snyder. So when he got to that crisis stabilization

1148
01:02:40.519 --> 01:02:44.599
unit at that Charlotte Behavioral Health Center, he says that

1149
01:02:45.159 --> 01:02:47.960
usually when people are arrest, first of all, there's usually

1150
01:02:48.039 --> 01:02:50.920
not an issue. They get released, they walk out, and

1151
01:02:51.000 --> 01:02:53.679
they're picked up by whomever is picking him up, and

1152
01:02:53.800 --> 01:02:56.119
then they just go home. But that was not the

1153
01:02:56.280 --> 01:03:01.000
case whenever he showed up for Colin's release. So when

1154
01:03:01.119 --> 01:03:04.320
he got there, Colin walked straight out of the door

1155
01:03:04.800 --> 01:03:08.719
and walked straight to Officer Snyder, like directly to him,

1156
01:03:08.800 --> 01:03:11.639
and said, I need to be a Baker, act committed. Again,

1157
01:03:11.880 --> 01:03:14.400
those were his own his words to the officer. He

1158
01:03:14.519 --> 01:03:17.480
was very matter of fact and very mission oriented when

1159
01:03:17.519 --> 01:03:20.880
he addressed that officer, and the officer says, time out.

1160
01:03:21.000 --> 01:03:22.639
You're just not being released. Why do you need to

1161
01:03:22.679 --> 01:03:25.360
go back in? And he told that officer because he

1162
01:03:25.480 --> 01:03:28.039
was either going to kill himself or he was going

1163
01:03:28.119 --> 01:03:31.639
to kill his mother. Well, the officer was very surprised

1164
01:03:32.199 --> 01:03:33.679
and he said, okay, well, how do you plan on

1165
01:03:33.800 --> 01:03:36.400
doing this? Trying to kind of gather more information on

1166
01:03:36.760 --> 01:03:41.800
his thought process here, and Colin didn't miss a beat.

1167
01:03:42.079 --> 01:03:45.199
He told the officer exactly how he planned to kill

1168
01:03:45.280 --> 01:03:48.960
his mother. He said, I don't know exactly which way,

1169
01:03:49.400 --> 01:03:51.840
but I will find a way, and then he listed

1170
01:03:51.920 --> 01:03:55.039
out the matter of fact ways he probably would plan

1171
01:03:55.159 --> 01:03:57.000
to do that. He said, I'm either going to throw

1172
01:03:57.039 --> 01:03:58.960
her out of a moving car, or I'm going to

1173
01:03:59.039 --> 01:04:03.400
shoot her, or I'm gonna stabber. He didn't ever say

1174
01:04:03.800 --> 01:04:06.679
that he was afraid of his mother. He didn't say

1175
01:04:07.480 --> 01:04:10.440
that she had hurt him or anything like that. He

1176
01:04:10.599 --> 01:04:13.719
told that officer that I don't know how I'm gonna

1177
01:04:13.760 --> 01:04:16.239
behave if she upsets me.

1178
01:04:16.800 --> 01:04:19.719
And that's very different. I want you to understand the

1179
01:04:19.719 --> 01:04:20.159
difference here.

1180
01:04:20.199 --> 01:04:21.760
She didn't say. He didn't say I'm afraid of my mom.

1181
01:04:21.800 --> 01:04:23.800
I want to go back into the facility. He came

1182
01:04:23.840 --> 01:04:25.079
out of the facility and said, I want to go

1183
01:04:25.159 --> 01:04:27.199
back in because I'm going to kill my mom. Are

1184
01:04:27.239 --> 01:04:30.679
you following me here? That's so different, And he continued

1185
01:04:30.719 --> 01:04:34.679
to be adamant that he needed to be Baker acted again,

1186
01:04:35.519 --> 01:04:38.360
and you know what they did. They turned right back

1187
01:04:38.440 --> 01:04:41.199
around and they readmitted him back into the hospital because

1188
01:04:41.199 --> 01:04:42.599
they were very afraid that he was going to go

1189
01:04:42.719 --> 01:04:47.360
hurt his mother. So basically he got his way. His

1190
01:04:47.599 --> 01:04:51.119
mother couldn't tell him what to do in the hospital.

1191
01:04:51.480 --> 01:04:53.039
I hope this is all kind of making sense, the

1192
01:04:53.079 --> 01:04:57.039
way these dominoes are kind of falling. Well, when he

1193
01:04:57.119 --> 01:04:59.559
was released from that facility again because again it's short term,

1194
01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:02.519
he was sent to a place called Sandy Pines, which

1195
01:05:02.559 --> 01:05:06.119
is a residential facility for mental health help. This is

1196
01:05:06.159 --> 01:05:09.280
a sixty to ninety day program. But like I said

1197
01:05:09.320 --> 01:05:12.480
a minute ago, Sandy just got in her own way

1198
01:05:12.800 --> 01:05:15.360
as far as this parenting went. Because Colin when he

1199
01:05:15.400 --> 01:05:17.960
got there, didn't want to stay there, and so he

1200
01:05:18.119 --> 01:05:20.840
was being all pitiful and all sweet and I don't

1201
01:05:20.880 --> 01:05:25.599
want to be here, and so getting that love from him,

1202
01:05:26.320 --> 01:05:29.320
Sandy caved in and she went and checked him out

1203
01:05:29.320 --> 01:05:33.440
of the facility only three days after he was put there.

1204
01:05:35.119 --> 01:05:37.119
I know, right now you're going, well, damn, I mean,

1205
01:05:37.880 --> 01:05:41.039
you know that wasn't very smart. Well, of course, you

1206
01:05:41.119 --> 01:05:44.000
know it doesn't sound smart at all. But think about

1207
01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:46.719
people who love people who are drug addicts. How common

1208
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:49.280
is the story of addiction where people give them money

1209
01:05:49.360 --> 01:05:52.440
and give them somewhere to sleep and basically are helping

1210
01:05:52.559 --> 01:05:55.159
them even though they're trying to love them. But you

1211
01:05:55.280 --> 01:05:58.199
can't love people to death, you know, it doesn't work.

