Toxic: The Murder of Joni Sanders

1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,700 Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real 2 00:00:10,700 --> 00:00:21,840 victims whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real? 3 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:26,960 I use my experiences in law enforcement, corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal 4 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:33,320 justice educator dig deep into complex cases of evil acts, some so evil many feel they are 5 00:00:33,320 --> 00:00:51,000 unspeakable. 6 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,120 Warning, unspeakable is intended for mature audiences. 7 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:56,880 If you are easily offended, then I'm not your girl. 8 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:58,280 Listening discretion is advised. 9 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:01,120 Hey y'all, KJ here back for another episode of Unspeakable. 10 00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:02,120 Let's go and on. 11 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:03,120 Let's go and on. 12 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:06,120 We're back in two, season five, and this is episode two. 13 00:01:06,120 --> 00:01:07,120 How have you been? 14 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:08,920 I hope you've been listening and catching up. 15 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,560 I know a lot of people have been messaging me saying, "I took a break during Christmas 16 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:13,440 and I'm having a catch up and this is going great." 17 00:01:13,440 --> 00:01:15,120 Well great, binge it. 18 00:01:15,120 --> 00:01:19,840 Get all your shows if you want to, but speaking of shows, did you all know that that live 19 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:26,920 show that we just posted sold out, it sold out in one hour and twenty minutes, which I 20 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:29,280 guess as a creator is phenomenal. 21 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:30,280 I was dumbfounded. 22 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:31,280 I was shocked. 23 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:32,280 Jim wasn't. 24 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:34,680 Jim a Thee was like, "Yeah, that's how it goes." 25 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:36,600 But I was shocked, I don't know. 26 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:39,400 So, wow, thank y'all so much for buying those tickets. 27 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:45,920 And so we had so much of a demand or request/demand of another show that we did open another 28 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:46,920 one up. 29 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:48,360 There will not be a third show. 30 00:01:48,360 --> 00:01:52,200 So if you want to come and you want to see the live show that I've got coming up, it's 31 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:53,400 a good one. 32 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:55,400 And so we added another night. 33 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:59,720 As of the time of this recording, we do have seats available, but that may not be the case 34 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:01,480 because they're selling really fast. 35 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:03,280 So get online. 36 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:04,960 I've put links out on my Facebook. 37 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:06,640 I've put links on Patreon. 38 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:07,640 I've put links. 39 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:08,640 I think pretty much everywhere. 40 00:02:08,640 --> 00:02:10,520 I can put them for you to find them. 41 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:11,520 But go get them. 42 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:12,520 Get your tickets now. 43 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:14,600 Please don't wait because like I said, I'm not doing a third night. 44 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:17,480 There will only be these two nights. 45 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:20,600 Just when you buy the tickets, there were a lot of questions about, well, what about an 46 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:22,680 email confirmation? 47 00:02:22,680 --> 00:02:26,740 It does send out an email confirmation, but they keep going everywhere until you're spam 48 00:02:26,740 --> 00:02:27,800 and until you're junk mail. 49 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,200 Some people are putting the wrong email address in altogether. 50 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,080 And so it's kicking back and maybe not coming through to you. 51 00:02:33,080 --> 00:02:37,800 Look, when you check out, if you get the confirmation number, you have tickets. 52 00:02:37,800 --> 00:02:38,800 It's that simple. 53 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:41,400 You can screenshot it, do whatever you want to do to make sure, you know, that makes you 54 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:42,400 feel good about it. 55 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:46,160 But you do have tickets when you get that confirmation number as soon as you check out. 56 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,480 And you do not need a paper ticket. 57 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:50,600 You do not need a paper ticket. 58 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:54,680 We actually have you on a list by name when you purchase the tickets and we will check that 59 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:56,480 whenever you come in the front door. 60 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:58,160 It's easy, peasy, lemon, squeezy. 61 00:02:58,160 --> 00:03:00,000 Just show up. 62 00:03:00,000 --> 00:03:01,600 Walk up to a food truck. 63 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:03,200 Get you some to eat. 64 00:03:03,200 --> 00:03:04,760 Walk over to the drink truck. 65 00:03:04,760 --> 00:03:08,500 Get you something to drink and get to sip in and snack in because the show is going to 66 00:03:08,500 --> 00:03:10,000 start and it's a banging one. 67 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:11,000 All right. 68 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:12,000 No worries. 69 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:13,120 And I'm going to have merch there. 