The Spokane Serial Killer Part 2

1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,700 Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real 2 00:00:10,700 --> 00:00:21,840 victims whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real? 3 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:26,960 I use my experiences in law enforcement, corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal 4 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:33,320 justice educator dig deep into complex cases of evil acts, some so evil many feel they are 5 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:51,000 unspeakable. 6 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,120 Warning, unspeakable is intended for mature audiences. 7 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:56,880 If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl. 8 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:58,280 Listing discretion is advised. 9 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:01,440 Hey y'all, Kelly Jiddings here back for another episode of Unspeakable. 10 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:02,440 Let's go and on. 11 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:03,760 I'm recording on a Sunday. 12 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:05,760 Thank God for DVRs. 13 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:09,920 I'm recording my Saints game because I gotta give the people what they want and I gotta 14 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:11,120 give it to them all in time. 15 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:15,800 So we got a new episode today, but before I do that, I've got a couple of shout outs that 16 00:01:15,800 --> 00:01:20,680 I need to give because the people have messaged me and made sure I knew I had to give them 17 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:22,680 their shout outs and y'all I will not let you down. 18 00:01:22,680 --> 00:01:23,920 My word is my bond. 19 00:01:23,920 --> 00:01:25,760 So let me start here though. 20 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:31,880 Last episode or two episodes ago, I just said Jade because I didn't have a last name, but 21 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:35,840 I got that last name and so I am gonna give another shout out. 22 00:01:35,840 --> 00:01:39,240 It's Miss Jade Bible and I thought that was kind of cool too. 23 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:41,760 So hey Jade, I'm sorry, I just called you Jade. 24 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:46,960 You are Jade Bible and I thank you so very much for joining my Patreon and then all 25 00:01:46,960 --> 00:01:48,600 the way from Oregon. 26 00:01:48,600 --> 00:01:51,480 I've got Miss Sandra Oliver. 27 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:53,240 Hey girl, how are you? 28 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:55,760 I'm so excited to see the states where people listen. 29 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:59,160 I think that's one of the coolest things and Miss Sandra, thank you so much. 30 00:01:59,160 --> 00:02:05,560 I really appreciate you joining and being a member of my Patreon. 31 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:12,280 Then Missouri was freaking in the house because Miss Kathy Ray Brown, hey Miss Kathy, I got 32 00:02:12,280 --> 00:02:13,280 you. 33 00:02:13,280 --> 00:02:16,640 I saw you and I said I gotta give her that shout out and you're right here on my notebook. 34 00:02:16,640 --> 00:02:19,880 Miss Kathy, how are you and you have someone else? 35 00:02:19,880 --> 00:02:25,740 Now I don't know if Sullivan is near Grand B, I think that's how you say it, Missouri, but 36 00:02:25,740 --> 00:02:29,440 Miss Amy Garner, hey Amy, hey there. 37 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,760 I got both of y'all, y'all friends, y'all know each other? 38 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:37,600 But thank you all so much for listening, so glad to have you and then last but certainly 39 00:02:37,600 --> 00:02:44,680 not least I have Mr. Douglas Birchum and he wanted to make sure everybody knew he is 40 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:48,200 actually friends with Jody Plotje and I think that's kind of cool right because y'all 41 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:53,680 got to hear Jody talking a past episode and he was so cute, he was telling me about his 42 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:58,600 daddy and how he said that his dad has heard every slaughter of the word Birchum known to 43 00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:03,920 sweet Jesus and I said, dude, let me tell you something, my name is Jennings and everyone 44 00:03:03,920 --> 00:03:06,960 calls me Jenkins or something else. 45 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:10,120 So you know, I feel that on every level. 46 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:16,680 So to Jade, Sandra, Amy, Kathy and Mr. Douglas, thank you all so, so very much your support 47 00:03:16,680 --> 00:03:21,040 means the world and without you, I really couldn't do the podcasting because your support is 48 00:03:21,040 --> 00:03:22,800 what makes the difference for me. 49 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:28,160 So welcome to the team and let's dive into this part two of this Douglas Perry episode 50 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:36,040 and something else too, don't forget, I'm usually really active on Facebook but don't 51 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,600 forget that Patriot now has a free level that you can join and you don't get everything 52 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:44,760 obviously but you can get more than the average bear I guess would if you don't follow 53 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:49,400 anything so go in there and join that free level and you can see some of my photos and things 54 00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:52,720 that I post if you want to be able to see extra as you got to join and you can pick your 55 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,120 level and it's whatever you can do it this time. 56 00:03:55,120 --> 00:04:00,520 So thank you all so much but we're going to pick back up in Spokane, Washington where three 57 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:05,360 sex workers were killed in the late or the early 90s 1990s and the suspect would eventually 58 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:10,840 be identified as Mr. Douglas Perry and the murdered women just as a recap or 26 year 59 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:17,320 old Yolanda Sap, 34 year old Nikki Lowe and 38 year old Kathy Brisbo. 60 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:21,440 And I had mentioned last episode two that a prostitute, another one had come forward and 61 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:24,840 mentioned that she was really freaked out by this experience and that Douglas actually 62 00:04:24,840 --> 00:04:31,200 drove by and was ID by that woman as she literally made the report so hey that was some good 63 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:32,200 luck there. 64 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:37,080 And also if you remember ATF had confiscated a bunch of weapons from him which he was not 65 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:41,880 supposed to be in possession of and he had a history of misbehavior at best and I covered 66 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:42,880 that in the last episode. 67 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:46,720 So hey if you didn't listen to the last one go listen before you you finished forward on 68 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:47,880 this one. 69 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:51,520 But unfortunately being weird does not constitute an arrest. 70 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:57,000 Thank God right I'd be arrested but being weird can't get you arrested. 71 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:02,560 We have to have hard evidence y'all but the 90s they just weren't up for the forensic challenge 72 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:03,560 in the 90s. 73 00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:09,760 We have the advancements that we have today but lucky for us science matured as the years 74 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:10,760 went on. 75 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:14,480 So obviously an investigation was going to be launched and very quickly the Spokane Police 76 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:19,520 Department and the Spokane County Sheriff's Office came to believe that these were going 77 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:21,040 to be serial murders. 78 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:22,040 Why serial? 79 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,440 Okay why did they just think this is going to be a serial murder and not just someone that 80 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:29,120 was out there or multiple people out there that were killing these prostitutes and just 81 00:05:29,120 --> 00:05:31,080 dumping them after they were using them. 82 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:36,480 So the answer was because the modus operandi the mo right was just too similar the women 83 00:05:36,480 --> 00:05:39,280 all live similar lives in the sex industry. 