1212
01:05:58.880 --> 01:06:01.000
And she checked him out well, but that's because he

1213
01:06:01.159 --> 01:06:04.559
was showing her love and attention that she so desperately

1214
01:06:04.679 --> 01:06:08.559
wanted from her son. So that Detective Lacey that was

1215
01:06:08.599 --> 01:06:12.679
working with Colin and Kathy knew him and her long

1216
01:06:12.840 --> 01:06:15.840
enough that she knew their quirks and their issues as

1217
01:06:15.880 --> 01:06:18.119
far as what was going on in that household, and

1218
01:06:18.440 --> 01:06:21.199
her opinion was that, and she told the detective of

1219
01:06:21.360 --> 01:06:25.519
Kathy's death that, you know, Kathy would listen at first

1220
01:06:25.719 --> 01:06:27.840
to my advice whenever I would give that in dealing

1221
01:06:27.880 --> 01:06:31.360
with Colin and his poor behavior, but then it just

1222
01:06:31.400 --> 01:06:34.280
seemed to never failed that Kathy would always give in

1223
01:06:34.760 --> 01:06:38.159
even when he had this poor behavior. She clearly loved

1224
01:06:38.199 --> 01:06:41.599
her son, even though he told her, I AM going

1225
01:06:41.679 --> 01:06:48.360
to kill you. She just loved her child. So Detective

1226
01:06:48.440 --> 01:06:50.599
Lacey kept trying to talk some sent into her, being like, look,

1227
01:06:50.639 --> 01:06:53.079
he's threatening to hurt you, he's already hurt you. You

1228
01:06:53.199 --> 01:06:54.760
need to listen to what I'm telling you as far

1229
01:06:54.800 --> 01:06:57.760
as my advice goes. And Kathy looked that detective in

1230
01:06:57.880 --> 01:07:01.199
the eye prior to her death and said, I can

1231
01:07:01.280 --> 01:07:04.119
accept that fate if I at least get to spend

1232
01:07:04.199 --> 01:07:09.679
more time with my boy. That is so tragic to

1233
01:07:11.039 --> 01:07:13.119
be afraid of your own child, but to love them

1234
01:07:13.199 --> 01:07:15.679
so much that you are willing to just risk injury

1235
01:07:16.440 --> 01:07:19.320
to be with them. My heart goes out to anyone

1236
01:07:19.360 --> 01:07:24.199
who has either children with mental illness or violent children,

1237
01:07:24.280 --> 01:07:25.920
because you just are never gonna.

1238
01:07:25.760 --> 01:07:29.480
Not love your baby, not if you're a mom, you know,

1239
01:07:31.119 --> 01:07:31.360
And she.

1240
01:07:31.400 --> 01:07:33.679
Would just think back, you know, we had such good

1241
01:07:33.719 --> 01:07:36.400
times together. We love going on trips. Their favorite thing,

1242
01:07:36.480 --> 01:07:37.679
or her favorite thing to do with him, was that

1243
01:07:37.920 --> 01:07:40.519
they would watch movies together. They loved going to the movies.

1244
01:07:41.159 --> 01:07:45.079
And while Kathy was trying her best to mother Colin,

1245
01:07:46.599 --> 01:07:48.880
one of the other main issues was that Colin had

1246
01:07:49.039 --> 01:07:50.639
no respect.

1247
01:07:50.280 --> 01:07:51.519
For her none.

1248
01:07:51.880 --> 01:07:53.800
He had no respect for her as a person, as

1249
01:07:53.840 --> 01:07:56.639
a mother, and he had no respect for her rules.

1250
01:07:57.000 --> 01:08:01.239
So Kathy was really struggling with the parental control because

1251
01:08:01.519 --> 01:08:04.679
he did not respect her authority in any way. And

1252
01:08:04.760 --> 01:08:07.039
the reason that there was a text on Cathy's phone

1253
01:08:07.079 --> 01:08:09.800
from Detective Lacey the day of her death was because

1254
01:08:09.880 --> 01:08:13.199
Cathy had tried to call her over an issue she

1255
01:08:13.400 --> 01:08:16.439
was having with Colin that very day, but by the

1256
01:08:16.560 --> 01:08:20.479
time Detective Lacey returned the call, Kathy didn't answer, and

1257
01:08:21.800 --> 01:08:24.079
by now we all know she couldn't because she was dead.

1258
01:08:24.800 --> 01:08:28.039
So basically, Colin, this was the issue that was being had.

1259
01:08:28.439 --> 01:08:31.800
Colin had stayed with his grandmother whenever he and his

1260
01:08:31.920 --> 01:08:34.199
mother weren't getting along, he would always deflect back to

1261
01:08:34.239 --> 01:08:38.439
his grandma. Well, the day before he was arrested for

1262
01:08:38.560 --> 01:08:42.199
the battery against his mother, Colin went and stayed the

1263
01:08:42.319 --> 01:08:46.600
night with his grandmother, Susan. Well, Cathy called her mom

1264
01:08:47.079 --> 01:08:49.399
and said, you've got to return Colin the next day

1265
01:08:49.439 --> 01:08:53.079
to me. So when they got together for dinner, that's

1266
01:08:53.119 --> 01:08:56.359
whenever that battery occurred. Okay, if that's making sense, I'm

1267
01:08:56.399 --> 01:08:59.560
kind of flashing back. So the courts put into play

1268
01:09:00.119 --> 01:09:02.520
a thing called a seven fifty one plan, which is

1269
01:09:02.640 --> 01:09:04.720
basically it's signed in front of a notary, it's filed

1270
01:09:04.720 --> 01:09:06.439
with the courts, and a judge has to sign off

1271
01:09:06.479 --> 01:09:09.000
on it. But a seven to fifty one plan basically

1272
01:09:09.079 --> 01:09:12.720
said that both Kathy and her mother, Susan, both had

1273
01:09:12.840 --> 01:09:16.439
custody of Colin, and that basically they both could make

1274
01:09:16.520 --> 01:09:20.159
decisions for him without the other's consent, and it just

1275
01:09:20.239 --> 01:09:23.159
made sense because there was so much turmoil between the

1276
01:09:23.279 --> 01:09:28.800
family dynamic. However, the day of Kathy's death, she was

1277
01:09:29.119 --> 01:09:33.600
very upset with her mother, Susan, because Colin had gone

1278
01:09:33.640 --> 01:09:37.479
to stay at Susan's house. But Kathy's issue with that

1279
01:09:38.239 --> 01:09:42.600
was that Colin was staying alone at Cathy's house and

1280
01:09:42.800 --> 01:09:45.800
Kathy was three hours away from him, so he was

1281
01:09:45.880 --> 01:09:50.159
being unsupervised. So what had happened was Susan had some

1282
01:09:50.239 --> 01:09:52.439
other properties, Susan went to go stay at Wonder for

1283
01:09:52.560 --> 01:09:56.399
other properties that she owned, and considering everything that we

1284
01:09:56.520 --> 01:09:59.800
know so far about colin poor choices and his misbehavior,

1285
01:10:00.079 --> 01:10:02.560
I have to agree with Kathy about this. He cannot

1286
01:10:02.640 --> 01:10:07.079
go stay a teenager unsupervised at your house whenever it's

1287
01:10:07.119 --> 01:10:09.359
a custody agreement, meaning that he needs to be in

1288
01:10:09.439 --> 01:10:11.800
your custody, not by himself.

1289
01:10:12.479 --> 01:10:15.800
So here's a little bit more info on this family.

1290
01:10:17.119 --> 01:10:21.600
After Colin's parents divorced, he chose to live with his

1291
01:10:21.760 --> 01:10:25.479
dad in Oklahoma for three years before he moved in

1292
01:10:26.000 --> 01:10:28.600
with his mom in Florida in Port Charlotte.

1293
01:10:29.359 --> 01:10:31.159
So while he would chose to live with his dad,

1294
01:10:31.960 --> 01:10:32.960
Kathy missed.