70 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:16,120 If you want to buy some merch, I'm going to have, like I said, food trucks. 71 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:19,960 And drink trucks and everything that your heart desires. 72 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:21,640 All you got to do is show up and have a good time. 73 00:03:21,640 --> 00:03:23,440 So tickets are $48. 74 00:03:23,440 --> 00:03:27,360 Go ahead and get those because when it sells out, that's it. 75 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:31,680 Also, and this is like a personal thing I want to put out there for you. 76 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:37,980 Please do not buy tickets from people claiming that they bought them and now they have a whatever 77 00:03:37,980 --> 00:03:39,760 reason and they have to sell them. 78 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:41,320 They are scammers. 79 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,640 They are scammers trying to get you to send money to them. 80 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:48,000 I even went and looked at some of their profiles and they look good. 81 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,680 Man, these look like normal people, but they're not. 82 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:55,240 These are people that are trying to get you to send money and when you do it, it's out 83 00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:56,240 of my hands. 84 00:03:56,240 --> 00:04:00,480 You only can buy tickets from my approved vendor, which is through Southeastern. 85 00:04:00,480 --> 00:04:04,160 If you buy them from third parties and then you show up, I promise you they're scamming 86 00:04:04,160 --> 00:04:05,160 you. 87 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:06,160 I promise you. 88 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:07,680 Please do not bite. 89 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:09,520 Please do not send them any money. 90 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:11,120 I can't say it enough. 91 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:12,440 Please do not. 92 00:04:12,440 --> 00:04:13,920 But hey, America. 93 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,360 You make your decisions, right? 94 00:04:16,360 --> 00:04:17,360 Okay. 95 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:21,520 I've got some shout outs that I want to give and this one's going to start out in Eager, Arizona 96 00:04:21,520 --> 00:04:22,840 with Miss Linda Parker. 97 00:04:22,840 --> 00:04:23,840 Hey, Linda. 98 00:04:23,840 --> 00:04:29,960 I'm so glad to have you as one of my members on my Patreon as well as Jamie Askins. 99 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:31,320 Hi, Jamie. 100 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:36,520 And then we move right here in my backyard to Dimsp rings and Madison Semino. 101 00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:37,520 She's joined. 102 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:38,520 Hey, Madison. 103 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:40,640 I'm glad to have you right here in my hometown, girl. 104 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:45,720 And certainly last but not least is Miss Amy Owens from Homer, California, all the way 105 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:46,720 in Cali. 106 00:04:46,720 --> 00:04:48,560 I'm so tickled about my Cali listeners. 107 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:51,520 I just, I don't know why, but that just tickles me. 108 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:56,080 So thank you all so much for joining and for being a supporter of the show. 109 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:57,520 Man, it makes all the difference. 110 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:03,200 And I've got content online and I'm working so hard to up the ante and to post as much 111 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:05,040 as I can as often as I can. 112 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:06,360 So go check it out. 113 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:10,600 Also, when you become a Patreon member and you're a tiered, 114 00:05:10,600 --> 00:05:14,240 member, then you have communication with me and it's direct communication. 115 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:15,640 Send me a chat, ask me a question. 116 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:17,760 I'll answer as soon as I can. 117 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:21,880 It's me talking to you and I'm happy to look anything up for you or try to help you out 118 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:22,880 if I can. 119 00:05:22,880 --> 00:05:25,840 So thank you all so much to everyone that supports the show. 120 00:05:25,840 --> 00:05:28,080 And I'm going to go ahead and get started with this episode. 121 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:33,200 So today's episode is another Louisiana case and it takes place in Vivian, Louisiana, on 122 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:34,920 March the 12th, 2000. 123 00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:40,360 Now, Vivian, if you're not familiar, is a town in Cato Parish, which if you're looking 124 00:05:40,360 --> 00:05:43,000 at the state, we call it the boot, right? 125 00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:44,840 I'm from Louisiana. 126 00:05:44,840 --> 00:05:46,400 I'm from Louisiana. 127 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:47,400 We call it that boot, right? 128 00:05:47,400 --> 00:05:49,360 If you go to the LSU games, you know that. 129 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:54,000 All right, but if you're looking at the boot, it's going to be the most northern west part 130 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:55,640 of the state. 131 00:05:55,640 --> 00:06:00,680 So up high and to the left if you're looking at a flat map, but there lived a man and a woman 132 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:06,480 who were in a romantic relationship and their names were Larry Sharp and Joni Sanders. 133 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:12,600 Now their relationship had recently come to an end and as the month of January 2000 came 134 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:17,160 about, it really was like officially kind of over. 135 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:22,280 But I'm not going to contend that this relationship from the start was without problems 136 00:06:22,280 --> 00:06:25,240 because I want to give you a little bit of background on Larry. 