The Spokane Serial Killer Part 2

100:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,700Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real200:00:10,700 --> 00:00:21,840victims whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real?300:00:21,840 --> 00:00:26,960I use my experiences in law enforcement, corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal400:00:26,960 --> 00:00:33,320justice educator dig deep into complex cases of evil acts, some so evil many feel they are500:00:33,320 --> 00:00:51,000unspeakable.600:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,120Warning, unspeakable is intended for mature audiences.700:00:54,120 --> 00:00:56,880If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl.800:00:56,880 --> 00:00:58,280Listing discretion is advised.900:00:58,280 --> 00:01:01,440Hey y'all, Kelly Jiddings here back for another episode of Unspeakable.1000:01:01,440 --> 00:01:02,440Let's go and on.1100:01:02,440 --> 00:01:03,760I'm recording on a Sunday.1200:01:03,760 --> 00:01:05,760Thank God for DVRs.1300:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,920I'm recording my Saints game because I gotta give the people what they want and I gotta1400:01:09,920 --> 00:01:11,120give it to them all in time.1500:01:11,120 --> 00:01:15,800So we got a new episode today, but before I do that, I've got a couple of shout outs that1600:01:15,800 --> 00:01:20,680I need to give because the people have messaged me and made sure I knew I had to give them1700:01:20,680 --> 00:01:22,680their shout outs and y'all I will not let you down.1800:01:22,680 --> 00:01:23,920My word is my bond.1900:01:23,920 --> 00:01:25,760So let me start here though.2000:01:25,760 --> 00:01:31,880Last episode or two episodes ago, I just said Jade because I didn't have a last name, but2100:01:31,880 --> 00:01:35,840I got that last name and so I am gonna give another shout out.2200:01:35,840 --> 00:01:39,240It's Miss Jade Bible and I thought that was kind of cool too.2300:01:39,240 --> 00:01:41,760So hey Jade, I'm sorry, I just called you Jade.2400:01:41,760 --> 00:01:46,960You are Jade Bible and I thank you so very much for joining my Patreon and then all2500:01:46,960 --> 00:01:48,600the way from Oregon.2600:01:48,600 --> 00:01:51,480I've got Miss Sandra Oliver.2700:01:51,480 --> 00:01:53,240Hey girl, how are you?2800:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,760I'm so excited to see the states where people listen.2900:01:55,760 --> 00:01:59,160I think that's one of the coolest things and Miss Sandra, thank you so much.3000:01:59,160 --> 00:02:05,560I really appreciate you joining and being a member of my Patreon.3100:02:05,560 --> 00:02:12,280Then Missouri was freaking in the house because Miss Kathy Ray Brown, hey Miss Kathy, I got3200:02:12,280 --> 00:02:13,280you.3300:02:13,280 --> 00:02:16,640I saw you and I said I gotta give her that shout out and you're right here on my notebook.3400:02:16,640 --> 00:02:19,880Miss Kathy, how are you and you have someone else?3500:02:19,880 --> 00:02:25,740Now I don't know if Sullivan is near Grand B, I think that's how you say it, Missouri, but3600:02:25,740 --> 00:02:29,440Miss Amy Garner, hey Amy, hey there.3700:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,760I got both of y'all, y'all friends, y'all know each other?3800:02:32,760 --> 00:02:37,600But thank you all so much for listening, so glad to have you and then last but certainly3900:02:37,600 --> 00:02:44,680not least I have Mr. Douglas Birchum and he wanted to make sure everybody knew he is4000:02:44,680 --> 00:02:48,200actually friends with Jody Plotje and I think that's kind of cool right because y'all4100:02:48,200 --> 00:02:53,680got to hear Jody talking a past episode and he was so cute, he was telling me about his4200:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,600daddy and how he said that his dad has heard every slaughter of the word Birchum known to4300:02:58,600 --> 00:03:03,920sweet Jesus and I said, dude, let me tell you something, my name is Jennings and everyone4400:03:03,920 --> 00:03:06,960calls me Jenkins or something else.4500:03:06,960 --> 00:03:10,120So you know, I feel that on every level.4600:03:10,120 --> 00:03:16,680So to Jade, Sandra, Amy, Kathy and Mr. Douglas, thank you all so, so very much your support4700:03:16,680 --> 00:03:21,040means the world and without you, I really couldn't do the podcasting because your support is4800:03:21,040 --> 00:03:22,800what makes the difference for me.4900:03:22,800 --> 00:03:28,160So welcome to the team and let's dive into this part two of this Douglas Perry episode5000:03:28,160 --> 00:03:36,040and something else too, don't forget, I'm usually really active on Facebook but don't5100:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,600forget that Patriot now has a free level that you can join and you don't get everything5200:03:40,600 --> 00:03:44,760obviously but you can get more than the average bear I guess would if you don't follow5300:03:44,760 --> 00:03:49,400anything so go in there and join that free level and you can see some of my photos and things5400:03:49,400 --> 00:03:52,720that I post if you want to be able to see extra as you got to join and you can pick your5500:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,120level and it's whatever you can do it this time.5600:03:55,120 --> 00:04:00,520So thank you all so much but we're going to pick back up in Spokane, Washington where three5700:04:00,520 --> 00:04:05,360sex workers were killed in the late or the early 90s 1990s and the suspect would eventually5800:04:05,360 --> 00:04:10,840be identified as Mr. Douglas Perry and the murdered women just as a recap or 26 year5900:04:10,840 --> 00:04:17,320old Yolanda Sap, 34 year old Nikki Lowe and 38 year old Kathy Brisbo.6000:04:17,320 --> 00:04:21,440And I had mentioned last episode two that a prostitute, another one had come forward and6100:04:21,440 --> 00:04:24,840mentioned that she was really freaked out by this experience and that Douglas actually6200:04:24,840 --> 00:04:31,200drove by and was ID by that woman as she literally made the report so hey that was some good6300:04:31,200 --> 00:04:32,200luck there.6400:04:32,200 --> 00:04:37,080And also if you remember ATF had confiscated a bunch of weapons from him which he was not6500:04:37,080 --> 00:04:41,880supposed to be in possession of and he had a history of misbehavior at best and I covered6600:04:41,880 --> 00:04:42,880that in the last episode.6700:04:42,880 --> 00:04:46,720So hey if you didn't listen to the last one go listen before you you finished forward on6800:04:46,720 --> 00:04:47,880this one.6900:04:47,880 --> 00:04:51,520But unfortunately being weird does not constitute an arrest.7000:04:51,520 --> 00:04:57,000Thank God right I'd be arrested but being weird can't get you arrested.7100:04:57,000 --> 00:05:02,560We have to have hard evidence y'all but the 90s they just weren't up for the forensic challenge7200:05:02,560 --> 00:05:03,560in the 90s.7300:05:03,560 --> 00:05:09,760We have the advancements that we have today but lucky for us science matured as the years7400:05:09,760 --> 00:05:10,760went on.7500:05:10,760 --> 00:05:14,480So obviously an investigation was going to be launched and very quickly the Spokane Police7600:05:14,480 --> 00:05:19,520Department and the Spokane County Sheriff's Office came to believe that these were going7700:05:19,520 --> 00:05:21,040to be serial murders.7800:05:21,040 --> 00:05:22,040Why serial?7900:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,440Okay why did they just think this is going to be a serial murder and not just someone that8000:05:25,440 --> 00:05:29,120was out there or multiple people out there that were killing these prostitutes and just8100:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,080dumping them after they were using them.8200:05:31,080 --> 00:05:36,480So the answer was because the modus operandi the mo right was just too similar the women8300:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,280all live similar lives in the sex industry.8400:05:39,280 --> 00:05:45,160The perpetrators consistent use of a similar you know small caliber firearm in the killings8500:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,840was something you couldn't overlook and then the location where all of the bodies