1295
01:10:32.720 --> 01:10:36.159
Him immensely, and the dad wouldn't let her talk to

1296
01:10:36.319 --> 01:10:41.800
Colin on a consistent basis, So that leads into why

1297
01:10:41.960 --> 01:10:44.600
she was so wanting Colin with her all the time.

1298
01:10:45.239 --> 01:10:46.479
But there were struggles.

1299
01:10:46.520 --> 01:10:49.000
I mean, he didn't live with his mom for three years,

1300
01:10:49.079 --> 01:10:51.720
three formative years, really important years.

1301
01:10:51.840 --> 01:10:54.199
And so the older brother, Christopher, had.

1302
01:10:54.119 --> 01:10:55.800
Lived with Kathy, but he was now an adult and

1303
01:10:55.840 --> 01:10:58.479
he had moved out, and Kathy was now wanting to

1304
01:10:58.560 --> 01:11:00.640
make up for lost time now that her son had

1305
01:11:00.680 --> 01:11:03.239
moved back in with her. So that's why she was

1306
01:11:03.279 --> 01:11:05.159
taking him on the cruises and out of the country

1307
01:11:05.239 --> 01:11:07.880
into Disney World and doing all of that. She gave

1308
01:11:08.000 --> 01:11:12.119
him everything when he came back because she wanted to

1309
01:11:12.279 --> 01:11:14.119
make the most of that time and to make up

1310
01:11:14.119 --> 01:11:17.159
for lost time. So they lived in Charlotte County, just

1311
01:11:17.199 --> 01:11:20.760
the two of them, and she wanted to spend a

1312
01:11:20.800 --> 01:11:24.520
lot of time with him, but she did expect responsibility

1313
01:11:24.600 --> 01:11:26.880
out of him, and damn it she did.

1314
01:11:27.039 --> 01:11:30.680
She demanded respect. I am your mother, you will respect

1315
01:11:30.800 --> 01:11:34.000
my household. She had told him.

1316
01:11:34.279 --> 01:11:36.279
I need you to weed eat the yard, I need

1317
01:11:36.319 --> 01:11:38.000
you to clean your room, and I need you to

1318
01:11:38.039 --> 01:11:42.279
throw away your trash. So why was Colin at his

1319
01:11:42.439 --> 01:11:46.279
grandmother Susan's house to begin with, the day that Cathy

1320
01:11:47.000 --> 01:11:52.359
was killed. Well, it's because she had those responsibilities that

1321
01:11:52.439 --> 01:11:57.319
she expected of him, Okay, but Colin. Susan was so

1322
01:11:57.439 --> 01:12:01.239
afraid of Colin after that battery incident that I want

1323
01:12:01.279 --> 01:12:05.199
you to know something. Susan set up ring cameras inside

1324
01:12:05.279 --> 01:12:09.399
her house as well as outside of her house because

1325
01:12:09.479 --> 01:12:13.039
she was so afraid of Colin. But what if I

1326
01:12:13.199 --> 01:12:18.560
told you that those ring cameras captured everything that morning

1327
01:12:18.760 --> 01:12:23.039
before Kathy died, And that is everything I'm about to

1328
01:12:23.119 --> 01:12:27.640
tell you. So what it showed was that basically, no

1329
01:12:28.399 --> 01:12:32.279
matter what Kathy did, Colin was just simply disrespectful and

1330
01:12:32.479 --> 01:12:36.439
non compliant with her requests and her wishes. So the

1331
01:12:36.560 --> 01:12:39.880
day before her death, for example, Kathy asked Colin to

1332
01:12:39.960 --> 01:12:42.800
help her put together a little ikea bookshelf that she

1333
01:12:42.880 --> 01:12:46.159
had bought, but he absolutely positively refused.

1334
01:12:46.680 --> 01:12:49.359
He didn't want to. That was the only reason why, no,

1335
01:12:49.960 --> 01:12:50.560
I don't want to.

1336
01:12:52.039 --> 01:12:53.920
So they kind of got into an argument about that, like,

1337
01:12:53.960 --> 01:12:55.520
come on, son, I need help, just help me put

1338
01:12:55.520 --> 01:12:58.640
the bookshelf together. Then when she asked him to weed

1339
01:12:58.680 --> 01:13:00.000
eat she was clean in the head.

1340
01:13:00.000 --> 01:13:00.239
How else.

1341
01:13:00.239 --> 01:13:03.199
While this was happening, the ring camera records all of this,

1342
01:13:03.800 --> 01:13:07.560
and she's doing the laundry, his laundry, by the way,

1343
01:13:08.319 --> 01:13:10.640
and he's refusing to help her put this bookshelf together.

1344
01:13:11.239 --> 01:13:13.279
Then she goes in his room, which was filthy, and

1345
01:13:13.359 --> 01:13:15.079
she had asked him to clean the room, and she

1346
01:13:15.239 --> 01:13:18.479
found ants all in his room and they were being.

1347
01:13:18.399 --> 01:13:21.720
Attracted by the food that he left in there. And

1348
01:13:21.880 --> 01:13:25.079
she just got pissed off. I've told you over and

1349
01:13:25.279 --> 01:13:28.399
over again, quit leaving food in your room. It's attracting

1350
01:13:28.479 --> 01:13:31.880
animals or ants. You're not doing anything I need you

1351
01:13:31.960 --> 01:13:34.399
to do. And she just got pissed off. Hey, I'm here.

1352
01:13:34.439 --> 01:13:35.239
I'm a woman's woman.

1353
01:13:35.279 --> 01:13:36.640
I want you to know that. And to this point

1354
01:13:36.720 --> 01:13:39.319
right now, I'm telling you I can't agree with Kathy Moore.

1355
01:13:39.680 --> 01:13:44.319
This is ridiculous. You know. She got so pissed off

1356
01:13:44.760 --> 01:13:47.680
and it just started a fight between them, his behavior

1357
01:13:47.960 --> 01:13:49.760
and then her getting pissed off about it. It turned

1358
01:13:49.760 --> 01:13:52.760
into a huge fight. Colin was telling her, I don't

1359
01:13:52.760 --> 01:13:54.239
want to help you with any of that. I want

1360
01:13:54.279 --> 01:13:56.640
to go take a walk, and she said, I tell

1361
01:13:56.680 --> 01:13:58.920
you what, You're not going to help me around this house.

1362
01:13:58.960 --> 01:14:00.640
And you want to go take a walk, then just

1363
01:14:00.760 --> 01:14:02.880
keep on walking, son, and you can just go to

1364
01:14:02.960 --> 01:14:03.880
your grandma's house.

1365
01:14:04.640 --> 01:14:06.840
And so that's what he did. He got in his

1366
01:14:06.960 --> 01:14:07.760
car and he left.