84 00:05:39,280 --> 00:05:45,160 The perpetrators consistent use of a similar you know small caliber firearm in the killings 85 00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:48,840 was something you couldn't overlook and then the location where all of the bodies were 86 00:05:48,840 --> 00:05:52,760 dropped it was just too coincidental and I don't believe in coincidences in either do law 87 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:53,760 enforcement. 88 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:59,120 So that's why they believe this to be a serial killer and not multiple people. 89 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:03,240 So the department conducted a joint investigation which is really cool because that means you 90 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:09,080 have more multiple resources and a lot of people attacking the same case just from their own 91 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,360 jurisdiction or agency. 92 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:15,920 Now remember I've said this like a billion times the same 20% of the population is committing 93 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:22,840 100% of the crimes and joining efforts is imperative to large scale crime solving. 94 00:06:22,840 --> 00:06:24,160 I'm a big proponent of that. 95 00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:29,520 I don't think that we need to have these ego trips where no this is my investigation. 96 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:33,480 No if the goal is to solve it let's solve it right let's put all our heads together and 97 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:38,680 criminals often commit crimes in more than one jurisdiction. 98 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:44,280 So joint investigations would reflect that situation and we have to work together to connect 99 00:06:44,280 --> 00:06:48,400 the dots if not it's like literally a connect the dots worksheet where we have the dots 100 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:52,280 everywhere but if we don't connect them then we can't see the full scope of what's going 101 00:06:52,280 --> 00:06:55,400 on with the person that's committing the crimes. 102 00:06:55,400 --> 00:07:00,920 And so these joint operations allow for the collection of evidence in each of the jurisdictions 103 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:07,800 involved and it helps them each to build their cases respectively throughout their agencies. 104 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:12,320 Now around the same time other murderers were making their mark on the area as well and 105 00:07:12,320 --> 00:07:18,240 one of which was Robert Yates which everyone knows is the Green River Killer and for a brief 106 00:07:18,240 --> 00:07:25,520 time he was all over their radar but evidence just simply didn't support him as the killer. 107 00:07:25,520 --> 00:07:29,920 They looked I even looked at a report a science it was like a forensic report where they had 108 00:07:29,920 --> 00:07:34,960 compared like calibers of weapons and M.O. and all of that and it just while there could 109 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:41,040 have been some slight similarity there it literally was just not enough to make a direct 110 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:45,280 connection and say yes lamb thank you ma'am this was him and good thing they didn't do 111 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:47,800 that because they would have been wrong. 112 00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:52,120 But eventually he would be abandoned as someone that they thought should be held responsible 113 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:57,200 for these murders and they kept looking but shortly thereafter this investigation went 114 00:07:57,200 --> 00:08:05,000 cold as ice I mean nothing no one was calling in tips no other bodies appeared and no other 115 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:10,280 bodies appeared with the same calling card at least as how these women had been murdered 116 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:16,600 and the leads simply dried up you know we have to have these leads and you never know how 117 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:22,960 small the little bit of information that you give can matter matter fact I didn't plan 118 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,160 on saying this but I'm going to you real quick if you all follow my Facebook you should have 119 00:08:26,160 --> 00:08:30,960 seen that picture of the back of that truck with the blood dripping down it right and 120 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:34,400 I made a joke about hey is it murder or is it deer season okay obviously it's deer season 121 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:40,920 in South Louisiana and other places too right but you know it was just kind of me joking 122 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:45,320 well I didn't take a picture of the full truck because it turns out I actually I actually 123 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:49,200 teach the person driving it I didn't know that at the time but then he stuck his head out 124 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:52,600 the window was waving I was like oh my god hey so buddy if you're listening you know who 125 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:56,800 you are hey buddy all right so what was cool about it though was a little while later 126 00:08:56,800 --> 00:09:02,380 after I had posted that on Facebook a gentleman that listen said oh yeah I saw that same 127 00:09:02,380 --> 00:09:08,200 truck driving down range and he mentioned this sticker that's on the back window of that 128 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:13,720 truck and mind you I had not put a picture of that back window so I know that he saw 129 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:18,240 the exact same truck I did and then he added plus he drives like an idiot not cracked up 130 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:25,800 laughing because now I tell your mama but you know that small little tip what if I was looking 131 00:09:25,800 --> 00:09:29,240 for that truck and I didn't know anything about it and then someone else was able to say 132 00:09:29,240 --> 00:09:32,960 yeah I saw that truck too with that exact same sticker with the blood and it was driving 133 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:38,680 down you know range avenue at this X amount of time then we get a timeline and that small 134 00:09:38,680 --> 00:09:41,760 little bit of information we can go to cameras and we can go looking for that truck and 135 00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:47,720 can try to track it down but you know when people aren't calling in anything when prostitutes 136 00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:51,280 aren't saying anything else that are working those streets and we have nothing in the murder 137 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:57,620 stop why did they stop you know where did this person go and if they stopped then what 138 00:09:57,620 --> 00:10:04,560 was their true motive was that they directly hated those three women or you know what 139 00:10:04,560 --> 00:10:10,800 is it like why give me the why right so while Douglass Perry looked like a great suspect 140 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:18,100 the link from him to the women was circumstantial at best and no prosecutor would touch that 141 00:10:18,100 --> 00:10:26,480 case at that level with a 10 foot pole I mean considering all you need is and people I think 142 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:32,240 the public misses this sometimes considering all you need is reasonable doubt in a case 143 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:37,640 for someone to walk or just a little bit beyond reasonable doubt for someone to walk on 144 00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:46,040 something hashtag case Anthony hashtag oj Simpson you know I'm saying like considering that's 145 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:51,800 all you need no prosecutor is going to want to take on that case put forth all that work 146 00:10:51,800 --> 00:10:59,800 and only have circumstantial evidence to point to maybe they did it we needed more okay 147 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:04,560 and also don't forget that that pesky fifth amendment right and that we can't have double 148 00:11:04,560 --> 00:11:16,000 jeopardy and you know if we try him based on just this this the circumstantial evidence and 149 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:21,620 the case isn't solid and then he's acquitted and he walks it's done and then the women 150 00:11:21,620 --> 00:11:28,280 don't get justice a killer walks free and you know that's ridiculous it's a waste of resources 151 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:33,120 and time so while we want immediate response and we want something done now right now 152 00:11:33,120 --> 00:11:37,280 it's in the best interest of everybody that we build a solid case before we take it to 153 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:42,520 trial so prosecutors want a strong case so the chance of that doubt is limited in an example 154 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:46,000 real quick I can give you just locally but a lot of people that listen or local is the 155 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:49,640 direct todley serial killer case and baton ruse which I am going to cover and I know people 156 00:11:49,640 --> 00:11:55,040 have asked me to cover it I'm absolutely going to do it but some of the victims on the 157 00:11:55,040 --> 00:12:02,400 formal charges when there's a lead was