were8600:05:48,840 --> 00:05:52,760dropped it was just too coincidental and I don't believe in coincidences in either do law8700:05:52,760 --> 00:05:53,760enforcement.8800:05:53,760 --> 00:05:59,120So that's why they believe this to be a serial killer and not multiple people.8900:05:59,120 --> 00:06:03,240So the department conducted a joint investigation which is really cool because that means you9000:06:03,240 --> 00:06:09,080have more multiple resources and a lot of people attacking the same case just from their own9100:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,360jurisdiction or agency.9200:06:11,360 --> 00:06:15,920Now remember I've said this like a billion times the same 20% of the population is committing9300:06:15,920 --> 00:06:22,840100% of the crimes and joining efforts is imperative to large scale crime solving.9400:06:22,840 --> 00:06:24,160I'm a big proponent of that.9500:06:24,160 --> 00:06:29,520I don't think that we need to have these ego trips where no this is my investigation.9600:06:29,520 --> 00:06:33,480No if the goal is to solve it let's solve it right let's put all our heads together and9700:06:33,480 --> 00:06:38,680criminals often commit crimes in more than one jurisdiction.9800:06:38,680 --> 00:06:44,280So joint investigations would reflect that situation and we have to work together to connect9900:06:44,280 --> 00:06:48,400the dots if not it's like literally a connect the dots worksheet where we have the dots10000:06:48,400 --> 00:06:52,280everywhere but if we don't connect them then we can't see the full scope of what's going10100:06:52,280 --> 00:06:55,400on with the person that's committing the crimes.10200:06:55,400 --> 00:07:00,920And so these joint operations allow for the collection of evidence in each of the jurisdictions10300:07:00,920 --> 00:07:07,800involved and it helps them each to build their cases respectively throughout their agencies.10400:07:07,800 --> 00:07:12,320Now around the same time other murderers were making their mark on the area as well and10500:07:12,320 --> 00:07:18,240one of which was Robert Yates which everyone knows is the Green River Killer and for a brief10600:07:18,240 --> 00:07:25,520time he was all over their radar but evidence just simply didn't support him as the killer.10700:07:25,520 --> 00:07:29,920They looked I even looked at a report a science it was like a forensic report where they had10800:07:29,920 --> 00:07:34,960compared like calibers of weapons and M.O. and all of that and it just while there could10900:07:34,960 --> 00:07:41,040have been some slight similarity there it literally was just not enough to make a direct11000:07:41,040 --> 00:07:45,280connection and say yes lamb thank you ma'am this was him and good thing they didn't do11100:07:45,280 --> 00:07:47,800that because they would have been wrong.11200:07:47,800 --> 00:07:52,120But eventually he would be abandoned as someone that they thought should be held responsible11300:07:52,120 --> 00:07:57,200for these murders and they kept looking but shortly thereafter this investigation went11400:07:57,200 --> 00:08:05,000cold as ice I mean nothing no one was calling in tips no other bodies appeared and no other11500:08:05,000 --> 00:08:10,280bodies appeared with the same calling card at least as how these women had been murdered11600:08:10,280 --> 00:08:16,600and the leads simply dried up you know we have to have these leads and you never know how11700:08:16,600 --> 00:08:22,960small the little bit of information that you give can matter matter fact I didn't plan11800:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,160on saying this but I'm going to you real quick if you all follow my Facebook you should have11900:08:26,160 --> 00:08:30,960seen that picture of the back of that truck with the blood dripping down it right and12000:08:30,960 --> 00:08:34,400I made a joke about hey is it murder or is it deer season okay obviously it's deer season12100:08:34,400 --> 00:08:40,920in South Louisiana and other places too right but you know it was just kind of me joking12200:08:40,920 --> 00:08:45,320well I didn't take a picture of the full truck because it turns out I actually I actually12300:08:45,320 --> 00:08:49,200teach the person driving it I didn't know that at the time but then he stuck his head out12400:08:49,200 --> 00:08:52,600the window was waving I was like oh my god hey so buddy if you're listening you know who12500:08:52,600 --> 00:08:56,800you are hey buddy all right so what was cool about it though was a little while later12600:08:56,800 --> 00:09:02,380after I had posted that on Facebook a gentleman that listen said oh yeah I saw that same12700:09:02,380 --> 00:09:08,200truck driving down range and he mentioned this sticker that's on the back window of that12800:09:08,200 --> 00:09:13,720truck and mind you I had not put a picture of that back window so I know that he saw12900:09:13,720 --> 00:09:18,240the exact same truck I did and then he added plus he drives like an idiot not cracked up13000:09:18,240 --> 00:09:25,800laughing because now I tell your mama but you know that small little tip what if I was looking13100:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,240for that truck and I didn't know anything about it and then someone else was able to say13200:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,960yeah I saw that truck too with that exact same sticker with the blood and it was driving13300:09:32,960 --> 00:09:38,680down you know range avenue at this X amount of time then we get a timeline and that small13400:09:38,680 --> 00:09:41,760little bit of information we can go to cameras and we can go looking for that truck and13500:09:41,760 --> 00:09:47,720can try to track it down but you know when people aren't calling in anything when prostitutes13600:09:47,720 --> 00:09:51,280aren't saying anything else that are working those streets and we have nothing in the murder13700:09:51,280 --> 00:09:57,620stop why did they stop you know where did this person go and if they stopped then what13800:09:57,620 --> 00:10:04,560was their true motive was that they directly hated those three women or you know what13900:10:04,560 --> 00:10:10,800is it like why give me the why right so while Douglass Perry looked like a great suspect14000:10:10,800 --> 00:10:18,100the link from him to the women was circumstantial at best and no prosecutor would touch that14100:10:18,100 --> 00:10:26,480case at that level with a 10 foot pole I mean considering all you need is and people I think14200:10:26,480 --> 00:10:32,240the public misses this sometimes considering all you need is reasonable doubt in a case14300:10:32,240 --> 00:10:37,640for someone to walk or just a little bit beyond reasonable doubt for someone to walk on14400:10:37,640 --> 00:10:46,040something hashtag case Anthony hashtag oj Simpson you know I'm saying like considering that's14500:10:46,040 --> 00:10:51,800all you need no prosecutor is going to want to take on that case put forth all that work14600:10:51,800 --> 00:10:59,800and only have circumstantial evidence to point to maybe they did it we needed more okay14700:10:59,800 --> 00:11:04,560and also don't forget that that pesky fifth amendment right and that we can't have double14800:11:04,560 --> 00:11:16,000jeopardy and you know if we try him based on just this this the circumstantial evidence and14900:11:16,000 --> 00:11:21,620the case isn't solid and then he's acquitted and he walks it's done and then the women15000:11:21,620 --> 00:11:28,280don't get justice a killer walks free and you know that's ridiculous it's a waste of resources15100:11:28,280 --> 00:11:33,120and time so while we want immediate response and we want something done now right now15200:11:33,120 --> 00:11:37,280it's in the best interest of everybody that we build a solid case before we take it to15300:11:37,280 --> 00:11:42,520trial so prosecutors want a strong case so the chance of that doubt is limited in an example15400:11:42,520 --> 00:11:46,000real quick I can give you just locally but a lot of people that listen or local is the15500:11:46,000 --> 00:11:49,640direct todley serial killer case and baton ruse which I am going to cover and I know people15600:11:49,640 --> 00:11:55,040have asked me to cover it I'm absolutely going to do it but some of the victims on the15700:11:55,040 --> 00:12:02,400formal charges when there's