1367
01:14:07.920 --> 01:14:10.199
Rather than dealing with his mom's nagging, as he viewed it,

1368
01:14:10.439 --> 01:14:13.199
he just left and went to his grandmother's house. Well,

1369
01:14:13.600 --> 01:14:17.680
Kathy was pissed off about this because not only did

1370
01:14:17.720 --> 01:14:20.880
he not help her, but it was like he was

1371
01:14:21.000 --> 01:14:24.720
benefiting from his misbehavior because he was going to a

1372
01:14:24.800 --> 01:14:27.119
house that I've now told you nobody was at and

1373
01:14:27.239 --> 01:14:29.800
nobody was giving him supervision.

1374
01:14:30.960 --> 01:14:34.319
And so she texted him when he left.

1375
01:14:34.199 --> 01:14:36.399
To go to the grandmother's house, and she said, please

1376
01:14:36.479 --> 01:14:38.600
just come back home, okay, we need to talk about this,

1377
01:14:38.960 --> 01:14:42.279
and he ignored her, so she got mad even madder,

1378
01:14:42.319 --> 01:14:44.479
and she texted him, if you don't come home, then

1379
01:14:44.520 --> 01:14:46.760
I'm going to cancel your car insurance and I'm going

1380
01:14:46.800 --> 01:14:49.439
to cut off this phone. I'm not going to supply

1381
01:14:49.560 --> 01:14:51.880
you with all of this when you're acting this way

1382
01:14:51.960 --> 01:14:54.760
and you're treating me like this. But he couldn't care less,

1383
01:14:54.800 --> 01:14:57.960
and he continued to ignore her, and the more she

1384
01:14:58.119 --> 01:15:01.239
thought about it, the more upset she became. Because that

1385
01:15:01.479 --> 01:15:05.079
morning She let Colin use her credit card to go

1386
01:15:05.159 --> 01:15:08.520
to Starbucks and buy him a coffee of expensive coffee,

1387
01:15:08.800 --> 01:15:10.920
and to buy him a sandwich, you know, and he

1388
01:15:11.039 --> 01:15:13.520
was super nice whenever she was buying him these treats,

1389
01:15:14.199 --> 01:15:16.520
but then when she asked for help, he turns into

1390
01:15:16.560 --> 01:15:20.560
a complete ass and won't do anything for me. And

1391
01:15:20.680 --> 01:15:23.439
then you leave, You drove away in the car that

1392
01:15:23.760 --> 01:15:27.119
I bought you, and then you're gonna talk to other

1393
01:15:27.159 --> 01:15:29.199
people on the cell phone that I bought you, and

1394
01:15:29.399 --> 01:15:31.520
I'm paying for the plan, but when I call or

1395
01:15:31.560 --> 01:15:34.319
text you, you're gonna ignore me. Now you're at your

1396
01:15:34.359 --> 01:15:37.159
grandmother's house, who's not only not there, but she didn't

1397
01:15:37.159 --> 01:15:39.720
make him do any chores or anything. He had full

1398
01:15:39.840 --> 01:15:43.760
rain to do whatever he wanted and no consequences. So

1399
01:15:44.119 --> 01:15:48.680
beyond frustrated at that point, she's just fuming. She did

1400
01:15:48.760 --> 01:15:50.600
all of the chores that she asked him to do.

1401
01:15:51.760 --> 01:15:55.079
She weed, heated, she put together the bookshelf, she cleaned up,

1402
01:15:56.000 --> 01:15:59.680
and then out of frustration, she videoed herself doing some

1403
01:15:59.800 --> 01:16:02.000
of it, and she sent the video to Colin to say,

1404
01:16:02.359 --> 01:16:04.239
look how fast I was able to complete this.

1405
01:16:04.600 --> 01:16:05.800
This wasn't very hard to do.

1406
01:16:06.159 --> 01:16:08.479
This is so ridiculous, and now we're in this situation

1407
01:16:08.600 --> 01:16:10.479
because you just couldn't do this for me and help

1408
01:16:10.520 --> 01:16:13.560
me out. And so she continued to call Colin, but

1409
01:16:13.640 --> 01:16:15.359
he blocked her phone call at that point.

1410
01:16:15.680 --> 01:16:18.399
Who you want to piss me off? Sidestep? You want

1411
01:16:18.439 --> 01:16:19.199
to piss me off?

1412
01:16:19.920 --> 01:16:22.319
Block my number? When we're in a fight, I'm gonna

1413
01:16:22.319 --> 01:16:26.279
show up at your house. So she continued to call him,

1414
01:16:26.279 --> 01:16:28.560
but then she realized that she was she was blocked.

1415
01:16:29.199 --> 01:16:32.880
So Cathy called her mother and said, he'd better call

1416
01:16:33.000 --> 01:16:35.680
me back, or I'm coming to take that car.

1417
01:16:35.920 --> 01:16:38.000
I will physically come take that car. It's mine.

1418
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:40.039
I could use the money anyway. I don't have a

1419
01:16:40.079 --> 01:16:43.039
lot of money, and I'm paying for that cell phone

1420
01:16:43.079 --> 01:16:43.880
that he's ignoring me on.

1421
01:16:44.159 --> 01:16:45.319
He better call me back.

1422
01:16:45.760 --> 01:16:48.079
The other issue, too, was that he had missed work,

1423
01:16:48.199 --> 01:16:50.079
and that was an issue because that was part of

1424
01:16:50.159 --> 01:16:55.239
his his I guess probation plan was that you can't

1425
01:16:55.279 --> 01:16:57.119
miss work, You've got to check in, you've got to

1426
01:16:57.159 --> 01:16:59.520
do all of these things. And not only had he

1427
01:16:59.560 --> 01:17:03.520
missed war, but he hadn't followed up with this probation

1428
01:17:03.680 --> 01:17:05.880
officer like he was supposed to. And from what I

1429
01:17:06.079 --> 01:17:09.760
understand from what I read through. He even emailed his

1430
01:17:09.920 --> 01:17:14.520
probation officer saying, I know I'm violating my probation, but

1431
01:17:14.640 --> 01:17:19.079
tough shit. Basically so, the ring camera at Kathy's home

1432
01:17:19.159 --> 01:17:22.640
showed that she was alive and well having this argument,

1433
01:17:22.720 --> 01:17:24.680
and I listened to the argument the whole thing over

1434
01:17:25.239 --> 01:17:28.319
over the phone with her mother. After she hangs up,

1435
01:17:28.680 --> 01:17:31.399
Colin's not calling her back. The mom she realizes is

1436
01:17:31.439 --> 01:17:33.880
three hours away and he's on supervis She goes and

1437
01:17:33.960 --> 01:17:36.000
she changes clothes into some blue jean shorts and a

1438
01:17:36.079 --> 01:17:39.359
T shirt. She threw her leather backpack purse on her shoulder,

1439
01:17:39.640 --> 01:17:42.199
and she left the house to go get Colin and

1440
01:17:42.319 --> 01:17:45.960
to bring his smart ass back home. On her way

1441
01:17:46.079 --> 01:17:50.920
to Charlotte or to Polk County, Kathy also texted saying

1442
01:17:51.880 --> 01:17:54.840
that she was not going to be in trouble herself

1443
01:17:55.199 --> 01:17:58.439
for not following the rules and for failing to report

1444
01:17:58.520 --> 01:18:01.239
him as a missing juvenile, which she apparently was supposed

1445
01:18:01.279 --> 01:18:02.720
to do. And she said, I'm not going to be

1446
01:18:02.760 --> 01:18:05.399
in trouble because y'all aren't doing what you're supposed to

1447
01:18:05.439 --> 01:18:09.600
be doing, she told Kathy, And she told Colin in

1448
01:18:09.680 --> 01:18:11.359
a text message that she was going to sell his

1449
01:18:11.479 --> 01:18:14.119
car to CarMax and that it's a done deal.