137 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:27,600 Larry was previously married for 18 years. 138 00:06:27,600 --> 00:06:30,200 He was committed, I guess, to his first wife. 139 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:31,200 They had a daughter. 140 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:36,440 Her name was Holly and they, you know, kind of live, live their life. 141 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:41,520 He maintained employment, but there was a few problems that Larry had that were kind of personal 142 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:42,520 problems. 143 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:43,520 He drank heavily. 144 00:06:43,520 --> 00:06:44,720 He did use drugs. 145 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:49,640 He liked to gamble and he liked to have affairs, which is what led to the original, you 146 00:06:49,640 --> 00:06:53,520 know, the official end of his original marriage, his first marriage. 147 00:06:53,520 --> 00:06:59,480 And later he would met a girl named Joni or a woman named Joni and the two of them would 148 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:03,920 begin dating and eventually they would live together for some time, but eventually they 149 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:06,000 separated. 150 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:12,080 But their relationship did have some issues and there was an incident during their relationship 151 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:17,600 that I found where Larry had actually cut Joni with a box cutter and it was a bad enough 152 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,720 cut that she did have to get medical attention and some stitches for this. 153 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:26,640 Now while I don't have a ton of details on that event itself, I did feel like in the totality 154 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:28,280 of the story, that would matter. 155 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:31,960 So I'm just giving you the little bit of basics that I know. 156 00:07:31,960 --> 00:07:34,800 Also complete transparency here. 157 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:39,680 As this story goes on, you'll see why, but this is not a very prominent case. 158 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:41,520 You're not going to find this one all over the internet. 159 00:07:41,520 --> 00:07:42,760 It wasn't a big case. 160 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:46,600 And so I did struggle finding information on my victims here. 161 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:49,800 So it's not for lack of trying that I don't have a ton for you. 162 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:51,120 This go round. 163 00:07:51,120 --> 00:07:53,960 But there's a reason I chose this story. 164 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:58,200 Now as their relationship had ended a few months had passed and Joni was trying to move 165 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:04,760 on and see she had recently begun dating a man and his name was Marcio Stanford. 166 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:08,680 And Larry himself was trying to move on and he did have a female friend. 167 00:08:08,680 --> 00:08:13,480 Her name was Sarah Grisham, but they were not necessarily boyfriend and girlfriend. 168 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:18,040 He just really confided in her a lot and they seem to have an amicable relationship. 169 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:22,840 So it wasn't necessarily romantic, but they did often comfort each other whenever they 170 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,240 would be going through hard times. 171 00:08:25,240 --> 00:08:31,520 And on a Friday night in March of 2000, just before this case really starts taking place, 172 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:36,920 Joni placed a call to Larry and told him, look Larry, I really want to see you. 173 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:43,000 Now specifically, Joni wanted to meet up with him, not just talk to him and said, can 174 00:08:43,000 --> 00:08:47,960 we meet up at the Malibu Beach Club in Shreveport so that we can talk? 175 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:53,080 Now I don't have a ton of information of what else went on in that conversation, but it 176 00:08:53,080 --> 00:08:59,080 is documented that she did reach out to him and she did want to have a meetup with him. 177 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:04,400 So in the early 90s, the Malibu Beach Club was considered the place to be and the club 178 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:08,080 had several levels of clubbing, which was kind of neat for the 90s. 179 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:12,920 And each level had like its own bar, but it also had like its own vibe, right? 180 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:16,200 So it depended on which level you were on, what kind of vibe you were getting while you were 181 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:17,200 clubbing. 182 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:23,080 And it would have been a fun place to meet up, throw back some drinks and get together, 183 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:27,800 because at this point it kind of seemed like, hmm, maybe they really hadn't cut ties 184 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:29,680 100%. 185 00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:34,840 I don't know that this relationship was one, you know, of Romeo and Juliet, but it surely 186 00:09:34,840 --> 00:09:39,760 was one that was toxic and they were like, you know, firing gasoline, but they kept kind 187 00:09:39,760 --> 00:09:43,280 of going back and forth is what I gathered from what I had researched. 188 00:09:43,280 --> 00:09:49,000 Now Larry and Joni spoke for a while and as that conversation was being held, Larry looked 189 00:09:49,000 --> 00:09:53,720 down at the caller ID on his phone and he was quite shocked to see that he recognized 190 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,280 that phone number that she was calling from. 191 00:09:57,280 --> 00:10:01,280 However, y'all, it wasn't because it was Joni's phone number. 