a lead was was charged some of the victims their names were15800:12:02,400 --> 00:12:11,200actually not on that indictment or on those charges and I know that like had to be a punch15900:12:11,200 --> 00:12:17,840to the gut to those families but the reasoning makes sense some of the cases against some16000:12:17,840 --> 00:12:24,960of the victims were much weaker than the other victims and this would matter tactically16100:12:24,960 --> 00:12:30,440because the conviction is the most important outcome and I know I mean I don't know I16200:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,400wasn't there but I bet a million dollars which I don't have to give you but I bet you16300:12:34,400 --> 00:12:40,040that prosecutor went over this with the families and explained to them with grace but if16400:12:40,040 --> 00:12:45,440we put her name on this she could be the link of reasonable doubt that makes him walk on16500:12:45,440 --> 00:12:50,920it so do we want the conviction or do we want the name on the paper and the families agreed16600:12:50,920 --> 00:12:57,520we don't care we just want him locked up and guess what it worked he was convicted he16700:12:57,520 --> 00:13:02,560was put on death row you know sorry spoil alert if you don't know the case but it's kind16800:13:02,560 --> 00:13:07,160of like M&M said the rapper you know got a sing for you at least like once in a while but16900:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,920you only get one shot do not miss your chance to blow this opportunity comes once in a lifetime17000:13:11,920 --> 00:13:16,040you know right you only get one shot and so if you you don't want to waste it you want17100:13:16,040 --> 00:13:20,800to make sure that's good and that it's solid whenever you go forward in front of a jury17200:13:20,800 --> 00:13:25,720I mean what do you want for me all I podcast I sing now I'm rapping I ain't no one trick17300:13:25,720 --> 00:13:32,560pony okay all I do is wake up and piss excellence I guess I don't know I'm just kidding all17400:13:32,560 --> 00:13:38,960right but any who in the mid 90s the investigations and those murders were cold and in order17500:13:38,960 --> 00:13:44,360to bring forward that strong prosecutor prosecutorial case there was gun need to be more17600:13:44,360 --> 00:13:49,880added it just had to be and because they were waiting and trying to get more evidence17700:13:49,880 --> 00:13:57,160five more years would pass and unlike the poor victims in this case science would continue17800:13:57,160 --> 00:14:06,640to grow and evolve and mature and it turns out improvements in what is known as DNA2 analysis17900:14:06,640 --> 00:14:12,240would become available now I'm going to assume you know absolutely nothing about DNA real quick18000:14:12,240 --> 00:14:16,240you probably know this but I'll just throw it out there in case you don't but DNA is basically18100:14:16,240 --> 00:14:22,120the code if you want to think about it's like the instruction manual for making you know18200:14:22,120 --> 00:14:27,800all the proteins that form our bodies right and so DNA testing could be done back in the18300:14:27,800 --> 00:14:35,68090s but this DNA2 allowed for more now total disclaimer y'all I am not a forensic scientist18400:14:35,680 --> 00:14:41,840I'm not I won't ever be not bright enough I guess storytelling is my game okay but I know18500:14:41,840 --> 00:14:45,960people that are forensic scientists and I know for a fact that they are the most intelligent18600:14:45,960 --> 00:14:50,200people and shout out to everyone who works at the crime labs because y'all are the real18700:14:50,200 --> 00:14:56,560MVPs okay however in my attempt to explain as much as possible to my listeners I feel18800:14:56,560 --> 00:15:02,960like I owe it to you I did my best to derive a simple explanation as this was way too complex18900:15:02,960 --> 00:15:06,560for the average Joe like myself but hey I tried so we're on the same level and if I get19000:15:06,560 --> 00:15:12,640it wrong y'all can chew me out in the comments but from what I gathered DNA2 would allow19100:15:12,640 --> 00:15:19,520for like damaged DNA or DNA that needed to be replicated and then amplified it allowed19200:15:19,520 --> 00:15:24,400for that to be achieved through this new testing method so let's say that you had just a poor19300:15:24,400 --> 00:15:29,520sample and you needed to make it bigger so that you could do more testing you could amplify19400:15:29,520 --> 00:15:33,600it or you could you could duplicate I guess I don't know that that's the right word but19500:15:33,600 --> 00:15:40,560the DNA2 level made that possible all right so realizing that this was achievable law19600:15:40,560 --> 00:15:46,720enforcement then decided to review all of the evidence of the murders and in 2008 they19700:15:46,720 --> 00:15:54,840submitted several items of evidence in for this new DNA testing procedure and that turned19800:15:54,840 --> 00:16:01,320out to be a good move because a forensic scientist was able to develop a male DNA profile from19900:16:01,320 --> 00:16:06,640blood and that blood was found underneath one of miss brisbo's fingernails so we know for20000:16:06,640 --> 00:16:12,520fact that this was not her DNA but it was underneath her fingernails and if you know anything about20100:16:12,520 --> 00:16:16,520trying to save your own life it's that you scratch claw bite do whatever you can do to get away20200:16:16,520 --> 00:16:22,360from the person attacking you so it's pretty damning that it's under her fingernails this20300:16:22,360 --> 00:16:29,080was awesome right but now you have to identify that said person that said male DNA who owns20400:16:29,080 --> 00:16:33,200it right so it's kind of like you find a wallet in a parking lot that's awesome it's got20500:16:33,200 --> 00:16:36,200all the money and it's got all the credit cards it's got everything but who the hell does20600:16:36,200 --> 00:16:40,480it belong to now you got to figure that out and you got multiple people with the same name20700:16:40,480 --> 00:16:45,400and you got a lot of people that are on you know every platform that you might reach out to20800:16:45,400 --> 00:16:50,800try to find them so now we have who it is in terms of DNA but we don't have who it is in terms20900:16:50,800 --> 00:16:58,440of an ID or a name and this was when the profile was entered into what's known as codis which21000:16:58,440 --> 00:17:08,600was in 2009 the combined DNA index system and as look what have it there was no immediate hit so21100:17:08,600 --> 00:17:14,120it's like damn right we got way more than we had but now we can't ID the person pretty frustrating21200:17:14,120 --> 00:17:20,160so I've been to our local state police crime lab on a few occasions and I even was a guest speaker21300:17:20,160 --> 00:17:25,040there at one of their conferences recently but I remember seeing the code of system and the woman21400:17:25,040 --> 00:17:32,800that was touring me when I went she mentioned that you know codis is not like in the movies or like in21500:17:32,800 --> 00:17:38,320you know a 30 minute episode of forensic files or something it's not like they just maybe put it21600:17:38,320 --> 00:17:43,520in and then ding here's the person that it belongs to she said that it's a very slow process where21700:17:43,520 --> 00:17:50,720it can take hours or even days for a full scan to complete think about it how many people have21800:17:50,720 --> 00:17:56,800their DNA in that system I mean they've got state employees might my DNAs and you know taken when I21900:17:56,800 --> 00:18:02,480worked in the prison systems and all that so state employees DNA are in there the criminals are all in22000:18:02,480 --> 00:18:11,760there and I know that as of April of 2021 the 20 millionth DNA profile was contributed to the22100:18:11,760 --> 00:18:19,360national DNA database in that code is software so we've got 20 million people's DNA that has to be22200:18:19,360 --> 00:18:26,560compared you can see why it's kind of a bigger task than the movies make it out to be right so basically22300:18:26,560 --> 00:18:33,040what codis does is it links an unknown DNA left during the commission of a crime to offenders who are22400:18:33,040 --> 00:18:41,280legally required to provide samples into the database now why why would we make people put their DNA22500:18:41,280 --> 00:18:51,520into the database because the same 20% of the population commits 100% of the crimes it makes sense to22600:18:51,520 --> 00:19:00,880get their DNA right so the FBI introduced this database in 1998 and the program just for your22700:19:00,880 --> 00:19:06,960shits and giggles of your own jeopardy that program began with only nine states actually using it22800:19:06,960 --> 00:19:14,800and then it's expanded now to all 50 and it's used to share those DNA profiles across all 50 states22900:19:14,800 --> 00:19:21,200including our federal law enforcement agencies and the Department of Defense it is a valuable tool23000:19:21,200 --> 00:19:29,120but why would all of these agencies need everybody's DNA again because the criminals are traveling23100:19:29,120 --> 00:19:34,560but they're still being criminals they're doing things all over poor all you know Ella goody that I23200:19:34,560 --> 00:19:42,880did the the episode on a few a few episodes back you know I feel like DNA should have solved this23300:19:42,880 --> 00:19:48,240once we find her body unfortunately it's been so long now that her body is probably decomposed but23400:19:48,240 --> 00:19:54,960you know that fool that we think did it I think did it was found in another state with her vehicle23500:19:54,960 --> 00:20:01,440people don't stop being criminals just because they go across a jurisdictional line like give me a break23600:20:01,440 --> 00:20:10,800right so through this amendment an expansion of the DNA identification act that was in 199423700:20:10,800 --> 00:20:17,360codis continues to help public forensic laboratories link crime scene evidence to other cases23800:20:17,360 --> 00:20:25,200or other persons already convicted or arrested for specific crimes and that expansion has broadened23900:20:25,200 --> 00:20:31,680codis and it's helping criminal investigations lead to more prosecutions across the nation and I know24000:20:31,680 --> 00:20:38,080locally if you're listening you know where I'm from we recently got one of the first what's called24100:20:38,080 --> 00:20:44,720rapid DNA systems installed in our parish jail and y'all the internet went wild you know people were24200:20:44,720 --> 00:20:49,680all open arms oh they're gonna take our DNA and use it against us and all this bullshit and I'm24300:20:49,680 --> 00:20:56,560like no bro we're not gonna take your day your DNA if it's not a qualifying offense do your research24400:20:56,560 --> 00:21:02,400we're not gonna take your DNA because you're on a stop sign you know I'm saying like don't rob murder24500:21:02,400 --> 00:21:10,560rape or kill and you're probably good so simmer down and what you're gonna find is that over the next24600:21:10,560 --> 00:21:16,400year we are gonna solve more crimes than you're in your in your wildest dreams in our local area24700:21:17,280 --> 00:21:22,880because that DNA is gonna link them I'm telling you just watch it happen you can call me a psychic in24800:21:22,880 --> 00:21:27,760a year whenever I come back with the with the data for you all right so moving forward24900:21:27,760 --> 00:21:34,000eventually a hit would be made but it would take a few years but strangely this is where shit gets25000:21:34,000 --> 00:21:46,080weird when they got the hit of the DNA it came back as a woman how if it's male DNA that was25100:21:46,880 --> 00:21:53,040found under the fingernails and then they finally get a hit how is it coming back to a woman all right25200:21:53,040 --> 00:21:58,240well mistakes can be made of course and stranger things have happened I mean computer entry could have25300:21:58,240 --> 00:22:04,880been mislabeled or something along those lines but this was DNA and DNA doesn't lie so how in the25400:22:04,880 --> 00:22:11,520actual hell is a male DNA hitting in the system but it's a female and police had the same question right25500:22:12,720 --> 00:22:17,520well remember how Perry had been Douglas Perry had been taken into custody by the ATF for those25600:22:17,520 --> 00:22:24,480weapons charges that I had mentioned in those violations well in November of 2012 the county25700:22:24,480 --> 00:22:30,800sheriff's detective named James dressback and Spokane police detective Mark Burbridge arranged a25800:22:30,800 --> 00:22:38,240meeting to go see Perry he was being held as a federal inmate at the Spokane County jail to try25900:22:38,240 --> 00:22:42,400you know they wanted to go try and sort this out and say okay we got to figure out what's going on26000:22:42,400 --> 00:22:50,880here thing is when Perry came into the room it was quite obvious that this was someone wanting to26100:22:50,880 --> 00:22:57,440portray themselves as a female and absolutely but fucking ugly wanted that if I'm just going to be26200:22:57,440 --> 00:23:08,000honest but presenting that way no less even the inmate ID showed as female but it was a man you could26300:23:08,000 --> 00:23:14,880tell all right so in quarring minds want to know what's up with that right like what what is going on26400:23:14,880 --> 00:23:21,760here well check this out remember when the original officer pulled Perry over when the prostitute26500:23:21,760 --> 00:23:25,680pointed him out during the complaint he drove by and she goes that's him right there that's the26600:23:25,680 --> 00:23:30,400weirdo with the mannequins and all the weird stuff in his house and then he went and he searched Perry's26700:23:30,400 --> 00:23:35,360vehicle but all he found was like some surgery literature and other items that were random in the car26800:23:36,080 --> 00:23:47,840well guess what that surgery paperwork was about a friggin sex change turns out between that pullover26900:23:47,840 --> 00:23:55,760and the new DNA2 developments old Douglas in the year 2000 underwent gender reassignment surgery27000:23:55,760 --> 00:24:06,480in Thailand and became Donna Perry it's times like this y'all that I think I actually might be turning27100:24:06,480 --> 00:24:11,280into my grandmother because I'm gonna echo her sentiments because she always says to me I'm getting27200:24:11,280 --> 00:24:18,320too old for this shit and I think I am too is this really the world that we're living in like really27300:24:18,320 --> 00:24:25,680but I guess it is so police are tracking down Douglas who sperm was at the scene and end up with a27400:24:25,680 --> 00:24:31,680Donna over here who now says he's a woman just because he cut off his pecker but who likely raped and27500:24:31,680 --> 00:24:44,880murdered three women with sed-missing pecker years ago okay Jesus so turns out our police had27600:24:44,880 --> 00:24:52,800the right guy but he was now a she all righty them so here they are now with Dickless Douglas and27700:24:52,800 --> 00:24:59,280they were armed with a search warrant for his DNA now if you think I'm being disrespectful disrespectful27800:24:59,280 --> 00:25:06,560of someone who went through a sex change well you're damn right I'm absolutely being disrespectful27900:25:06,560 --> 00:25:13,360disrespectful he showed no respect for his victims when he dumped them like trash he showed no28000:25:13,360 --> 00:25:19,200regard for their lives when he made them suffer he showed no regard for them when he dumped them28100:25:19,200 --> 00:25:26,080and posed them and humiliated them so I don't give a damn what trash you know what trash can your28200:25:26,080 --> 00:25:31,120pecker resides in you're just a murderer with a fake vagina so get the fuck out of my face that's28300:25:31,120 --> 00:25:37,760how I feel about this it infuriates me infuriates me because wait till you get this explanation of28400:25:37,760 --> 00:25:44,800of why he did what he did so as you can imagine Douglas fain's confusion as to why the detectives were28500:25:44,800 --> 00:25:51,280there and at the outset of the interview the detectives told him that they were working in old case28600:25:51,280 --> 00:25:56,960and they wanted to see if Perry could help them and needed to first advise him of his rights so28700:25:56,960 --> 00:26:03,360that's sweet right I mean Yolanda Nikki and Kathy they had their rights just taken from them with no28800:26:03,360 --> 00:26:08,560prior warnings issued but the police did their job and they read him his rights you have the right28900:26:08,560 --> 00:26:12,240to remain silent anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law