1450
01:18:14.239 --> 01:18:16.439
I'm done. It's over at this point, I'm done. I'm

1451
01:18:16.479 --> 01:18:17.399
not doing this anymore.

1452
01:18:17.680 --> 01:18:20.640
She was furious that he broke probation and all over

1453
01:18:20.680 --> 01:18:23.079
the refusal to help do with chores. So she drove

1454
01:18:23.199 --> 01:18:26.720
to the grandmother's house and she arrived there around five PM.

1455
01:18:27.079 --> 01:18:29.199
And that's when Miss Sally and her husband were leaving

1456
01:18:29.239 --> 01:18:31.880
to go to church. Miss Nancy was porch sitting and

1457
01:18:32.000 --> 01:18:35.399
they saw her park the car, then back out and

1458
01:18:35.600 --> 01:18:40.560
storm up the driveway towards Colin. Colin came outside and

1459
01:18:40.720 --> 01:18:44.600
that's where again the neighbor saw Colin and Kathy verbally

1460
01:18:44.720 --> 01:18:48.119
fighting as she was putting items in the car, which,

1461
01:18:48.199 --> 01:18:52.119
by the way, crime scene photos showed that a laptop

1462
01:18:52.279 --> 01:18:54.279
was part of that, so I don't know if she

1463
01:18:54.479 --> 01:18:56.319
was taking the electronics or if it was already in

1464
01:18:56.359 --> 01:18:58.840
the car, but it was in the car, and she

1465
01:18:59.079 --> 01:19:03.159
eventually said something to him that just set him off,

1466
01:19:03.439 --> 01:19:06.479
and that's when the neighbors saw Colin grab his mother,

1467
01:19:06.960 --> 01:19:09.600
buy that handful of hair, and drag her around the

1468
01:19:09.680 --> 01:19:12.800
back of the car towards the house. And wouldn't you know,

1469
01:19:13.239 --> 01:19:18.359
that neighbor, Nancy, when questioned by police, also later admitted

1470
01:19:18.600 --> 01:19:21.479
that she did see him snatch her by the hair,

1471
01:19:21.800 --> 01:19:24.000
and that was whenever she got up and she went

1472
01:19:24.119 --> 01:19:27.760
inside the house. So not one, but two neighbors verified

1473
01:19:28.000 --> 01:19:30.880
he grabbed his mother by the hair and started dragging

1474
01:19:30.960 --> 01:19:34.239
her into the house. She was screaming and she was struggling,

1475
01:19:34.319 --> 01:19:37.399
saying you're hurting me, let go, but he never let go.

1476
01:19:37.840 --> 01:19:40.720
And during her struggle, Kathy, who was known to wear

1477
01:19:40.800 --> 01:19:43.439
AirPods at all times because she talked to people and

1478
01:19:43.720 --> 01:19:46.279
listen to music all the time, as she's struggling and

1479
01:19:46.359 --> 01:19:48.960
holding her hands up at her hair and being drug

1480
01:19:49.039 --> 01:19:51.560
around the back of the car, that's when that AirPod

1481
01:19:51.640 --> 01:19:53.760
fell out and it bounced into the mulch at that

1482
01:19:53.840 --> 01:19:56.399
flower bed, right on the side. And they continued to

1483
01:19:56.439 --> 01:19:59.640
struggle up the steps and into the house, and once

1484
01:19:59.720 --> 01:20:02.520
they got into the house, her air podcase fell out,

1485
01:20:02.840 --> 01:20:06.560
and that struggle continued to ensue in that living room

1486
01:20:06.800 --> 01:20:10.640
as he continued to drag her through the kitchen. So

1487
01:20:10.760 --> 01:20:13.880
they're in a volatile fight at this point, and at

1488
01:20:13.960 --> 01:20:17.000
some point he grabbed that knife out of that butcher

1489
01:20:17.079 --> 01:20:19.840
block and he swiped it at his mom, who had

1490
01:20:19.920 --> 01:20:22.680
ripped away from him, and she threw her hands up

1491
01:20:22.920 --> 01:20:26.239
when the knife sliced her between her thumb and her

1492
01:20:26.319 --> 01:20:30.199
pointer finger, so she began to bleed, and realizing that

1493
01:20:30.359 --> 01:20:33.000
she was now not just in a fight or altercation

1494
01:20:33.119 --> 01:20:35.640
with her son, that she was fighting for her life.

1495
01:20:36.039 --> 01:20:40.359
At this point, they continued to struggle and to fight.

1496
01:20:40.680 --> 01:20:44.159
By this point, she is facing him, and whether he

1497
01:20:44.319 --> 01:20:48.479
was still holding her by her hair or not is unknown,

1498
01:20:48.800 --> 01:20:51.680
but it is clear that he reached back with the knife,

1499
01:20:52.159 --> 01:20:56.119
raised that foot long knife above his head six foot

1500
01:20:56.279 --> 01:21:00.880
two tall versus five foot two tall, and he's got

1501
01:21:00.960 --> 01:21:05.319
her there, and he violently rammed that knife and stabbed

1502
01:21:05.359 --> 01:21:09.680
it straight through his mother's neck in that downward motion,

1503
01:21:10.159 --> 01:21:13.479
front to back. He stabbed her so hard that the

1504
01:21:13.560 --> 01:21:18.119
knife went completely through her neck. The blade pierced through

1505
01:21:18.359 --> 01:21:21.640
the other side of her neck, and he pulled back

1506
01:21:21.720 --> 01:21:24.039
after he did it ripped the knife back out of

1507
01:21:24.119 --> 01:21:27.399
her throat, which made that wound gape open, and where

1508
01:21:27.439 --> 01:21:31.479
she began to bleed profusely. She could not breathe because

1509
01:21:31.520 --> 01:21:34.640
her airway was severed. The blood began to squirt out

1510
01:21:34.680 --> 01:21:37.720
of her neck. It began pouring down her neck so

1511
01:21:38.279 --> 01:21:41.279
it's also pouring down into the structures of her throat

1512
01:21:41.560 --> 01:21:45.399
with every heartbeat. And they were still struggling briefly when

1513
01:21:45.479 --> 01:21:48.800
she slipped in her own blood. Her flipflops flew off.