192 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:08,480 Larry had heard that Joni was actually seeing someone else and this phone call that she placed 193 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:13,520 seemed to confirm that, but it was shocking to Larry because the fact was that she was 194 00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:18,880 calling from Marcio's house and the reason that was shocking to Larry is because what 195 00:10:18,880 --> 00:10:24,200 I haven't told you yet is Marcio was Larry's very good friend. 196 00:10:24,200 --> 00:10:28,840 So if that doesn't tell you, Rut-Roh was about to go on, Rut-Roh. 197 00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:35,280 Now being a human being, if you didn't know I am a human being, I can say that this probably 198 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:39,000 had a pretty strong sting to it and I'm not going to deny that one bit. 199 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,720 I mean, it's bad enough that they broke up with one another and they were still kind of 200 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:43,720 talking a little bit. 201 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:47,400 They didn't break it off necessarily 100%. 202 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:52,080 And now she's actually seeing one of his friends. 203 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,000 That had to hurt. 204 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:56,360 So Larry decided, no, I'm not going to go meet with you. 205 00:10:56,360 --> 00:11:00,920 He did not go that night and instead he went to bed and then he got up Saturday morning 206 00:11:00,920 --> 00:11:06,480 and he traveled to Nacodosh's Texas to go visit Sarah, that friend that I mentioned earlier. 207 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:10,280 And at the time of this case, Larry was known to go and visit her at her home and to hang 208 00:11:10,280 --> 00:11:11,280 out. 209 00:11:11,280 --> 00:11:15,520 So according to Sarah, Larry arrived and when he was there, he was a real upset from 210 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:20,600 the time that he got there because he was kind of talking to her about his issues and 211 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:25,760 that the woman he cared about a lot had started seeing someone else. 212 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:30,880 Yet it seemed like the woman, the woman being Joni, seemed to really want Larry still 213 00:11:30,880 --> 00:11:38,000 around her and he kind of was feeling, I guess, mixed signals from her. 214 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,160 They kind of decided, you know what, let's relax together. 215 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:44,520 They drank some beer throughout the day and they did some housework and some chores around 216 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:45,800 Sarah's house. 217 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:49,520 She wanted to go work in the yard and so Larry joined in and they worked in the yard for 218 00:11:49,520 --> 00:11:53,760 a good while talking about the issues and just, you know, throwing back some beer. 219 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:58,080 And when they finally completed the tasks that Sarah wanted to do around the house, Larry 220 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:03,280 got cleaned up and decided he wanted to look to head to a local bar named Jitterbugs and 221 00:12:03,280 --> 00:12:04,560 have a few more beer. 222 00:12:04,560 --> 00:12:09,880 Now remember, I already told you a little bit about Larry and he does have drinking problems. 223 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:13,600 He does have drug usage and gambling and he does seem to have what I would think is in 224 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:15,720 a very addictive personality. 225 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:20,200 But hey, cold beer after a long day, a yard work sounds pretty damn good, am I right? 226 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:24,840 I mean, I know when I work in my yard, I love when I'm sweating and we finish doing all 227 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:26,840 the cutting and the edge in and all that. 228 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:30,360 I love plopping down this blue chair I have and just cracking back some cold ones. 229 00:12:30,360 --> 00:12:32,920 It just is nice, right? 230 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:35,960 So Larry did just that. 231 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:39,160 But while Larry went out that night and went and had some beers, he also plays several 232 00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,760 phone calls and those phone calls he made were to Marcio. 233 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:47,640 And he even left three messages saying, look man, I'm not mad at you, but I do want to 234 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:49,520 talk to you. 235 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:52,000 But Marcio never returned his phone calls. 236 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:53,000 All right. 237 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:58,960 So Larry seemed to be out and about, drinking, thinking and drinking. 238 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:03,320 So after having his drinks that evening, Larry then did return back to Sarah's house a 239 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:07,600 little bit after midnight and he tried to go to bed and get some sleep. 240 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:12,400 But unbeknownst to Sarah, the whole time Larry's lay in there. 241 00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:15,760 This got Joni on his mind and he can't shake it, right? 242 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:16,920 He's probably drunk. 243 00:13:16,920 --> 00:13:18,640 He's in a bad way. 244 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:25,120 He's really upset about the phone call Joni had made from Marcio's house earlier that day. 245 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:32,840 So as Larry tried to toss and turn, he just could not get the feeling of betrayal and hurt 246 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:35,120 out of his mind and out of his heart. 247 00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:38,400 And he didn't get much sleep and the more he thought about it, the worse he felt. 248 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:43,120 And he even at one point got up and tried to go get in the bed with Sarah and she let 249 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:44,120 him. 250 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:45,120 And he just said, look, I just want to hold you. 251 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:46,120 You can just hold you. 252 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:50,360 I don't, I'm just, I'm in a bad way and she was like, that's fine, you know, whatever. 