was charged some of the victims their names were 158 00:12:02,400 --> 00:12:11,200 actually not on that indictment or on those charges and I know that like had to be a punch 159 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:17,840 to the gut to those families but the reasoning makes sense some of the cases against some 160 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:24,960 of the victims were much weaker than the other victims and this would matter tactically 161 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:30,440 because the conviction is the most important outcome and I know I mean I don't know I 162 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:34,400 wasn't there but I bet a million dollars which I don't have to give you but I bet you 163 00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:40,040 that prosecutor went over this with the families and explained to them with grace but if 164 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:45,440 we put her name on this she could be the link of reasonable doubt that makes him walk on 165 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:50,920 it so do we want the conviction or do we want the name on the paper and the families agreed 166 00:12:50,920 --> 00:12:57,520 we don't care we just want him locked up and guess what it worked he was convicted he 167 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:02,560 was put on death row you know sorry spoil alert if you don't know the case but it's kind 168 00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:07,160 of like M&M said the rapper you know got a sing for you at least like once in a while but 169 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,920 you only get one shot do not miss your chance to blow this opportunity comes once in a lifetime 170 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:16,040 you know right you only get one shot and so if you you don't want to waste it you want 171 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:20,800 to make sure that's good and that it's solid whenever you go forward in front of a jury 172 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:25,720 I mean what do you want for me all I podcast I sing now I'm rapping I ain't no one trick 173 00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:32,560 pony okay all I do is wake up and piss excellence I guess I don't know I'm just kidding all 174 00:13:32,560 --> 00:13:38,960 right but any who in the mid 90s the investigations and those murders were cold and in order 175 00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:44,360 to bring forward that strong prosecutor prosecutorial case there was gun need to be more 176 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:49,880 added it just had to be and because they were waiting and trying to get more evidence 177 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:57,160 five more years would pass and unlike the poor victims in this case science would continue 178 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:06,640 to grow and evolve and mature and it turns out improvements in what is known as DNA2 analysis 179 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:12,240 would become available now I'm going to assume you know absolutely nothing about DNA real quick 180 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:16,240 you probably know this but I'll just throw it out there in case you don't but DNA is basically 181 00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:22,120 the code if you want to think about it's like the instruction manual for making you know 182 00:14:22,120 --> 00:14:27,800 all the proteins that form our bodies right and so DNA testing could be done back in the 183 00:14:27,800 --> 00:14:35,680 90s but this DNA2 allowed for more now total disclaimer y'all I am not a forensic scientist 184 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:41,840 I'm not I won't ever be not bright enough I guess storytelling is my game okay but I know 185 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:45,960 people that are forensic scientists and I know for a fact that they are the most intelligent 186 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:50,200 people and shout out to everyone who works at the crime labs because y'all are the real 187 00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:56,560 MVPs okay however in my attempt to explain as much as possible to my listeners I feel 188 00:14:56,560 --> 00:15:02,960 like I owe it to you I did my best to derive a simple explanation as this was way too complex 189 00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:06,560 for the average Joe like myself but hey I tried so we're on the same level and if I get 190 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:12,640 it wrong y'all can chew me out in the comments but from what I gathered DNA2 would allow 191 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:19,520 for like damaged DNA or DNA that needed to be replicated and then amplified it allowed 192 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:24,400 for that to be achieved through this new testing method so let's say that you had just a poor 193 00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:29,520 sample and you needed to make it bigger so that you could do more testing you could amplify 194 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:33,600 it or you could you could duplicate I guess I don't know that that's the right word but 195 00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:40,560 the DNA2 level made that possible all right so realizing that this was achievable law 196 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:46,720 enforcement then decided to review all of the evidence of the murders and in 2008 they 197 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:54,840 submitted several items of evidence in for this new DNA testing procedure and that turned 198 00:15:54,840 --> 00:16:01,320 out to be a good move because a forensic scientist was able to develop a male DNA profile from 199 00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:06,640 blood and that blood was found underneath one of miss brisbo's fingernails so we know for 200 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:12,520 fact that this was not her DNA but it was underneath her fingernails and if you know anything about 201 00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:16,520 trying to save your own life it's that you scratch claw bite do whatever you can do to get away 202 00:16:16,520 --> 00:16:22,360 from the person attacking you so it's pretty damning that it's under her fingernails this 203 00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:29,080 was awesome right but now you have to identify that said person that said male DNA who owns 204 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:33,200 it right so it's kind of like you find a wallet in a parking lot that's awesome it's got 205 00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:36,200 all the money and it's got all the credit cards it's got everything but who the hell does 206 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:40,480 it belong to now you got to figure that out and you got multiple people with the same name 207 00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:45,400 and you got a lot of people that are on you know every platform that you might reach out to 208 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:50,800 try to find them so now we have who it is in terms of DNA but we don't have who it is in terms 209 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:58,440 of an ID or a name and this was when the profile was entered into what's known as codis which 210 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:08,600 was in 2009 the combined DNA index system and as look what have it there was no immediate hit so 211 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:14,120 it's like damn right we got way more than we had but now we can't ID the person pretty frustrating 212 00:17:14,120 --> 00:17:20,160 so I've been to our local state police crime lab on a few occasions and I even was a guest speaker 213 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:25,040 there at one of their conferences recently but I remember seeing the code of system and the woman 214 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:32,800 that was touring me when I went she mentioned that you know codis is not like in the movies or like in 215 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:38,320 you know a 30 minute episode of forensic files or something it's not like they just maybe put it 216 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:43,520 in and then ding here's the person that it belongs to she said that it's a very slow process where 217 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:50,720 it can take hours or even days for a full scan to complete think about it how many people have 218 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:56,800 their DNA in that system I mean they've got state employees might my DNAs and you know taken when I 219 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:02,480 worked in the prison systems and all that so state employees DNA are in there the criminals are all in 220 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:11,760 there and I know that as of April of 2021 the 20 millionth DNA profile was contributed to the 221 00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:19,360 national DNA database in that code is software so we've got 20 million people's DNA that has to be 222 00:18:19,360 --> 00:18:26,560 compared you can see why it's kind of a bigger task than the movies make it out to be right so basically 223 00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:33,040 what codis does is it links an unknown DNA left during