you have29000:26:12,240 --> 00:26:16,080the rights when attorney if you cannot afford one will be provided for you do understand your rights29100:26:16,080 --> 00:26:23,520and upon the advising of his rights Perry said and this is a direct quote I should probably have29200:26:23,520 --> 00:26:30,160an attorney here if you're gonna question me about something well Yolanda Nikki and Kathy should29300:26:30,160 --> 00:26:36,000have a bodyguard if you're gonna go try to kill him they didn't get that but detective dress back29400:26:36,000 --> 00:26:41,840who had been reading the rights from a card that he had pointed out to Perry that he had noted her29500:26:41,840 --> 00:26:48,160or his we have you want to refer to him on the card and then Perry signed the card detective dress29600:26:48,160 --> 00:26:53,200back then said okay we have another order of business we have to take care of today and he told Perry29700:26:53,200 --> 00:26:59,280that he had a search warrant to obtain his DNA sample and when Perry asked in conjunction with what29800:26:59,280 --> 00:27:05,680the detective answered that it was in conjunction with some old cases that they were investigating29900:27:07,280 --> 00:27:13,440well when Perry asked what the detectives meant by old cases this is the following exchange that30000:27:13,440 --> 00:27:18,320was had detective dress back said well I want to make sure that you want to talk to me about this okay30100:27:18,320 --> 00:27:24,400and Perry said well I think I have I should have a lawyer here if you're gonna take the DNA in all of30200:27:24,400 --> 00:27:29,520this and that's when Burbridge had to kind of school him a little bit and said your lawyer doesn't get30300:27:29,520 --> 00:27:35,520to be here while we serve the search warrant because guys a lawyer can't override a search warrant30400:27:35,520 --> 00:27:42,480the judge signed off on it you're taking the DNA and to me it was really interesting that Dickless30500:27:42,480 --> 00:27:49,360Douglas wants to know more about you know the information they're trying to get but in the same30600:27:49,360 --> 00:27:55,600breath doesn't want to talk and wants a lawyer and he also isn't very empathetic about denying anything30700:27:55,600 --> 00:28:01,680so Perry what would ask the detectives why they wanted his DNA and detective Burbridge responded30800:28:01,680 --> 00:28:07,520we have a search warrant for first degree murder and we believe that you have information about that30900:28:07,520 --> 00:28:14,800about that murder and Perry started asking additional questions and detective Burbridge told him again31000:28:14,800 --> 00:28:21,760you wanted a lawyer so I can't talk to you if you want to talk to us then and then Perry cut its31100:28:21,760 --> 00:28:26,080cuts him off and says yeah I need a lawyer for something like this and Burbridge then says well then31200:28:26,080 --> 00:28:31,600you need to tell me that so Perry repeated it yeah I think I better have a lawyer this is crazy31300:28:32,080 --> 00:28:37,680Perry was provided with the search warrant but said he couldn't read it without his glasses so31400:28:37,680 --> 00:28:44,320detective dress back read it to him he then instructed him how to swab the inside of his cheek to provide31500:28:44,320 --> 00:28:51,200the samples and whenever Perry handed those swabs back to the detective Perry said am I being accused31600:28:51,200 --> 00:28:56,560of murder or something and detective dress back responded that he was the prime suspect in multiple31700:28:56,560 --> 00:29:02,160murders so I feel like the police were very open with why they were there and what they were doing31800:29:02,160 --> 00:29:09,200and after Perry stated that he didn't understand what was going on the following exchange occurred31900:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,880and I pulled this from a an appeal document that I found32000:29:12,880 --> 00:29:21,360Perry stated that he didn't understand what was going on and then detective Burbridge said again32100:29:21,360 --> 00:29:27,520Donna we can't talk to you you've asked for a lawyer unless you tell us you want to sit down and talk32200:29:27,520 --> 00:29:32,800so this is one of those typical things where I know my rights and I want a lawyer but then you want32300:29:32,800 --> 00:29:36,160to talk about it well you can't have it both ways either you want to talk you want to have a lawyer32400:29:36,160 --> 00:29:43,280and you want to shut up pick one so dress back said and you do understand that the rights of you32500:29:43,280 --> 00:29:49,520having an attorney and your right to remain silent those are your rights all they do is restrict me32600:29:49,520 --> 00:29:55,920they don't restrict you in any way you have the right to talk and you have the right not to talk okay32700:29:55,920 --> 00:30:01,040so I'm obviously going to honor your right to an attorney at this time which is why we're not32800:30:01,040 --> 00:30:08,080freely discussing the whole thing with you but it's your right he then said he was going to tape32900:30:08,080 --> 00:30:13,680up the box with the DNA samples and he'd be back with a copy of a return for Perry and then the33000:30:13,680 --> 00:30:19,040detectives left the room for about five minutes well when they came back they gave him a copy of33100:30:19,040 --> 00:30:24,160the search warrant and Perry told the detectives tell me what's going on I don't understand a thing33200:30:24,160 --> 00:30:29,200I need a lawyer or someone to explain what's actually going on the detectives gave a brief33300:30:29,200 --> 00:30:35,680description of the crimes and the code is hit that led them to him so then Perry asked additional33400:30:35,680 --> 00:30:42,560questions and expressed that he was quote unquote paranoid and in a total panic mode and had a million33500:30:42,560 --> 00:30:49,200questions now detective dress back responded well I have about a thousand so you've gotten more than me33600:30:49,200 --> 00:30:56,960and like I said before it's your right if you want at any time to talk to me but you have the right33700:30:56,960 --> 00:31:02,000to choose not to but until that happens I'm not too terribly comfortable asking you anything33800:31:02,000 --> 00:31:08,080about it to clarify things so that's where we're at do you have any questions for me and Perry said33900:31:08,080 --> 00:31:13,920what are the names of the people now real quick y'all if you didn't kill anybody why would their names matter34000:31:13,920 --> 00:31:23,040just curious like what is that going to change anything if you know their names is that34100:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,040going to help you out in any way why why why aren't you freaking screaming from the rooftops34200:31:27,040 --> 00:31:31,360I didn't kill anybody what are you talking about no what are their names34300:31:33,200 --> 00:31:39,760right so Burbage says I'm not comfortable going down that road not yet and that's when Perry expressed34400:31:39,760 --> 00:31:44,560again how upset he was about being a suspect the detective said they were going to give him time to34500:31:44,560 --> 00:31:49,040finish the soda that they had brought him and then they'd be back and they were going to take him34600:31:49,040 --> 00:31:54,160back into the jail so detective dress back returned roughly six minutes later and gave Perry his34700:31:54,160 --> 00:31:59,200business card and told him to let him know if she or he whatever decided that he wanted to talk34800:31:59,920 --> 00:32:06,800and Perry reiterated how upset he was including to ask for the detectives pistol and one round so34900:32:06,800 --> 00:32:13,440that he could quote unquote finish it but then said well let's talk let's sit down and talk I need35000:32:13,440 --> 00:32:20,400to work this out in my head so in essence he wanted to he wanted to talk he said he wanted a lawyer35100:32:20,400 --> 00:32:27,520but he wanted to talk and this would be what we call a stressed out worried she man at this point35200:32:28,080 --> 00:32:32,640all right so detective burbridge entered the room and detective dress back said that before they35300:32:32,640 --> 00:32:39,440could talk he needed to reread the rights to him he reread the rights and asked if he understood35400:32:39,440 --> 00:32:46,240them and Perry said yes all right detectives did their job