253 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:53,000 But he just, he couldn't do it y'all. 254 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,720 And that's when he decided to do the only thing that he could think to do after a night 255 00:13:56,720 --> 00:14:03,000 of heavy drinking and sadness and he decided, I'm going to kill myself. 256 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:08,720 So Larry was better to Larry than living without Joni. 257 00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:12,600 So Larry did eventually doze off and when he got up the next morning, he told Sarah, look, 258 00:14:12,600 --> 00:14:13,600 I'm gonna go get some breakfast. 259 00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:18,080 I think he said he was going to McDonald's and so the reality of it was that it actually 260 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:19,560 wasn't true. 261 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:25,720 Instead, Larry got in his vehicle and he started driving and he headed to Marshall, Texas. 262 00:14:25,720 --> 00:14:28,640 And the reason he drove to Marshall is he had another friend that lived there. 263 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:31,040 This friend's name was Jeff Palmer. 264 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:37,280 Now when Larry got in the car, he was in tent on going to Jeff's house, but he was not going 265 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:38,680 there to visit. 266 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:40,440 He didn't want to visit. 267 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:43,600 He didn't want to be talked off the ledge of being suicidal. 268 00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:48,840 In fact, Larry went to that house because he knew Jeff wouldn't be home. 269 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:51,080 He knew that Jeff would be at work. 270 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,440 And the reason he knew that is that he had previously been a roommate of Jeff's and 271 00:14:54,440 --> 00:14:59,560 lived with him and he still had a spare key from when he lived there. 272 00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:01,720 So he knew that he could get into the house. 273 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:05,440 And there's a reason that he headed to that unoccupied home of a friend. 274 00:15:05,440 --> 00:15:09,960 And I believe it was because of convenience and comfort and he could explain it away if 275 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:12,520 he happened to be caught in the house. 276 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:16,360 But another thing that was pointed out to me or that I pointed out to myself, I guess, 277 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:18,520 was that this wasn't a quick trip. 278 00:15:18,520 --> 00:15:21,160 I even looked up the distance because I actually didn't know. 279 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:25,320 And it was an 80 mile drive he would have taken, which was gonna be about an hour and 280 00:15:25,320 --> 00:15:29,520 20 minutes if you drove the most direct route. 281 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:33,000 And when Larry got there, he was able to get into the home through the back door using 282 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:34,000 that key. 283 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:38,920 And then he immediately went to where he knew there was a shotgun and he took it. 284 00:15:38,920 --> 00:15:44,160 He took a 12 gauge semi automatic shotgun and then he rearranged some stuff on that shelf 285 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:48,160 where he took it and on the gun rack so that his friend might not notice that his gun 286 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:51,240 was missing whenever he got back home. 287 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:56,640 As he was able to obtain that weapon, he then traveled to a dearleast camp where he ultimately 288 00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:59,320 said that he was going to kill himself. 289 00:15:59,320 --> 00:16:06,240 And he was wanting his friend Tim Klonegger to come and to find his body at first. 290 00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:12,160 But while he was driving and he was thinking on his way there, he decided, you know what, 291 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:17,440 you know, I want him to find my body, but I think instead, I think I want to go kill Mars 292 00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:18,440 Hill and Joni. 293 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:20,960 I think that might make me feel better. 294 00:16:20,960 --> 00:16:22,840 So there were some things he wanted to say. 295 00:16:22,840 --> 00:16:25,800 And if he killed himself first, he wasn't going to be able to do that. 296 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:30,800 So while he was thinking through exactly what to do, he decided that he needed to get 297 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:35,600 someone else's truck as well because he was driving without a license and he was scared 298 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:40,400 that the police might recognize his truck and then take him to jail for lack of a license. 299 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,760 My only curiosity with that, and you know, I'm always going to give my opinion on things, 300 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:48,680 my only curiosity about that detail is the fact that if you were about to go kill yourself 301 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:55,120 and then other people, like, why would you care about, you know, driving without a license? 302 00:16:55,120 --> 00:16:57,880 I mean, I guess you could argue that he couldn't kill himself if they arrested him and put 303 00:16:57,880 --> 00:16:58,880 him in jail. 304 00:16:58,880 --> 00:17:02,120 But I mean, he's already committed a burglary. 305 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:04,640 He's already stolen a firearm. 306 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:08,560 So driving without a license, to me, seems kind of petty of an issue for someone contemplating 307 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:09,760 death. 