the commission of a crime to offenders who are 224 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:41,280 legally required to provide samples into the database now why why would we make people put their DNA 225 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:51,520 into the database because the same 20% of the population commits 100% of the crimes it makes sense to 226 00:18:51,520 --> 00:19:00,880 get their DNA right so the FBI introduced this database in 1998 and the program just for your 227 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:06,960 shits and giggles of your own jeopardy that program began with only nine states actually using it 228 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:14,800 and then it's expanded now to all 50 and it's used to share those DNA profiles across all 50 states 229 00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:21,200 including our federal law enforcement agencies and the Department of Defense it is a valuable tool 230 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:29,120 but why would all of these agencies need everybody's DNA again because the criminals are traveling 231 00:19:29,120 --> 00:19:34,560 but they're still being criminals they're doing things all over poor all you know Ella goody that I 232 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:42,880 did the the episode on a few a few episodes back you know I feel like DNA should have solved this 233 00:19:42,880 --> 00:19:48,240 once we find her body unfortunately it's been so long now that her body is probably decomposed but 234 00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:54,960 you know that fool that we think did it I think did it was found in another state with her vehicle 235 00:19:54,960 --> 00:20:01,440 people don't stop being criminals just because they go across a jurisdictional line like give me a break 236 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:10,800 right so through this amendment an expansion of the DNA identification act that was in 1994 237 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:17,360 codis continues to help public forensic laboratories link crime scene evidence to other cases 238 00:20:17,360 --> 00:20:25,200 or other persons already convicted or arrested for specific crimes and that expansion has broadened 239 00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:31,680 codis and it's helping criminal investigations lead to more prosecutions across the nation and I know 240 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:38,080 locally if you're listening you know where I'm from we recently got one of the first what's called 241 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:44,720 rapid DNA systems installed in our parish jail and y'all the internet went wild you know people were 242 00:20:44,720 --> 00:20:49,680 all open arms oh they're gonna take our DNA and use it against us and all this bullshit and I'm 243 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:56,560 like no bro we're not gonna take your day your DNA if it's not a qualifying offense do your research 244 00:20:56,560 --> 00:21:02,400 we're not gonna take your DNA because you're on a stop sign you know I'm saying like don't rob murder 245 00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:10,560 rape or kill and you're probably good so simmer down and what you're gonna find is that over the next 246 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:16,400 year we are gonna solve more crimes than you're in your in your wildest dreams in our local area 247 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:22,880 because that DNA is gonna link them I'm telling you just watch it happen you can call me a psychic in 248 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:27,760 a year whenever I come back with the with the data for you all right so moving forward 249 00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:34,000 eventually a hit would be made but it would take a few years but strangely this is where shit gets 250 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:46,080 weird when they got the hit of the DNA it came back as a woman how if it's male DNA that was 251 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:53,040 found under the fingernails and then they finally get a hit how is it coming back to a woman all right 252 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:58,240 well mistakes can be made of course and stranger things have happened I mean computer entry could have 253 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:04,880 been mislabeled or something along those lines but this was DNA and DNA doesn't lie so how in the 254 00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:11,520 actual hell is a male DNA hitting in the system but it's a female and police had the same question right 255 00:22:12,720 --> 00:22:17,520 well remember how Perry had been Douglas Perry had been taken into custody by the ATF for those 256 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:24,480 weapons charges that I had mentioned in those violations well in November of 2012 the county 257 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:30,800 sheriff's detective named James dressback and Spokane police detective Mark Burbridge arranged a 258 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:38,240 meeting to go see Perry he was being held as a federal inmate at the Spokane County jail to try 259 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:42,400 you know they wanted to go try and sort this out and say okay we got to figure out what's going on 260 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:50,880 here thing is when Perry came into the room it was quite obvious that this was someone wanting to 261 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:57,440 portray themselves as a female and absolutely but fucking ugly wanted that if I'm just going to be 262 00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:08,000 honest but presenting that way no less even the inmate ID showed as female but it was a man you could 263 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:14,880 tell all right so in quarring minds want to know what's up with that right like what what is going on 264 00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:21,760 here well check this out remember when the original officer pulled Perry over when the prostitute 265 00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:25,680 pointed him out during the complaint he drove by and she goes that's him right there that's the 266 00:23:25,680 --> 00:23:30,400 weirdo with the mannequins and all the weird stuff in his house and then he went and he searched Perry's 267 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:35,360 vehicle but all he found was like some surgery literature and other items that were random in the car 268 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:47,840 well guess what that surgery paperwork was about a friggin sex change turns out between that pullover 269 00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:55,760 and the new DNA2 developments old Douglas in the year 2000 underwent gender reassignment surgery 270 00:23:55,760 --> 00:24:06,480 in Thailand and became Donna Perry it's times like this y'all that I think I actually might be turning 271 00:24:06,480 --> 00:24:11,280 into my grandmother because I'm gonna echo her sentiments because she always says to me I'm getting 272 00:24:11,280 --> 00:24:18,320 too old for this shit and I think I am too is this really the world that we're living in like really 273 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:25,680 but I guess it is so police are tracking down Douglas who sperm was at the scene and end up with a 274 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:31,680 Donna over here who now says he's a woman just because he cut off his pecker but who likely raped and 275 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:44,880 murdered three women with sed-missing pecker years ago okay Jesus so turns out our police had 276 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:52,800 the right guy but he was now a she all righty them so here they are now with Dickless Douglas and 277 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:59,280 they were armed with a search warrant for his DNA now if you think I'm being disrespectful disrespectful 278 00:24:59,280 --> 00:25:06,560 of someone who went through a sex change well you're damn right I'm absolutely being disrespectful 279 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:13,360 disrespectful he showed no respect for his victims when he dumped them like trash he showed no 280 00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:19,200 regard for their lives when he made them suffer he showed no regard for them when he dumped them 281 00:25:19,200 --> 00:25:26,080 and posed them and humiliated them so I don't give a damn what trash you know what trash can your 282 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:31,120 pecker resides in you're just a murderer with a fake vagina so get the fuck out of my face that's 283 00:25:31,120 --> 00:25:37,760 how I feel about this it infuriates me infuriates me because wait till you get this explanation of 284 00:25:37,760 --> 00:25:44,800 of why he did what he did so as you can imagine Douglas fain's confusion as to why the detectives were 285 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:51,280 there and at the outset of the interview the detectives told him that they were working in old case 286 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:56,960 and they wanted to see if Perry could help them and needed to first advise him of his rights so 287 00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:03,360 that's sweet right I mean Yolanda Nikki and Kathy they had their rights just taken from them with no 288 00:26:03,360 --> 00:26:08,560 