1514
01:21:49.399 --> 01:21:52.600
She slammed down on the ground, still struggling, her feet

1515
01:21:52.680 --> 01:21:57.119
going through the blood. And she bled so much and

1516
01:21:57.319 --> 01:22:00.479
so fast that the booksack she had on is covered

1517
01:22:00.479 --> 01:22:03.239
in blood, not only on the back but on the inside,

1518
01:22:03.520 --> 01:22:07.319
full of it as she's gasping for her breath until

1519
01:22:07.399 --> 01:22:13.439
she lost consciousness because she bled out like that. And

1520
01:22:13.600 --> 01:22:17.159
that's when Colin, realizing what he had done, called nine

1521
01:22:17.199 --> 01:22:20.279
one one and wanted to help, but it was too late.

1522
01:22:20.960 --> 01:22:24.000
What was done was done, and his mother would die

1523
01:22:24.119 --> 01:22:28.439
in front of his eyes within minutes. The woman who

1524
01:22:28.640 --> 01:22:32.840
loved him, who gave birth to him and regardless of

1525
01:22:32.920 --> 01:22:36.479
her problems, tried to give him a life, was dead.

1526
01:22:37.079 --> 01:22:40.520
And because of what, like, really think about this, because

1527
01:22:40.560 --> 01:22:44.960
of what It's beyond logic and it defies the rules

1528
01:22:45.279 --> 01:22:48.920
of nature. Okay, and y'all know, Look, I'm southern. I'm

1529
01:22:49.039 --> 01:22:53.479
southern as they come. But your elders are to be respected.

1530
01:22:53.840 --> 01:22:57.319
Even when you disagree with them, you still show respect.

1531
01:22:57.399 --> 01:22:59.079
I was raised that way, and I'm proud of it.

1532
01:22:59.560 --> 01:23:04.560
Still show respect, honor thy mother and thy father. That

1533
01:23:04.760 --> 01:23:08.239
is how I was raised, Okay, And even if you weren't,

1534
01:23:08.960 --> 01:23:12.399
it's the law of nature that the person that brought

1535
01:23:12.439 --> 01:23:14.880
you into this world, that was trying to love you.

1536
01:23:15.800 --> 01:23:17.560
That you can argue, and you can fuss, and you

1537
01:23:17.600 --> 01:23:21.600
can fight, but to stab that person through the throat

1538
01:23:22.560 --> 01:23:26.720
with such violence, to drag her by her hair up

1539
01:23:26.840 --> 01:23:31.239
some stairs and into a house, it does not fit.

1540
01:23:32.600 --> 01:23:34.640
It doesn't go that way. It shouldn't go that way,

1541
01:23:34.680 --> 01:23:37.560
and it can't go that way. And then for Colin

1542
01:23:38.520 --> 01:23:42.319
to claim that his mother fell on the knife, even

1543
01:23:42.720 --> 01:23:45.960
in the past when he told multiple officers that he

1544
01:23:46.000 --> 01:23:50.279
would kill his mother when he was Baker acted twice

1545
01:23:50.840 --> 01:23:54.119
for threatening to kill his mother, telling them how he

1546
01:23:54.239 --> 01:23:57.840
was going to kill his mother, How do you think

1547
01:23:57.920 --> 01:23:58.279
that went?

1548
01:23:59.680 --> 01:24:01.039
What do you do you think took place?

1549
01:24:02.520 --> 01:24:06.720
So Kathy's brother, his name was John, Kathy's brother, John

1550
01:24:07.199 --> 01:24:10.479
called and broke the news to her dad that she

1551
01:24:10.680 --> 01:24:13.399
was dead. His daughter was dead. And he was stunned,

1552
01:24:13.439 --> 01:24:15.239
as you can imagine when he got that phone call.

1553
01:24:16.000 --> 01:24:19.199
But he was more so stunned that he recalled a

1554
01:24:19.279 --> 01:24:23.199
conversation that he had with Colin. When Colin was having

1555
01:24:23.239 --> 01:24:29.119
a bad day, Colin told his grandfather over the phone,

1556
01:24:30.239 --> 01:24:33.039
I'm tired of these two bitches. He was talking about

1557
01:24:33.039 --> 01:24:35.720
his mother and his grandmother. I'm tired of these two bitches,

1558
01:24:36.800 --> 01:24:39.960
and i want to kill my mom, specifically saying, and

1559
01:24:40.079 --> 01:24:43.039
I quote, I want to feel and smell the blood

1560
01:24:43.319 --> 01:24:49.159
as her life drains from her. Now, he knew how

1561
01:24:49.319 --> 01:24:53.000
Colin was a difficult kid, and he knew that Colin

1562
01:24:53.760 --> 01:24:56.760
acted out, so he didn't he didn't freak out in

1563
01:24:56.840 --> 01:24:59.359
the moment when Colin said this. He tried to talk

1564
01:24:59.439 --> 01:25:02.279
him down and said, look, you know you can't say

1565
01:25:02.319 --> 01:25:04.279
these types of things. I know your mabbage can't talk

1566
01:25:04.399 --> 01:25:07.520
like that because you can talk evil into reality. Colin,

1567
01:25:07.880 --> 01:25:11.119
don't say that. Don't manifest some type of destiny here.

1568
01:25:12.279 --> 01:25:16.439
And Cathy after that, told her father that Colin has

1569
01:25:16.479 --> 01:25:19.079
been threatening both her and his and her mother.

1570
01:25:20.680 --> 01:25:22.600
So with everything.

1571
01:25:24.000 --> 01:25:27.560
That had taken place, the grandfather called the police to say,

1572
01:25:28.800 --> 01:25:31.920
I think you need to know this. So the police

1573
01:25:32.000 --> 01:25:35.359
now had uncovered everything that I'm telling you during their investigation.

1574
01:25:35.800 --> 01:25:39.359
Now the grandfather has also said this, with all of

1575
01:25:39.439 --> 01:25:43.199
that that happened, Colin Griffith was arrested and charged with

1576
01:25:43.399 --> 01:25:47.960
first degree murder, kidnapping, and violation of a no contact

1577
01:25:48.119 --> 01:25:51.600
order because of the domestic battery with his mother. He

1578
01:25:51.840 --> 01:25:53.560
just went to trial. He went to trial at the

1579
01:25:53.760 --> 01:25:57.680
end of twenty twenty three, and after a multiple day trial,

1580
01:25:58.720 --> 01:26:05.279
Colin Griffith was found not guilty of the murder of

1581
01:26:05.439 --> 01:26:10.560
his mother, Kathy Griffith, and he was released from jail

1582
01:26:11.359 --> 01:26:19.439
upon his acquittal. Now that you've heard that, I bet

1583
01:26:19.479 --> 01:26:23.319
you're wondering where did Colin go to live after his

1584
01:26:23.520 --> 01:26:28.199
release because he's killed his own mother. Well, I'm glad

1585
01:26:28.279 --> 01:26:34.079
you asked. Maybe he'll go a look with his father again. Well,

1586
01:26:35.199 --> 01:26:39.359
that's actually going to be a hard No. Was it

1587
01:26:39.439 --> 01:26:41.399
because his father was mad at him?