right they followed the law to a T35500:32:46,240 --> 00:32:52,800and now old boy wants to talk so they asked if he wanted to answer any of the questions and Perry said35600:32:52,800 --> 00:32:57,920I'll try to answer your questions and the detective needed the signature on the advice of the rights35700:32:57,920 --> 00:33:03,680card and Perry then signed it and during the questioning that followed Perry told the detectives35800:33:03,680 --> 00:33:11,200I did pick up some prostitutes yes but I always let them out and they were alive and well when I let35900:33:11,200 --> 00:33:18,320them out so detective burbridge suggested that something made Perry stop killing something had to make36000:33:18,320 --> 00:33:23,200these people stop being killed and this is the following exchange that occurred and again these are36100:33:23,200 --> 00:33:31,120direct quotes from some paperwork I'll pull remember also there was a total denial of any responsibility36200:33:31,120 --> 00:33:39,520before this detective burbridge says here here's the real thing the question is to me people that36300:33:39,520 --> 00:33:45,760kill people multiple people over periods of time they generally keep going once it starts36400:33:46,560 --> 00:33:53,440and Perry says yeah and then burbridge said so the question to me is you know as a law enforcement36500:33:53,440 --> 00:34:00,080that studied this in depth and Perry says uh-huh per per uh burbridge says what made Donna stop36600:34:00,080 --> 00:34:09,120so then I ask myself and then Perry interrupts him and this is what he says36700:34:10,640 --> 00:34:17,280Douglas didn't stop Donna stopped it the gender change operation36800:34:17,280 --> 00:34:25,360at that point I'm like what in the Bruce general Olympics is going on here so now he's saying he did36900:34:25,360 --> 00:34:31,840kill I guess when he was going by Douglas but Donna has no responsibility37000:34:31,840 --> 00:34:36,240and so you know burbridge comes back do you think that's what stopped it37100:34:36,800 --> 00:34:44,080and Perry says I have yeah I'm convinced of it dress back says I hadn't thought of that that's37200:34:44,080 --> 00:34:50,320that's a good question and burbridge says well here's another another one I'm wondering too is37300:34:50,320 --> 00:34:59,120where is she because dress back says there's no more testosterone to fuel the anger right37400:34:59,120 --> 00:35:06,720and shortly thereafter as the detectives continue to question Perry if she had committed the murder37500:35:06,720 --> 00:35:13,840she says I'm not going to admit I killed anybody I didn't Donna has killed nobody37600:35:13,840 --> 00:35:21,520and burbridge comes back and says so Doug did and Perry says I don't know if Doug did or not37700:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,440it's 20 years ago and I have no idea whether he did or didn't37800:35:25,440 --> 00:35:36,160so while Perry denied many times in the remainder of the interview that Doug had murdered37900:35:36,160 --> 00:35:43,760any of the victims she later repeated that she quote got rid of violence with the sex change38000:35:43,760 --> 00:35:48,800operation so as you can see there's a lot going on turn this exchange from denials to talking38100:35:48,800 --> 00:35:54,240in the third person to acting as if you're someone else other than who you were 20 years ago38200:35:54,240 --> 00:36:01,600like literally implying that it's not the same person so naturally this raised a lot of eyebrows38300:36:01,600 --> 00:36:06,960and it seemed as though maybe you know did he have a sex change to not take responsibility for38400:36:06,960 --> 00:36:13,520his actions of murdering three innocent women and others thought no he's just a pervert and a sexual38500:36:13,520 --> 00:36:20,240freak but you know I found a criminologist I was reading some articles and things who made a38600:36:20,240 --> 00:36:25,760pretty compelling argument that the killings were motivated by jealousy because Douglass wanted to38700:36:25,760 --> 00:36:32,800be a woman himself and that sounds silly off the top but if you think about it he did claim that he38800:36:32,800 --> 00:36:38,720had transitioned into being a female to stop the male persona from being violent so I can get38900:36:38,720 --> 00:36:46,080on board with that but not in an honorable way as Perry seems to try and spin it you know I could39000:36:46,080 --> 00:36:52,000see that the argument could be made that he wasn't you know he wouldn't be as jealous of the39100:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,480prostitutes if he thought in his mind that he had achieved their sexuality I know this is getting kind39200:36:56,480 --> 00:37:03,600of weird but I mean I could understand the argument but this is still irrelevant to the situation39300:37:03,600 --> 00:37:08,800it's like we as a society are supposed to somehow just understand his personal problem as though39400:37:08,800 --> 00:37:14,080it was one society needed to come to terms with no partner that's not how this is going to go39500:37:14,080 --> 00:37:20,080whatever your personal problems are they're just that they're personal they're yours and no woman39600:37:20,080 --> 00:37:26,400alive should have paid the price because you wanted to play dress up and be an ugly man with long hair39700:37:26,400 --> 00:37:31,600you know what I'm saying detective dress back who interviewed Perry also made the connections39800:37:31,600 --> 00:37:39,600that Perry was acting I mean was actually dating his roommate Claire Ann remember her she was the one39900:37:39,600 --> 00:37:44,720that the detectives were wanting to interview but she was found to be awarded the state or of a40000:37:44,720 --> 00:37:49,600of a caretaker and then she ended up dying well he made the connection detective did that Perry was40100:37:49,600 --> 00:37:56,560actually dating the roommate Claire Ann before his sex change operation and she too was a sex worker40200:37:56,560 --> 00:38:03,120who also suffered with a cocaine addiction and her being arrested played a role in motivation40300:38:03,120 --> 00:38:08,400and that the detective felt the timing of the murders was a key here this was his direct quote40400:38:08,400 --> 00:38:13,680it was interesting that Claire Ann was booked into jail on the night that two of these women were40500:38:13,680 --> 00:38:20,240killed now she's back in jail again and that makes Doug Perry mad and then he finds somebody to take40600:38:20,240 --> 00:38:26,400it out on and the first people he's gonna look at are the people that maybe he thinks are standing40700:38:26,400 --> 00:38:33,360in his way it seems to me pretty obvious that the sex change was the end goal of Perry the whole time40800:38:33,360 --> 00:38:39,040I don't think that that was to get out of any responsibility I think he wanted the sex change40900:38:39,680 --> 00:38:46,880one criminologist stated that him procuring sex workers having sex with them and then discarding of41000:38:46,880 --> 00:38:55,120the bodies and showing just this reverent irreverence that he had towards them was all part of the master41100:38:55,120 --> 00:39:02,160plan and I totally agree with that with that statement but also that criminologist brought up Perry's41200:39:02,160 --> 00:39:08,400childhood as a possible motivator in these crimes which there are claims that he was you know41300:39:09,040 --> 00:39:14,640oppressed by hyper masculinity and sexual harassment from his father I don't know about that41400:39:14,640 --> 00:39:20,800that was just an argument made by that criminologist and so he says he needed to perfect he needed41500:39:20,800 --> 00:39:27,120to become he needed to get away from the little boy that was supposedly raped by his father41600:39:27,120 --> 00:39:31,920and become a woman who could actually provide sex to other men that was the game plan41700:39:31,920 --> 00:39:38,560in Perry's mind Perry was killing the thing that he hated and then trying to become the perfection41800:39:38,560 --> 00:39:44,880of it he added that was that criminologist standpoint I don't know what do you think I should tell41900:39:44,880 --> 00:39:54,160me what do you think I don't know kind of seems like a cop out to me knowing full well that he wouldn't42000:39:54,160 --> 00:39:59,520be approved and knowing that he would have to go out of the country to get the surgery it