prior warnings issued but the police did their job and they read him his rights you have the right 289 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:12,240 to remain silent anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law you have 290 00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:16,080 the rights when attorney if you cannot afford one will be provided for you do understand your rights 291 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:23,520 and upon the advising of his rights Perry said and this is a direct quote I should probably have 292 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:30,160 an attorney here if you're gonna question me about something well Yolanda Nikki and Kathy should 293 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:36,000 have a bodyguard if you're gonna go try to kill him they didn't get that but detective dress back 294 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:41,840 who had been reading the rights from a card that he had pointed out to Perry that he had noted her 295 00:26:41,840 --> 00:26:48,160 or his we have you want to refer to him on the card and then Perry signed the card detective dress 296 00:26:48,160 --> 00:26:53,200 back then said okay we have another order of business we have to take care of today and he told Perry 297 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:59,280 that he had a search warrant to obtain his DNA sample and when Perry asked in conjunction with what 298 00:26:59,280 --> 00:27:05,680 the detective answered that it was in conjunction with some old cases that they were investigating 299 00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:13,440 well when Perry asked what the detectives meant by old cases this is the following exchange that 300 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:18,320 was had detective dress back said well I want to make sure that you want to talk to me about this okay 301 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:24,400 and Perry said well I think I have I should have a lawyer here if you're gonna take the DNA in all of 302 00:27:24,400 --> 00:27:29,520 this and that's when Burbridge had to kind of school him a little bit and said your lawyer doesn't get 303 00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:35,520 to be here while we serve the search warrant because guys a lawyer can't override a search warrant 304 00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:42,480 the judge signed off on it you're taking the DNA and to me it was really interesting that Dickless 305 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:49,360 Douglas wants to know more about you know the information they're trying to get but in the same 306 00:27:49,360 --> 00:27:55,600 breath doesn't want to talk and wants a lawyer and he also isn't very empathetic about denying anything 307 00:27:55,600 --> 00:28:01,680 so Perry what would ask the detectives why they wanted his DNA and detective Burbridge responded 308 00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:07,520 we have a search warrant for first degree murder and we believe that you have information about that 309 00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:14,800 about that murder and Perry started asking additional questions and detective Burbridge told him again 310 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:21,760 you wanted a lawyer so I can't talk to you if you want to talk to us then and then Perry cut its 311 00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:26,080 cuts him off and says yeah I need a lawyer for something like this and Burbridge then says well then 312 00:28:26,080 --> 00:28:31,600 you need to tell me that so Perry repeated it yeah I think I better have a lawyer this is crazy 313 00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:37,680 Perry was provided with the search warrant but said he couldn't read it without his glasses so 314 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:44,320 detective dress back read it to him he then instructed him how to swab the inside of his cheek to provide 315 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:51,200 the samples and whenever Perry handed those swabs back to the detective Perry said am I being accused 316 00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:56,560 of murder or something and detective dress back responded that he was the prime suspect in multiple 317 00:28:56,560 --> 00:29:02,160 murders so I feel like the police were very open with why they were there and what they were doing 318 00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:09,200 and after Perry stated that he didn't understand what was going on the following exchange occurred 319 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,880 and I pulled this from a an appeal document that I found 320 00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:21,360 Perry stated that he didn't understand what was going on and then detective Burbridge said again 321 00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:27,520 Donna we can't talk to you you've asked for a lawyer unless you tell us you want to sit down and talk 322 00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:32,800 so this is one of those typical things where I know my rights and I want a lawyer but then you want 323 00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:36,160 to talk about it well you can't have it both ways either you want to talk you want to have a lawyer 324 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:43,280 and you want to shut up pick one so dress back said and you do understand that the rights of you 325 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:49,520 having an attorney and your right to remain silent those are your rights all they do is restrict me 326 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:55,920 they don't restrict you in any way you have the right to talk and you have the right not to talk okay 327 00:29:55,920 --> 00:30:01,040 so I'm obviously going to honor your right to an attorney at this time which is why we're not 328 00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:08,080 freely discussing the whole thing with you but it's your right he then said he was going to tape 329 00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:13,680 up the box with the DNA samples and he'd be back with a copy of a return for Perry and then the 330 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:19,040 detectives left the room for about five minutes well when they came back they gave him a copy of 331 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:24,160 the search warrant and Perry told the detectives tell me what's going on I don't understand a thing 332 00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:29,200 I need a lawyer or someone to explain what's actually going on the detectives gave a brief 333 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:35,680 description of the crimes and the code is hit that led them to him so then Perry asked additional 334 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:42,560 questions and expressed that he was quote unquote paranoid and in a total panic mode and had a million 335 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:49,200 questions now detective dress back responded well I have about a thousand so you've gotten more than me 336 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:56,960 and like I said before it's your right if you want at any time to talk to me but you have the right 337 00:30:56,960 --> 00:31:02,000 to choose not to but until that happens I'm not too terribly comfortable asking you anything 338 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:08,080 about it to clarify things so that's where we're at do you have any questions for me and Perry said 339 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:13,920 what are the names of the people now real quick y'all if you didn't kill anybody why would their names matter 340 00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:23,040 just curious like what is that going to change anything if you know their names is that 341 00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,040 going to help you out in any way why why why aren't you freaking screaming from the rooftops 342 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:31,360 I didn't kill anybody what are you talking about no what are their names 343 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:39,760 right so Burbage says I'm not comfortable going down that road not yet and that's when Perry expressed 344 00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:44,560 again how upset he was about being a suspect the detective said they were going to give him time to 345 00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:49,040 finish the soda that they had brought him and then they'd be back and they were going to take him 346 00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:54,160 back into the jail so detective dress back returned roughly six minutes later and gave Perry his 347 00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:59,200 business card and told him to let him know if she or he whatever decided that he wanted to talk 348 00:31:59,920 --> 00:32:06,800 and Perry reiterated how upset he was including to ask for the detectives pistol and one round so 349 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:13,440 that he could quote unquote finish it but then said well let's talk let's sit down and talk I need 350 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:20,400 to work this out in my head so in essence he wanted to he wanted to talk he said he wanted a lawyer 351 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:27,520 but he wanted to talk and this would be what we call a stressed out worried she man at this point 352 00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:32,640 