1588
01:26:41.800 --> 01:26:41.840
No?

1589
01:26:44.199 --> 01:26:47.159
Was it because his father no longer wanted a relationship

1590
01:26:47.439 --> 01:26:48.000
with his son.

1591
01:26:48.560 --> 01:26:48.600
No?

1592
01:26:51.159 --> 01:26:55.560
Was it because he had been accused of murdering his mother. No,

1593
01:26:55.960 --> 01:26:56.720
that's not it either.

1594
01:26:58.560 --> 01:27:03.039
The reason Colin wouldn't go live with his father is

1595
01:27:03.119 --> 01:27:09.600
because Colin had murdered his father eighteen months before killing

1596
01:27:10.039 --> 01:27:16.279
his mother. Did you just hear what I just told you?

1597
01:27:17.760 --> 01:27:22.920
The guy who was just acquitted of his mother's murder had,

1598
01:27:23.079 --> 01:27:28.359
in fact shot his father to death just eighteen months

1599
01:27:28.640 --> 01:27:34.119
before he killed his mother. In twenty twenty three, Colin

1600
01:27:34.319 --> 01:27:38.720
admitted to fatally shooting his father, forty three year old

1601
01:27:39.039 --> 01:27:43.359
Charles Griffith, and he told investigators in that time too

1602
01:27:44.079 --> 01:27:47.720
that he acted in self defense, because Colin claimed in

1603
01:27:47.760 --> 01:27:51.520
his mother's trial his mom attacked him and then fell

1604
01:27:51.600 --> 01:27:53.960
on the knife, that's why she died.

1605
01:27:55.520 --> 01:27:58.960
But eighteen months earlier, when he shot his father.

1606
01:28:00.560 --> 01:28:04.439
Twice, he claimed that it was in self defense, and

1607
01:28:04.560 --> 01:28:07.800
the initial investigation that was done on his father's death

1608
01:28:08.399 --> 01:28:12.800
showed major inconsistencies between Colin's claims and the evidence that

1609
01:28:12.960 --> 01:28:16.199
was at the scene. But as soon as the officer

1610
01:28:16.239 --> 01:28:19.199
started to ask more questions at the scene, he demanded

1611
01:28:19.239 --> 01:28:22.359
an attorney, just like he did in his mother's case.

1612
01:28:23.239 --> 01:28:26.439
But Colin was charged with first degree murder of his father,

1613
01:28:27.239 --> 01:28:30.760
but the prosecutors ended up having to drop the charges because,

1614
01:28:30.880 --> 01:28:35.239
in their words, they could not disprove Colin's assertion of

1615
01:28:35.399 --> 01:28:41.079
the self defense. It was then that Colin was released

1616
01:28:41.159 --> 01:28:44.640
in March of twenty twenty three, after his mother his

1617
01:28:44.840 --> 01:28:49.159
family made a fifty thousand dollars bond for him. He

1618
01:28:49.319 --> 01:28:54.039
was released to his mother and sent to Florida, who,

1619
01:28:54.079 --> 01:28:56.800
he then would claim eighteen months later, pulled a knife

1620
01:28:56.880 --> 01:29:04.079
on him and he killed her in self defense. I

1621
01:29:04.159 --> 01:29:08.800
don't know how to word this, but it seems like

1622
01:29:08.840 --> 01:29:12.920
there has been some injustices in this world in recent history.

1623
01:29:14.840 --> 01:29:19.640
The jury in his mother's murder trial, there were limitations

1624
01:29:19.680 --> 01:29:23.359
here on what they knew. They knew that he had

1625
01:29:23.479 --> 01:29:26.760
killed someone in the past, but the judge in the

1626
01:29:26.880 --> 01:29:29.960
trial ruled that the jury could not be told who

1627
01:29:30.439 --> 01:29:35.159
he killed. That way they would remain impartial. But damn, y'all,

1628
01:29:36.319 --> 01:29:39.039
doesn't it seem super important to know that he's already

1629
01:29:39.199 --> 01:29:43.279
offed one parent and now he's on trial for offering

1630
01:29:43.439 --> 01:29:44.079
another one.

1631
01:29:44.520 --> 01:29:49.159
But you know that's not what happened. Colin needs to

1632
01:29:49.199 --> 01:29:50.560
go buy a fucking lotto ticket.

1633
01:29:50.359 --> 01:29:51.680
I guess, is all I can say, because that's the

1634
01:29:51.760 --> 01:29:56.159
luckiest sob on the planet Earth right now. Prosecutors in

1635
01:29:56.239 --> 01:29:59.520
his mother's trial brought up the fact that not only

1636
01:29:59.680 --> 01:30:02.960
was Ca taking away his possessions she bought him, but

1637
01:30:03.760 --> 01:30:08.239
she also said, get this, she was going to send

1638
01:30:08.479 --> 01:30:11.920
a ring video of him that was taken at her house.

1639
01:30:12.439 --> 01:30:13.239
She told him.

1640
01:30:13.319 --> 01:30:16.960
Before she arrived at the grandmother's house, she told him

1641
01:30:17.279 --> 01:30:19.399
that she was going to send the ring videos that

1642
01:30:19.520 --> 01:30:22.880
she had admitting he had admitted with his own words

1643
01:30:23.439 --> 01:30:29.399
to planning the murder of his father on four separate occasions.

1644
01:30:30.399 --> 01:30:34.000
She told him she never physically threatened him, but she

1645
01:30:34.239 --> 01:30:36.479
told him she was going to not only take away

1646
01:30:36.520 --> 01:30:39.000
his things, but she was going to provide that proof,

1647
01:30:39.199 --> 01:30:43.239
that video proof of his guilt against his dad's murder.

1648
01:30:44.439 --> 01:30:47.079
Kathy also texted her own mom and said she was

1649
01:30:47.159 --> 01:30:48.720
going to go release those videos.

1650
01:30:48.760 --> 01:30:49.640
In that audio as.

1651
01:30:49.520 --> 01:30:53.000
Well, she was telling everybody she wasn't bluffing anymore. And

1652
01:30:53.119 --> 01:30:55.319
I'm of the opinion of this. I think that Kathy

1653
01:30:55.439 --> 01:30:59.039
made a lot of threats towards Colin as far as

1654
01:30:59.119 --> 01:31:01.800
disciplining him, but she never followed through.

1655
01:31:01.680 --> 01:31:02.399
On any of them.

1656
01:31:02.640 --> 01:31:05.039
And I think that he knew this, and this time

1657
01:31:05.399 --> 01:31:08.479
she was not bluffing, and she had the video to

1658
01:31:08.560 --> 01:31:13.239
prove it, and he knew it, and he snapped. Colin's

1659
01:31:13.319 --> 01:31:17.119
motive for killing her was that he was afraid the

1660
01:31:17.439 --> 01:31:20.880
first killing he did was gonna come back and bite

1661
01:31:20.920 --> 01:31:24.279
him in the ass. And after he read that text,

1662
01:31:24.920 --> 01:31:28.640
he got furious and he enacted the plan. He had

1663
01:31:28.720 --> 01:31:32.079
told multiple people that he was gonna do to her

1664
01:31:33.079 --> 01:31:38.000
the exact same claim for both parents to have pulled

1665
01:31:38.000 --> 01:31:40.680
a knife on him and he had to kill them both.