probably42100:39:59,520 --> 00:40:04,800bolstered his hatred towards women because they were born with this they didn't have to go get all the42200:40:04,800 --> 00:40:10,480work done that he had to go through and so he had this building boiling over anger towards these women42300:40:10,480 --> 00:40:18,960so in essence the argument is made that Perry was denied his real sexuality while regular women42400:40:18,960 --> 00:40:31,200were not well he didn't have to have a period so I take offense to that he didn't have stomach42500:40:31,200 --> 00:40:36,320cramps he didn't have to give birth he didn't have to do a lot of the things that women these days do42600:40:36,320 --> 00:40:41,040he wanted to dress up he didn't want to really go through the motions I don't buy that and if you42700:40:41,040 --> 00:40:46,960don't like what I'm telling you that's okay it's America you can disagree with me but what a joke42800:40:46,960 --> 00:40:55,120what an absolute just joke of a human being you know and again you can't make a personal problem42900:40:55,120 --> 00:41:00,480that you have a social one society doesn't need to pay for your problems that you're having and43000:41:00,480 --> 00:41:07,760if we do go along with that justification or ideology as acceptable well then school shootings and genocide43100:41:07,760 --> 00:41:14,400and racism and all of the above would be acceptable under that logic right because I don't like you43200:41:14,400 --> 00:41:19,520because of my problem so I'm gonna go hurt you because that's basically what happened here no thanks43300:41:19,520 --> 00:41:30,000no thank you right so I appreciate the why but I don't appreciate what was done to innocent women43400:41:30,000 --> 00:41:38,240coming to terms with his sexuality and anger does not absolve him of the responsibility of killing43500:41:38,240 --> 00:41:46,320other women because of jealousy it's like freaking fatal attraction the law does not care either43600:41:46,320 --> 00:41:53,280about your sexuality it cares about you not hurting others and that said are you curious about what43700:41:53,280 --> 00:41:58,240we do with people who have undergone like sex change surgery after conviction because I thought I'd43800:41:58,240 --> 00:42:05,040touch on that real quick well when I was at Angola um if men came in with breast implants but they still43900:42:05,040 --> 00:42:12,880had a penis they still went to male prison because you're a male you just paid to have fake boobs put44000:42:12,880 --> 00:42:21,760in right you're still a man but if the undercarriage has had work that now changes things44100:42:22,560 --> 00:42:33,040Douglas Perry was housed in a women's facility this becomes interesting too okay and again y'all I'm44200:42:33,040 --> 00:42:39,440not being hateful I'm just trying to show the disparity here between the the the care and the44300:42:39,440 --> 00:42:46,480and the thought process that we put into these criminals in their bad childhoods but none to those44400:42:46,480 --> 00:42:57,600victims because they were sex workers no give me a break it becomes interesting because when Perry44500:42:57,600 --> 00:43:04,400was being held in that women's facility a few things came to light right about how damaged he was44600:43:04,400 --> 00:43:11,280in 2013 law enforcement learned that Perry had been making incriminating statements to a fellow44700:43:11,280 --> 00:43:22,720inmate his his celly named Chero Everson and she uh Chero shared a cell with Perry at the federal44800:43:22,720 --> 00:43:29,680prison in Texas and Detective dress back in Burbridge traveled to Texas in June of 2013 to interview her44900:43:29,680 --> 00:43:35,520and according to Miss Everson although she and Perry were only incarcerated together for about a45000:43:35,520 --> 00:43:44,400month and a half Perry came to trust her and even started asking about the two of them getting married45100:43:44,400 --> 00:43:53,520getting married so so I guess now he's a lesbian like I cannot even keep up with this dude's45200:43:53,520 --> 00:44:01,600psyche you wanted to become a woman so you could have sex with other women what in the world45300:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,000is happening here45400:44:04,000 --> 00:44:11,920Miss Everson also said that Perry told her he had been diagnosed with schizophrenia and was a sociopath45500:44:11,920 --> 00:44:18,640and that guns and ammunition were his hobbies and that he had made money becoming a contract killer45600:44:18,640 --> 00:44:29,440okay so Perry then also told Miss Everson that she had killed prostitutes at first saying that45700:44:29,440 --> 00:44:34,480that that he had killed nine prostitutes but then later would say it was more like between 20 and 3045800:44:34,480 --> 00:44:43,840and then had a discussion with Chero Everson that the prostitutes were seen as and this is a direct45900:44:43,840 --> 00:44:47,840quote nothing they were nobody's they were pond scum46000:44:47,840 --> 00:44:59,120also according to Miss Everson was that Perry said he was jealous of the prostitutes because they46100:44:59,120 --> 00:45:09,120could have families and she even testified at Perry's trial and said that um Perry told her46200:45:09,120 --> 00:45:14,320that he became a woman to disguise himself and to get the heat off of him because nobody would look46300:45:14,320 --> 00:45:21,760for an elderly lady with a mental condition I don't feel sorry for him y'all and there is an46400:45:21,760 --> 00:45:27,200absolute deflection of guilt between the two identities and minimization of responsibility46500:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,840for sure if you're paying attention to what's going on here and I would argue that the sex change46600:45:31,840 --> 00:45:36,640didn't stop the criminality either because he already had completed the sex change when he got in46700:45:36,640 --> 00:45:42,640trouble for the weapons charges so maybe the sexual component was reduced but criminality did not46800:45:42,640 --> 00:45:48,320stop altogether that was not the only motivating factor behind what he did the massive reduction in46900:45:48,320 --> 00:45:55,680testosterone alone would you know chill out a man I mean we know that because we treat male sex47000:45:55,680 --> 00:46:00,160offenders with depopravera in some instances they get female hormones in essence you know chemical47100:46:00,160 --> 00:46:04,160castration and some states even allow what's called an orcaectomy if you've ever heard of that which is47200:46:04,160 --> 00:46:10,720basically physical castration but it still doesn't undo the damage and death and abuse that these47300:46:10,720 --> 00:46:18,320these men do to their victims and the same here goes with Douglas or Donna I mean you know write47400:46:18,320 --> 00:46:22,800something ugly and crumble it up on a piece of paper right and then tell that paper you're sorry47500:46:22,800 --> 00:46:31,040and then undo that paper did it undamaged the paper no so regardless of what crazy justification he47600:46:31,040 --> 00:46:38,320came up with in his mind penis or not he's a dangerous sexual deviant murderer he took a personal47700:46:38,320 --> 00:46:45,600problem and he made it a social problem period so ultimately though that DNA sample that was obtained47800:46:45,600 --> 00:46:51,200from Helm was analyzed by the Washington State Patrol crime lab and was compared with other evidence47900:46:51,200 --> 00:46:57,200obtained from the murder victims and their surroundings and guess what after a complete analysis was48000:46:57,200 --> 00:47:03,760done it was proved to be definitive as a match to the blood found under miss brisbo's fingernail48100:47:03,760 --> 00:47:10,080it was a match a weaker one but a match to that floral blanket found near miss yolanda saps body48200:47:10,080 --> 00:47:18,800and it was also a match to a vaginal swab of miss brisbo he was in on or around every one of those48300:47:18,800 --> 00:47:26,720women that were murdered so news flash dickless Doug you are caught no matter what mental disorder48400:47:26,720 --> 00:47:31,840you have going on in your head it was you committing the crimes you had the same blood do that48500:47:31,840 --> 00:47:38,240I mean when like when I was five I didn't have boobs y'all but I don't claim today that I have them48600:47:38,240 --> 00:47:43,280that it wasn't