all right so detective burbridge entered the room and detective dress back said that before they 353 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:39,440 could talk he needed to reread the rights to him he reread the rights and asked if he understood 354 00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:46,240 them and Perry said yes all right detectives did their job right they followed the law to a T 355 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:52,800 and now old boy wants to talk so they asked if he wanted to answer any of the questions and Perry said 356 00:32:52,800 --> 00:32:57,920 I'll try to answer your questions and the detective needed the signature on the advice of the rights 357 00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:03,680 card and Perry then signed it and during the questioning that followed Perry told the detectives 358 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:11,200 I did pick up some prostitutes yes but I always let them out and they were alive and well when I let 359 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:18,320 them out so detective burbridge suggested that something made Perry stop killing something had to make 360 00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:23,200 these people stop being killed and this is the following exchange that occurred and again these are 361 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:31,120 direct quotes from some paperwork I'll pull remember also there was a total denial of any responsibility 362 00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:39,520 before this detective burbridge says here here's the real thing the question is to me people that 363 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:45,760 kill people multiple people over periods of time they generally keep going once it starts 364 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:53,440 and Perry says yeah and then burbridge said so the question to me is you know as a law enforcement 365 00:33:53,440 --> 00:34:00,080 that studied this in depth and Perry says uh-huh per per uh burbridge says what made Donna stop 366 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:09,120 so then I ask myself and then Perry interrupts him and this is what he says 367 00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:17,280 Douglas didn't stop Donna stopped it the gender change operation 368 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:25,360 at that point I'm like what in the Bruce general Olympics is going on here so now he's saying he did 369 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:31,840 kill I guess when he was going by Douglas but Donna has no responsibility 370 00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:36,240 and so you know burbridge comes back do you think that's what stopped it 371 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:44,080 and Perry says I have yeah I'm convinced of it dress back says I hadn't thought of that that's 372 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:50,320 that's a good question and burbridge says well here's another another one I'm wondering too is 373 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:59,120 where is she because dress back says there's no more testosterone to fuel the anger right 374 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:06,720 and shortly thereafter as the detectives continue to question Perry if she had committed the murder 375 00:35:06,720 --> 00:35:13,840 she says I'm not going to admit I killed anybody I didn't Donna has killed nobody 376 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:21,520 and burbridge comes back and says so Doug did and Perry says I don't know if Doug did or not 377 00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,440 it's 20 years ago and I have no idea whether he did or didn't 378 00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:36,160 so while Perry denied many times in the remainder of the interview that Doug had murdered 379 00:35:36,160 --> 00:35:43,760 any of the victims she later repeated that she quote got rid of violence with the sex change 380 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:48,800 operation so as you can see there's a lot going on turn this exchange from denials to talking 381 00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:54,240 in the third person to acting as if you're someone else other than who you were 20 years ago 382 00:35:54,240 --> 00:36:01,600 like literally implying that it's not the same person so naturally this raised a lot of eyebrows 383 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:06,960 and it seemed as though maybe you know did he have a sex change to not take responsibility for 384 00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:13,520 his actions of murdering three innocent women and others thought no he's just a pervert and a sexual 385 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:20,240 freak but you know I found a criminologist I was reading some articles and things who made a 386 00:36:20,240 --> 00:36:25,760 pretty compelling argument that the killings were motivated by jealousy because Douglass wanted to 387 00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:32,800 be a woman himself and that sounds silly off the top but if you think about it he did claim that he 388 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:38,720 had transitioned into being a female to stop the male persona from being violent so I can get 389 00:36:38,720 --> 00:36:46,080 on board with that but not in an honorable way as Perry seems to try and spin it you know I could 390 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:52,000 see that the argument could be made that he wasn't you know he wouldn't be as jealous of the 391 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:56,480 prostitutes if he thought in his mind that he had achieved their sexuality I know this is getting kind 392 00:36:56,480 --> 00:37:03,600 of weird but I mean I could understand the argument but this is still irrelevant to the situation 393 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:08,800 it's like we as a society are supposed to somehow just understand his personal problem as though 394 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:14,080 it was one society needed to come to terms with no partner that's not how this is going to go 395 00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:20,080 whatever your personal problems are they're just that they're personal they're yours and no woman 396 00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:26,400 alive should have paid the price because you wanted to play dress up and be an ugly man with long hair 397 00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:31,600 you know what I'm saying detective dress back who interviewed Perry also made the connections 398 00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:39,600 that Perry was acting I mean was actually dating his roommate Claire Ann remember her she was the one 399 00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:44,720 that the detectives were wanting to interview but she was found to be awarded the state or of a 400 00:37:44,720 --> 00:37:49,600 of a caretaker and then she ended up dying well he made the connection detective did that Perry was 401 00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:56,560 actually dating the roommate Claire Ann before his sex change operation and she too was a sex worker 402 00:37:56,560 --> 00:38:03,120 who also suffered with a cocaine addiction and her being arrested played a role in motivation 403 00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:08,400 and that the detective felt the timing of the murders was a key here this was his direct quote 404 00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:13,680 it was interesting that Claire Ann was booked into jail on the night that two of these women were 405 00:38:13,680 --> 00:38:20,240 killed now she's back in jail again and that makes Doug Perry mad and then he finds somebody to take 406 00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:26,400 it out on and the first people he's gonna look at are the people that maybe he thinks are standing 407 00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:33,360 in his way it seems to me pretty obvious that the sex change was the end goal of Perry the whole time 408 00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:39,040 I don't think that that was to get out of any responsibility I think he wanted the sex change 409 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:46,880 one criminologist stated that him procuring sex workers having sex with them and then discarding of 410 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:55,120 the bodies and showing just this reverent irreverence that he had towards them was all part of the master 411 00:38:55,120 --> 00:39:02,160 plan and I totally agree with that with that statement but also that criminologist brought up Perry's 412 00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:08,400 childhood as a possible motivator in these crimes which there are claims that he was you know 413 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:14,640 oppressed by hyper masculinity and sexual harassment from his father I don't know about that 414 00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:20,800 that was just an argument made by that criminologist and so he says he needed to perfect he needed 415 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:27,120 to become he needed to get away from the little boy that was supposedly raped by his father 416 00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:31,920 and become a woman who could actually provide sex to other men that was the game plan 417 00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:38,560 in Perry's mind Perry was