1666
01:31:41.680 --> 01:31:44.680
No way, I'm not buying that. I don't buy it.

1667
01:31:44.920 --> 01:31:51.319
Statistically. Police officers. Police officers, the ones who face trouble

1668
01:31:51.760 --> 01:31:58.119
every day of their career. Statistically, they never shoot their

1669
01:31:58.279 --> 01:32:02.199
guns in their entire career in the line of duty,

1670
01:32:02.840 --> 01:32:07.399
the ones dealing with hardened criminals every day, a job

1671
01:32:07.479 --> 01:32:11.399
filled with violence and anger and unreasonable people, and they

1672
01:32:11.560 --> 01:32:15.720
never shoot their gun in their career statistically. But a

1673
01:32:15.960 --> 01:32:18.720
seventeen year old had to do it, not once, but

1674
01:32:19.000 --> 01:32:22.680
twice before the age of eighteen. I don't buy that,

1675
01:32:23.079 --> 01:32:25.760
and it's my opinion. I think that the jury got

1676
01:32:25.800 --> 01:32:29.239
it wrong. The jury had the option, by the way

1677
01:32:29.720 --> 01:32:33.840
of choosing something lesser than first degree murder.

1678
01:32:34.479 --> 01:32:38.000
They could have chosen a negligent homicide. It was on

1679
01:32:38.119 --> 01:32:39.760
the table. All of this was on the table.

1680
01:32:39.960 --> 01:32:41.920
They did not have to choose a first degree murder,

1681
01:32:42.199 --> 01:32:47.319
and they let him just walk, not even a manslaughter

1682
01:32:48.000 --> 01:32:52.760
like nothing, You're just gonna let him walk. I don't

1683
01:32:52.800 --> 01:32:54.600
know if the jury listened to the same trial that

1684
01:32:54.720 --> 01:32:57.359
I did. I'm so serious and I'm not one to

1685
01:32:57.479 --> 01:33:01.119
usually come down on this on our process. It is

1686
01:33:01.199 --> 01:33:04.840
our process, it is what it is. But I don't

1687
01:33:04.840 --> 01:33:08.079
think we listened to the same trial. I just don't.

1688
01:33:08.760 --> 01:33:13.319
Regardless of Kathy's struggles, her problems, and her issues, I

1689
01:33:13.479 --> 01:33:16.720
don't think the child that she tried so hard to

1690
01:33:16.880 --> 01:33:20.760
make right and do right was a person that she

1691
01:33:20.840 --> 01:33:25.600
would try to attack with a knife and kill. He

1692
01:33:25.880 --> 01:33:28.640
dragged her into the house by her hair. He had

1693
01:33:28.800 --> 01:33:32.000
no marks on him, he had no defensive wounds on

1694
01:33:32.079 --> 01:33:35.359
him from supposedly being attacked with a knife. But she

1695
01:33:35.600 --> 01:33:40.159
was bruised, scraped, cut, plus stabbed all the way.

1696
01:33:40.119 --> 01:33:45.039
Through her throat. No way, no way.

1697
01:33:46.159 --> 01:33:48.560
Something I know about victims of domestic violence is this,

1698
01:33:49.039 --> 01:33:53.680
they often love their abusers. They often love their abusers,

1699
01:33:53.800 --> 01:33:56.119
and that's why they put up with it. And in

1700
01:33:56.199 --> 01:33:59.640
this case, it was her own son. Of course she

1701
01:33:59.680 --> 01:34:03.000
could and just throw him away. She grew him, it

1702
01:34:03.119 --> 01:34:06.039
was her own child. Of course she couldn't throw him away.

1703
01:34:06.319 --> 01:34:09.000
She even voiced that to that probation officer that if

1704
01:34:09.079 --> 01:34:11.199
I meet my faith that way, then so be it.

1705
01:34:11.239 --> 01:34:12.840
At least I get to spend some time with my

1706
01:34:12.920 --> 01:34:13.319
baby that.

1707
01:34:13.319 --> 01:34:16.279
I've lost out on. And she fought literally to the

1708
01:34:16.560 --> 01:34:19.319
end for and with her child.

1709
01:34:21.560 --> 01:34:26.119
The Oklahoma District Attorney's office said, if sufficient evidence is presented,

1710
01:34:26.720 --> 01:34:30.239
they can reopen his father's murder case. So I guess

1711
01:34:30.319 --> 01:34:33.199
for now all we can do is wait and see

1712
01:34:33.239 --> 01:34:39.520
what happens. Kathy wanted Colin to behave but she didn't

1713
01:34:39.720 --> 01:34:44.520
get that. Kathy wanted him to love her and to

1714
01:34:44.600 --> 01:34:48.079
spend time with her, but she didn't get that either.

1715
01:34:49.600 --> 01:34:52.359
And I want to add this as well. Kathy wanted

1716
01:34:52.399 --> 01:34:53.199
to be cremated.

1717
01:34:54.199 --> 01:34:57.159
Those were her final wishes, and she wanted her ashes

1718
01:34:57.359 --> 01:35:00.960
spread in Key Largo at the Christ the Abyss Jesus

1719
01:35:01.000 --> 01:35:05.760
statue that's underwater. But according to her own mother, she

1720
01:35:05.880 --> 01:35:08.840
didn't get that either. This is a direct quote that

1721
01:35:08.880 --> 01:35:13.680
I found online. Colin Griffith is a violent person who

1722
01:35:13.720 --> 01:35:17.600
has now killed both his father and his mother. He

1723
01:35:17.680 --> 01:35:20.560
had a pattern of violence where he didn't get his way,

1724
01:35:20.960 --> 01:35:23.800
and the two very people who gave him the gift

1725
01:35:23.920 --> 01:35:30.359
of life paid the price. Imagine leaving two corpses behind

1726
01:35:30.439 --> 01:35:34.079
you and somehow convincing people that you were the victim.

1727
01:35:36.479 --> 01:35:41.880
I just cannot even figure this one out, so I

1728
01:35:41.920 --> 01:35:43.039
guess I'll keep thinking about it.

1729
01:35:44.159 --> 01:35:45.960
That's all I can I can imagine to do so.

1730
01:35:46.079 --> 01:35:49.880
Until next time, lock your doors, trust your instincts, and

1731
01:35:49.960 --> 01:35:52.479
by God, I want you to thoroughly vet your own offspring,

1732
01:35:52.520 --> 01:35:54.760
because you never know what little Timmy's gonna pull faster,

1733
01:35:54.880 --> 01:35:56.479
the victim card or the trigger