me who drew on the walls and spilled juice all over the kitchen the body is just48700:47:43,280 --> 00:47:50,080a little different but it's still me you are still Doug you are just missing your penis and changed48800:47:50,080 --> 00:47:56,000your name you should have you should have changed your name to like from Dougless to Dougless because48900:47:56,000 --> 00:48:02,080that's the only difference you're missing a piece you know I'm saying but going back to the ATF49000:48:02,080 --> 00:48:07,200investigation and that ultimate arrest I found some other information too during that search ATF49100:48:07,200 --> 00:48:13,200agent Lance Hart spoke with Perry and he described Perry as extremely knowledgeable about firearms49200:48:13,200 --> 00:48:19,520and very protective of the ones that were in his possession an agent aren't asked agent Hart asked49300:48:19,520 --> 00:48:25,200Doug how did you obtain these weapons how do you buy them and Perry said he at one time held a49400:48:25,200 --> 00:48:33,840federal firearms license but he lost it because they had found an unregistered machine gun in his49500:48:33,840 --> 00:48:41,840possession the dude doesn't follow the rules y'all and it was also then that Douglas added he was a49600:48:41,840 --> 00:48:48,960woman trapped in a man's body and made money by dressing up and engaging in prostitution this dude49700:48:48,960 --> 00:48:59,360is a problem then you flash forward to 2014 and the claims stated by Doug shifted a bit now he takes49800:48:59,360 --> 00:49:04,400the approach that somehow the Donna character he made up is morally superior to the Doug that he49900:49:04,400 --> 00:49:10,800once was and in an affidavit that I read he said direct quote Dougless didn't stop Donna stopped it50000:49:11,520 --> 00:49:19,040when he's talking to the police well if you had no idea back when your DNA was taken of what was happening50100:49:19,040 --> 00:49:26,000and you had no recollection of how you know of what Dougless did now that your Donna then how the hell do50200:49:26,000 --> 00:49:34,240you know that Donna is who stopped Doug and stopped Doug from what get out of here with that just50300:49:34,240 --> 00:49:39,120just get out of here get out of my face a one one crime expert that I was looking at some of his50400:49:39,840 --> 00:49:44,160reports and things written his name was Brian Frederick he said that he thinks that Douglas50500:49:44,160 --> 00:49:48,400Perry picked up the victims based on their looks because he felt like there was jealousy50600:49:48,400 --> 00:49:54,480and he said that I think he picked him up because they were attractive remember I told you these50700:49:54,480 --> 00:50:00,400women were pretty women and that they were more attractive than Douglas would ever be even if he50800:50:00,400 --> 00:50:07,440became Donna and so he was mad and jealous because they were squandering their beauty by giving sex50900:50:07,440 --> 00:50:14,160to men who didn't necessarily have the purpose that he had and this guy says he was on a mission he51000:50:14,160 --> 00:50:20,400was mission oriented and he just was mad so he was killing the women and I couldn't say I don't disagree51100:50:20,400 --> 00:50:31,440Perry also told that roommate in prison that he would quote pick a target study them guess their51200:50:31,440 --> 00:50:38,320moves and what they were gonna do where they went and then he would execute them now they did ask51300:50:38,320 --> 00:50:43,760in court because I guess they wanted to verify that miss ever send the roommate cell mate wasn't being I51400:50:43,760 --> 00:50:48,560guess a I don't know what the word would be your homophobic or what it transphobic or whatever51500:50:48,560 --> 00:50:54,320they said why do you keep using male pronouns whenever you're describing Perry like why aren't you51600:50:54,320 --> 00:51:01,200calling her a she and this was pretty important to me ever since said it was because Perry51700:51:01,200 --> 00:51:07,600told her that the reason for the sex change operation was to avoid detection and she said that every51800:51:07,600 --> 00:51:14,480interaction she ever had with Perry was as if he was a male he was not interacting with her as if51900:51:14,480 --> 00:51:23,600he was a female so then she went on to further say that Perry claimed to have killed the prostitutes52000:51:23,600 --> 00:51:28,800in a vehicle by a river and then kicked their bodies out of the vehicle and left them behind52100:51:30,160 --> 00:51:37,440and then also said that Perry was bragging and said that the police just didn't know really what they52200:51:37,440 --> 00:51:42,640were doing that Perry was able to dispose of evidence and got away with it and that law enforcement52300:51:42,640 --> 00:51:47,120had even unknowingly destroyed some of the firearms he used to commit other murders52400:51:47,120 --> 00:51:55,360then she also testified that she received nothing in exchange for her information or her52500:51:55,360 --> 00:52:01,600testimony against Perry and that she eventually had asked the staff to move her away from Perry52600:52:01,600 --> 00:52:05,920because she was afraid of him and they honored that request and put her in a different unit52700:52:05,920 --> 00:52:16,320when the when the police went to Texas to bring Perry to Spokane for the trial Perry said to them52800:52:16,320 --> 00:52:22,640I'm never gonna get out of this instead of jail I hope they'll just send me to some eastern52900:52:22,640 --> 00:52:30,480state hospital I'm not violent now and that the plane ride would be quote unquote the last time53000:52:30,480 --> 00:52:38,720she would ever be outside of concrete walls well boo freaking who because when you killed the53100:52:38,720 --> 00:52:43,760three women that was the last time they were on this side of the dirt at least you get to eat53200:52:43,760 --> 00:52:47,600at least you get to talk to people at least if anybody wants to visit you they can53300:52:48,560 --> 00:52:53,440the other women didn't get that opportunity because you chose to snuff out their life because53400:52:53,440 --> 00:52:57,920you felt you were somehow superior to them and they didn't matter what the fact is they did53500:52:57,920 --> 00:53:05,280they mattered and as such the state charged Perry with three counts of premeditated first degree53600:53:05,280 --> 00:53:11,200murder with the aggravating circumstance that their murder was part of a common scheme or plan53700:53:11,200 --> 00:53:17,840involving one or more victims and at the conclusion of a trial that took several weeks the jury53800:53:17,840 --> 00:53:24,160did find Perry guilty is charged answering yes to special verdict forms asking if the murders53900:53:24,160 --> 00:53:30,400had been part of a common scheme or plan so the trial court sentenced Perry to three life sentences54000:53:30,400 --> 00:53:37,440to be served consecutively which means one after the other without the possibility of parole54100:53:37,440 --> 00:53:42,720or early release on top of that they also imposed a seven hundred and ten dollar fine in legal54200:53:42,720 --> 00:53:48,960financial obligations and a five hundred dollar fee for the crime victim assessment fee54300:53:48,960 --> 00:53:56,480as well as a one hundred dollar DNA collection fee and a one hundred and ten dollar criminal filing fee54400:53:56,480 --> 00:54:03,040so Donna or Douglas or Dickless or daughter or Daffy Duck or whatever the hell title you want to54500:54:03,040 --> 00:54:10,560give yourself you did it you did the crime and Justice Delayed is Justice denied so while it took54600:54:10,560 --> 00:54:17,120a while for there to be a trial twenty seven years to be exact justice in the lawful sense was finally54700:54:17,120 --> 00:54:24,160achieved and it was served and I told you this was a weird one there was no rhyme or reason just evil54800:54:24,160 --> 00:54:34,080in my opinion and this killer deserves to be behind bars if not executed so to me is preoccupation54900:54:34,080 --> 00:54:37,840with this genitals is really what got him where he is and it's weird to me it's like why do55000:54:38,960 --> 00:54:48,400men with the smallest dicks always have the biggest complex is you need to calm down push pop55100:54:48,400 --> 00:54:50,980(upbeat music)55200:54:51,800 --> 00:54:54,380(upbeat music)55300:54:54,380 --> 00:54:57,540(dramatic music playing)