killing the thing that he hated and then trying to become the perfection 418 00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:44,880 of it he added that was that criminologist standpoint I don't know what do you think I should tell 419 00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:54,160 me what do you think I don't know kind of seems like a cop out to me knowing full well that he wouldn't 420 00:39:54,160 --> 00:39:59,520 be approved and knowing that he would have to go out of the country to get the surgery it probably 421 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:04,800 bolstered his hatred towards women because they were born with this they didn't have to go get all the 422 00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:10,480 work done that he had to go through and so he had this building boiling over anger towards these women 423 00:40:10,480 --> 00:40:18,960 so in essence the argument is made that Perry was denied his real sexuality while regular women 424 00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:31,200 were not well he didn't have to have a period so I take offense to that he didn't have stomach 425 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:36,320 cramps he didn't have to give birth he didn't have to do a lot of the things that women these days do 426 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:41,040 he wanted to dress up he didn't want to really go through the motions I don't buy that and if you 427 00:40:41,040 --> 00:40:46,960 don't like what I'm telling you that's okay it's America you can disagree with me but what a joke 428 00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:55,120 what an absolute just joke of a human being you know and again you can't make a personal problem 429 00:40:55,120 --> 00:41:00,480 that you have a social one society doesn't need to pay for your problems that you're having and 430 00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:07,760 if we do go along with that justification or ideology as acceptable well then school shootings and genocide 431 00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:14,400 and racism and all of the above would be acceptable under that logic right because I don't like you 432 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:19,520 because of my problem so I'm gonna go hurt you because that's basically what happened here no thanks 433 00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:30,000 no thank you right so I appreciate the why but I don't appreciate what was done to innocent women 434 00:41:30,000 --> 00:41:38,240 coming to terms with his sexuality and anger does not absolve him of the responsibility of killing 435 00:41:38,240 --> 00:41:46,320 other women because of jealousy it's like freaking fatal attraction the law does not care either 436 00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:53,280 about your sexuality it cares about you not hurting others and that said are you curious about what 437 00:41:53,280 --> 00:41:58,240 we do with people who have undergone like sex change surgery after conviction because I thought I'd 438 00:41:58,240 --> 00:42:05,040 touch on that real quick well when I was at Angola um if men came in with breast implants but they still 439 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:12,880 had a penis they still went to male prison because you're a male you just paid to have fake boobs put 440 00:42:12,880 --> 00:42:21,760 in right you're still a man but if the undercarriage has had work that now changes things 441 00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:33,040 Douglas Perry was housed in a women's facility this becomes interesting too okay and again y'all I'm 442 00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:39,440 not being hateful I'm just trying to show the disparity here between the the the care and the 443 00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:46,480 and the thought process that we put into these criminals in their bad childhoods but none to those 444 00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:57,600 victims because they were sex workers no give me a break it becomes interesting because when Perry 445 00:42:57,600 --> 00:43:04,400 was being held in that women's facility a few things came to light right about how damaged he was 446 00:43:04,400 --> 00:43:11,280 in 2013 law enforcement learned that Perry had been making incriminating statements to a fellow 447 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:22,720 inmate his his celly named Chero Everson and she uh Chero shared a cell with Perry at the federal 448 00:43:22,720 --> 00:43:29,680 prison in Texas and Detective dress back in Burbridge traveled to Texas in June of 2013 to interview her 449 00:43:29,680 --> 00:43:35,520 and according to Miss Everson although she and Perry were only incarcerated together for about a 450 00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:44,400 month and a half Perry came to trust her and even started asking about the two of them getting married 451 00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:53,520 getting married so so I guess now he's a lesbian like I cannot even keep up with this dude's 452 00:43:53,520 --> 00:44:01,600 psyche you wanted to become a woman so you could have sex with other women what in the world 453 00:44:01,600 --> 00:44:04,000 is happening here 454 00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:11,920 Miss Everson also said that Perry told her he had been diagnosed with schizophrenia and was a sociopath 455 00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:18,640 and that guns and ammunition were his hobbies and that he had made money becoming a contract killer 456 00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:29,440 okay so Perry then also told Miss Everson that she had killed prostitutes at first saying that 457 00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:34,480 that that he had killed nine prostitutes but then later would say it was more like between 20 and 30 458 00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:43,840 and then had a discussion with Chero Everson that the prostitutes were seen as and this is a direct 459 00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:47,840 quote nothing they were nobody's they were pond scum 460 00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:59,120 also according to Miss Everson was that Perry said he was jealous of the prostitutes because they 461 00:44:59,120 --> 00:45:09,120 could have families and she even testified at Perry's trial and said that um Perry told her 462 00:45:09,120 --> 00:45:14,320 that he became a woman to disguise himself and to get the heat off of him because nobody would look 463 00:45:14,320 --> 00:45:21,760 for an elderly lady with a mental condition I don't feel sorry for him y'all and there is an 464 00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:27,200 absolute deflection of guilt between the two identities and minimization of responsibility 465 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,840 for sure if you're paying attention to what's going on here and I would argue that the sex change 466 00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:36,640 didn't stop the criminality either because he already had completed the sex change when he got in 467 00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:42,640 trouble for the weapons charges so maybe the sexual component was reduced but criminality did not 468 00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:48,320 stop altogether that was not the only motivating factor behind what he did the massive reduction in 469 00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:55,680 testosterone alone would you know chill out a man I mean we know that because we treat male sex 470 00:45:55,680 --> 00:46:00,160 offenders with depopravera in some instances they get female hormones in essence you know chemical 471 00:46:00,160 --> 00:46:04,160 castration and some states even allow what's called an orcaectomy if you've ever heard of that which is 472 00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:10,720 basically physical castration but it still doesn't undo the damage and death and abuse that these 473 00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:18,320 these men do to their victims and the same here goes with Douglas or Donna I mean you know write 474 00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:22,800 something ugly and crumble it up on a piece of paper right and then tell that paper you're sorry 475 00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:31,040 and then undo that paper did it undamaged the paper no so regardless of what crazy justification he 476 00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:38,320 came up with in his mind penis or not he's a dangerous sexual deviant murderer he took a personal 477 00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:45,600 problem and he made it a social problem period so ultimately though that DNA sample that was obtained 478 00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:51,200 from Helm was analyzed by the Washington State Patrol crime lab and was compared with other evidence 479 00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:57,200 obtained from the murder victims and their surroundings and guess what after a complete analysis was 480 00:46:57,200 --> 00:47:03,760 done it was proved to be definitive as a match to the blood found under miss brisbo's fingernail 481 00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:10,080 it was a match a weaker one but a match to that floral blanket found near miss yolanda saps body 482 00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:18,800 and it was also a match to a vaginal swab of miss brisbo he was in on or around every one of those 483 00:47:18,800 --> 00:47:26,720 women that were murdered so news flash dickless Doug you are caught no