308 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:13,720 But it seems more along the lines of the fact that he wanted to make sure that he was 309 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:20,160 able to get there and kill them before his plan was thwarted somehow. 310 00:17:20,160 --> 00:17:26,360 But either way, when they spoke, he and Tiltarian Tim, he did ask Tim, "Hey, man, can I borrow 311 00:17:26,360 --> 00:17:27,560 your truck?" 312 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:29,960 And so when he was questioned, "What do you need a truck for?" 313 00:17:29,960 --> 00:17:33,760 He said, "Look, I'm going to be moving my furniture because I'm going to move in with Sarah." 314 00:17:33,760 --> 00:17:38,040 Now, I don't have to tell you that's not true, but that's what he told Tim. 315 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,640 And Tim was a nice guy, so Tim said, "Sure, no problem." 316 00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:42,600 And he agreed to meet Larry at the deer camp. 317 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:47,320 And when he got there, Larry, or while he was driving there, Larry had a little bit of time 318 00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:50,200 on his hands sitting and waiting for Tim to get there. 319 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,200 So Larry took that time to write two letters. 320 00:17:53,200 --> 00:17:58,360 He wrote one letter to his ex-wife, and then he wrote another one to his daughter. 321 00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:03,720 Now in those letters, Larry tried to explain what was about to happen and the reasoning for 322 00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:06,520 his decisions and why he was doing what he was doing. 323 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:11,400 And he also even added things in like who he wanted to be his pallbearer, and he also asked 324 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,680 that his ashes be spread on a golf course. 325 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:17,560 All right, real quick. 326 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:21,680 If I was on a jury listening to this, I find that kind of interesting just because I can 327 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:27,280 identify with what he's saying, not murder, but with, like, it made me think of my own dad 328 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:29,840 because I don't know. 329 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,160 My own dad, I think, would want his freaking ashes on a golf course. 330 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:37,200 He would want a drink beer and be spread out on the golf course. 331 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:40,960 And it made me kind of think about how jurors might react differently to that when a man's 332 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:45,240 writing a suit, what looks like a suicide note, but he's also got murder on his mind. 333 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,840 It's kind of an interesting dynamic. 334 00:18:47,840 --> 00:18:53,480 But once Tim arrived, Larry then, they got in the truck and Larry took Tim back home and 335 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:58,360 then he returned back to the camp in the truck, retrieved the shotgun, and he also says 336 00:18:58,360 --> 00:19:01,960 that he got some squirrel shot while he was there. 337 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:08,920 And he also, at that point, took about six or seven volume, I guess, to get relaxed. 338 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:13,280 And remember, he was wanting to kill Joni and Marcio before he committed suicide. 339 00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:17,000 But now there was a rather large issue still standing in his way. 340 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,520 And it's that he didn't know where Marcio was currently living. 341 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:24,040 So how you gonna go kill somebody if you don't know where they are, right? 342 00:19:24,040 --> 00:19:30,400 So that's when Larry decided to drive to both Smithland and Jefferson, Texas, where he 343 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:33,520 picked up a gas can, he got some gasoline. 344 00:19:33,520 --> 00:19:41,840 And Larry did know one thing that he didn't have to ask people about and he did know where 345 00:19:41,840 --> 00:19:44,200 Joni's mother lived. 346 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:49,760 So he drove to that address, he parked down the road and he watched for any signs of people 347 00:19:49,760 --> 00:19:51,240 being home. 348 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:55,400 I'm not sure if he was watching because he didn't want anyone to be home so that he wouldn't 349 00:19:55,400 --> 00:20:02,560 get caught or if he just wanted to go be vindictive and do something to that home without actually 350 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:03,560 hurting people. 351 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:06,280 I really, I don't know, I think you would have to decide that one for yourself. 352 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:11,120 But he did go up and knock on the door at one point in a report that I read and he realized 353 00:20:11,120 --> 00:20:12,720 okay, the house is unoccupied. 354 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:17,480 So he got to the truck, he grabbed his gas can and then he walked up to the house. 355 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:22,320 And once he got close, Larry opened that gas can up and he started pouring that gas all 356 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,320 around the home of Joni's mother. 357 00:20:25,320 --> 00:20:30,000 And as soon as he had soaked it as good as he could, he flicked that match and he set that 358 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,920 house on fire. 359 00:20:32,920 --> 00:20:37,480 After the blaze was burning good, he hid the gas can, he returned to the truck and just 360 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:39,520 drove away. 361 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:45,040 One important home to Joni was now going to go down in flames. 362 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:54,320 I personally think that that's of heavy importance because he wanted to and I feel like 363 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:57,960 destroy every aspect of Joni's life that he could. 364 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:02,560 I don't know he necessarily had beef with her mother, but that would certainly be stressful 365 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:06,640 for Joni to know that her mother's house was burning to the ground. 