matter what mental disorder 484 00:47:26,720 --> 00:47:31,840 you have going on in your head it was you committing the crimes you had the same blood do that 485 00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:38,240 I mean when like when I was five I didn't have boobs y'all but I don't claim today that I have them 486 00:47:38,240 --> 00:47:43,280 that it wasn't me who drew on the walls and spilled juice all over the kitchen the body is just 487 00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:50,080 a little different but it's still me you are still Doug you are just missing your penis and changed 488 00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:56,000 your name you should have you should have changed your name to like from Dougless to Dougless because 489 00:47:56,000 --> 00:48:02,080 that's the only difference you're missing a piece you know I'm saying but going back to the ATF 490 00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:07,200 investigation and that ultimate arrest I found some other information too during that search ATF 491 00:48:07,200 --> 00:48:13,200 agent Lance Hart spoke with Perry and he described Perry as extremely knowledgeable about firearms 492 00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:19,520 and very protective of the ones that were in his possession an agent aren't asked agent Hart asked 493 00:48:19,520 --> 00:48:25,200 Doug how did you obtain these weapons how do you buy them and Perry said he at one time held a 494 00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:33,840 federal firearms license but he lost it because they had found an unregistered machine gun in his 495 00:48:33,840 --> 00:48:41,840 possession the dude doesn't follow the rules y'all and it was also then that Douglas added he was a 496 00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:48,960 woman trapped in a man's body and made money by dressing up and engaging in prostitution this dude 497 00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:59,360 is a problem then you flash forward to 2014 and the claims stated by Doug shifted a bit now he takes 498 00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:04,400 the approach that somehow the Donna character he made up is morally superior to the Doug that he 499 00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:10,800 once was and in an affidavit that I read he said direct quote Dougless didn't stop Donna stopped it 500 00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:19,040 when he's talking to the police well if you had no idea back when your DNA was taken of what was happening 501 00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:26,000 and you had no recollection of how you know of what Dougless did now that your Donna then how the hell do 502 00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:34,240 you know that Donna is who stopped Doug and stopped Doug from what get out of here with that just 503 00:49:34,240 --> 00:49:39,120 just get out of here get out of my face a one one crime expert that I was looking at some of his 504 00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:44,160 reports and things written his name was Brian Frederick he said that he thinks that Douglas 505 00:49:44,160 --> 00:49:48,400 Perry picked up the victims based on their looks because he felt like there was jealousy 506 00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:54,480 and he said that I think he picked him up because they were attractive remember I told you these 507 00:49:54,480 --> 00:50:00,400 women were pretty women and that they were more attractive than Douglas would ever be even if he 508 00:50:00,400 --> 00:50:07,440 became Donna and so he was mad and jealous because they were squandering their beauty by giving sex 509 00:50:07,440 --> 00:50:14,160 to men who didn't necessarily have the purpose that he had and this guy says he was on a mission he 510 00:50:14,160 --> 00:50:20,400 was mission oriented and he just was mad so he was killing the women and I couldn't say I don't disagree 511 00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:31,440 Perry also told that roommate in prison that he would quote pick a target study them guess their 512 00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:38,320 moves and what they were gonna do where they went and then he would execute them now they did ask 513 00:50:38,320 --> 00:50:43,760 in court because I guess they wanted to verify that miss ever send the roommate cell mate wasn't being I 514 00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:48,560 guess a I don't know what the word would be your homophobic or what it transphobic or whatever 515 00:50:48,560 --> 00:50:54,320 they said why do you keep using male pronouns whenever you're describing Perry like why aren't you 516 00:50:54,320 --> 00:51:01,200 calling her a she and this was pretty important to me ever since said it was because Perry 517 00:51:01,200 --> 00:51:07,600 told her that the reason for the sex change operation was to avoid detection and she said that every 518 00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:14,480 interaction she ever had with Perry was as if he was a male he was not interacting with her as if 519 00:51:14,480 --> 00:51:23,600 he was a female so then she went on to further say that Perry claimed to have killed the prostitutes 520 00:51:23,600 --> 00:51:28,800 in a vehicle by a river and then kicked their bodies out of the vehicle and left them behind 521 00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:37,440 and then also said that Perry was bragging and said that the police just didn't know really what they 522 00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:42,640 were doing that Perry was able to dispose of evidence and got away with it and that law enforcement 523 00:51:42,640 --> 00:51:47,120 had even unknowingly destroyed some of the firearms he used to commit other murders 524 00:51:47,120 --> 00:51:55,360 then she also testified that she received nothing in exchange for her information or her 525 00:51:55,360 --> 00:52:01,600 testimony against Perry and that she eventually had asked the staff to move her away from Perry 526 00:52:01,600 --> 00:52:05,920 because she was afraid of him and they honored that request and put her in a different unit 527 00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:16,320 when the when the police went to Texas to bring Perry to Spokane for the trial Perry said to them 528 00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:22,640 I'm never gonna get out of this instead of jail I hope they'll just send me to some eastern 529 00:52:22,640 --> 00:52:30,480 state hospital I'm not violent now and that the plane ride would be quote unquote the last time 530 00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:38,720 she would ever be outside of concrete walls well boo freaking who because when you killed the 531 00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:43,760 three women that was the last time they were on this side of the dirt at least you get to eat 532 00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:47,600 at least you get to talk to people at least if anybody wants to visit you they can 533 00:52:48,560 --> 00:52:53,440 the other women didn't get that opportunity because you chose to snuff out their life because 534 00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:57,920 you felt you were somehow superior to them and they didn't matter what the fact is they did 535 00:52:57,920 --> 00:53:05,280 they mattered and as such the state charged Perry with three counts of premeditated first degree 536 00:53:05,280 --> 00:53:11,200 murder with the aggravating circumstance that their murder was part of a common scheme or plan 537 00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:17,840 involving one or more victims and at the conclusion of a trial that took several weeks the jury 538 00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:24,160 did find Perry guilty is charged answering yes to special verdict forms asking if the murders 539 00:53:24,160 --> 00:53:30,400 had been part of a common scheme or plan so the trial court sentenced Perry to three life sentences 540 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:37,440 to be served consecutively which means one after the other without the possibility of parole 541 00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:42,720 or early release on top of that they also imposed a seven hundred and ten dollar fine in legal 542 00:53:42,720 --> 00:53:48,960 financial obligations and a five hundred dollar fee for the crime victim assessment fee 543 00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:56,480 as well as a one hundred dollar DNA collection fee and a one hundred and ten dollar criminal filing fee 544 00:53:56,480 --> 00:54:03,040 so Donna or Douglas or Dickless or daughter or Daffy Duck or whatever the hell title you want to 545 00:54:03,040 --> 00:54:10,560 give yourself you did it you did the crime and Justice Delayed is Justice denied so while it took 546 00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:17,120 a while for there to be a trial twenty seven years to be exact justice in the lawful sense was finally 547 00:54:17,120 --> 00:54:24,160 achieved and it was served and I told you this was a weird one there was no rhyme or reason just evil 548 00:54:24,160 --> 00:54:34,080 in my opinion and this killer deserves to be behind bars if not executed so to me is preoccupation 549 00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:37,840 with this genitals is really what got him where he is and it's weird to me it's like why do 550 00:54:38,960 --> 00:54:48,400 men with the smallest dicks always have the biggest complex is you need to calm down push pop 551 00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:50,980 (upbeat music) 552 00:54:51,800 --> 00:54:54,380 (upbeat music) 553 00:54:54,380 --> 00:54:57,540 (dramatic music playing)