366 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:10,840 And we don't even know if mom was inside of sleep or Larry didn't know that. 367 00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:15,560 So he could have been killing people just because he was upset. 368 00:21:15,560 --> 00:21:17,720 Not cool, Larry. 369 00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:19,640 So now Larry has turned to sites. 370 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:21,440 So I've got to find where Marcio lives. 371 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:26,280 So he drove back to Smithland and he asked several people if they knew where he lived and he was 372 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:31,720 able to get an address for him, but it wasn't actually Marcio's house. 373 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:33,960 It was Marcio's mother's home. 374 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:38,480 So to not kind of let people know that he had bad intentions when they would ask, what do 375 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:39,480 you need him for? 376 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:41,080 He said, oh, well, we're fishing buddies. 377 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:42,920 We're supposed to go fishing together. 378 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:44,600 And so they're like, okay, well, here's what his mom lives. 379 00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:46,960 You can probably go ask her and she can tell you where he is. 380 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,720 So Larry jumped in that truck and immediately now set out for that location. 381 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:56,560 So it did take him a little bit of time, but eventually Larry was able to find where his 382 00:21:56,560 --> 00:21:57,560 Marcio's mother was. 383 00:21:57,560 --> 00:22:04,040 Her name was Ada and he was able to locate that home in the late afternoon of March 12th. 384 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:09,880 So Larry arrived at the address and as he's pulling up, he immediately recognized Marcio 385 00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:15,680 in the yard and not only was Marcio there, but he was working alongside his own mother. 386 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:21,240 They were repairing a fence and as a look would have it, as Larry approached the home and 387 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:28,560 got even closer, he also laid eyes on Joni who was walking around the house to the back and 388 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:34,960 she was helping with laundry of Ada, of Ada Marcio's mom. 389 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:40,000 So Larry pulls up and he throws the truck in part and he gets out of the car and he enters 390 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:45,000 the yard and he approaches Marcio and he begins asking him, hey man, why haven't you returned 391 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:46,640 him any my phone calls? 392 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,680 Well Marcio is obviously taking kind of a surprise and shock that Larry's at his mother's house 393 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:55,960 and you know, Marcio does answer him. 394 00:22:55,960 --> 00:23:00,400 I'm sorry man, you know, I'm sorry I didn't call you back and supposedly Larry then says, 395 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,400 look man, I'm not mad at you. 396 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,360 I just, I want to know why you're not answering my phone calls. 397 00:23:06,360 --> 00:23:10,200 And so Marcio again is shocked, but he says, look, I'm sorry I didn't call you back. 398 00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:11,640 I just didn't have time to call you back. 399 00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:12,840 I've been real busy. 400 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:21,680 Well, whenever he said that to him, it put Larry into a fury of an unnatural level and now 401 00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,600 I mean, I feel like it's because he knows that Marcio is probably lying to him. 402 00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:28,240 He doesn't want things to the call because he's dating his ex-girlfriend. 403 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:36,160 So Larry looks Marcio in his eyes and in that moment he makes a decision, you got to die. 404 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:42,000 He would even later say, he being Larry, that you know, I would have shot him right there 405 00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:44,040 but his mother was behind him. 406 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:45,560 So I didn't want to pull the trigger. 407 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:46,960 Remember, it's a shotgun. 408 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:49,680 I didn't want to pull the trigger because his mom was standing behind him and you know, he 409 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:51,520 didn't have any beef with with a mama. 410 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:55,880 He had beef with Marcio, even though he's saying he doesn't clearly he does. 411 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,760 But first, he wanted to lay eyes on Joni. 412 00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:02,520 So he asked if Joni was there and Marcio says yes. 413 00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:06,920 And you know, she should have still been around the house, around the back doing the laundry. 414 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,080 So Larry asked him, hey, man, do you care if I go talk to her and Marcio is no man, you 415 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:11,080 can go back there. 416 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:17,960 So Larry gets in his truck and he drives around to the back of the home where he saw Joni. 417 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:25,960 Now I personally got the feeling that Joni could tell there was a problem just maybe in 418 00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:32,000 the essence of how Larry got out of the truck because when he got out, something signal 419 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:36,840 to her that this was a problem because she took off running from him when he got out of 420 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:38,760 the car. 421 00:24:38,760 --> 00:24:45,600 And she rips open a screen porch door and she only had time to run onto that screen porch 422 00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:51,200 before Larry got out of that truck, ripped open that screen door and he yelled at her, 423 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:53,840 Joni, you're a lying whore. 424 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:59,000 And then he threw that shotgun up on his shoulder and he shot her with it. 425 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:02,960 And seeing the damage that he had done, it still was not enough for him. 426 00:25:02,960 --> 00:25:09,000 He pulled the trigger again, shooting her a second time with that shotgun. 427 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:12,040 Joni had no chance whatsoever. 428 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:17,640 She was horrifically mortally wounded there on that porch where she collapsed, bleeding to 429 00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:22,320 death in the warmth of her own pooling blood. 430 00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:27,440 So real quick, I'm not going to go into like some expert talk here, but if you're not familiar 431 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:33,440 with shotgun shells for the most part, you're going to have either a bird shot or you can 432 00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,280 have buck shot or you could have a slug. 433 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:37,280 Okay? 434 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:40,920 So bird shot, if you're not familiar with it, hey, if you're watching me podcast, I'll draw 435 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:45,960 you a little picture, but you've got your shotgun shell and bird shot, it's kind of tiny, 436 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:49,080 but bird shot is going to be a whole bunch of t tiny little pellets in there. 437 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,280 And you can think about it, they're trying to kill a bird with it. 438 00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:52,800 You don't need something. 439 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,200 You can even see that in my lighting is kind of crazy. 440 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:59,520 And it's just tiny little pellets that are in there, but you shoot it and they disperse, 441 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,920 and the further they go without making impact, the further that they disperse. 442 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,280 Buck shot is going to be the same thing, but they're bigger. 443 00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,320 Think about taking down a buck, right? 444 00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:09,320 Taking down a deer. 445 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:16,800 And then a slug is going to be like a larger solid mass that would be shot out. 446 00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:20,720 Now, if you're not familiar with weaponry and you're going, oh, well, it was bird shot, 447 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:22,920 it's intended to kill a bird. 448 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:27,600 Yeah, not intended to be shot at a human being and definitely not twice. 449 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:31,520 So I don't want the fact I'm saying bird shot to make you think that it's nothing. 450 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:34,480 It fucking hurt. 451 00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:36,000 And it killed her. 452 00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:41,880 And it was too blast to her body in less than 15 feet, in less than 10 feet. 453 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:46,560 So all those propellants came out and they bam, bam, bam, they're just entering her body 454 00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:52,880 and then just shredding the skin and destroying everything that comes in its place. 455 00:26:52,880 --> 00:26:57,000 Now, if you're familiar with how all this works, then you're like, okay, Gally, it's not a big 456 00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:01,240 deal, but for people who aren't familiar with it, I want you to know that. 457 00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,840 It's no less just because it's bird shot. 458 00:27:03,840 --> 00:27:06,000 So then I'll start going down a rabbit hole, okay? 459 00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:07,240 Because I don't know if you do this, but I do. 460 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:10,920 And I'm like, I wonder what it feels like to be shot with a shotgun? 461 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:12,360 And I know that's weird, but I do. 462 00:27:12,360 --> 00:27:14,920 Like I wonder what it feels like. 463 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:18,080 And again, it's going to matter if you have bird shot or slugs or whatever, but regardless, 464 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:19,920 I did find a core entry online. 465 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:21,840 And I thought this was kind of interesting. 466 00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,840 It was someone who had been shot by a shotgun. 467 00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:25,640 And so this is what his thoughts were on it. 468 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,800 I thought I'd read it to you just for interesting, just because it was interesting. 469 00:27:28,800 --> 00:27:31,840 He said, I can answer this from a firsthand experience. 470 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:35,120 When I was 15, I was out deer hunting with some friends with a shotgun. 471 00:27:35,120 --> 00:27:37,400 And in my case, they had slugs, okay? 472 00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,200 So they did have the bigger, the bigger round. 473 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:44,120 But we were leaving the woods after a very cool day in the field. 474 00:27:44,120 --> 00:27:46,560 There was a partially fallen tree across the trail. 475 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:48,640 I leaned down so I could get under it. 476 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:52,640 And just as I got to the other side, I heard a deafening sound. 477 00:27:52,640 --> 00:27:55,600 I felt like I had been struck by lightning. 478 00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,800 Every nerve in my body fired at the same time. 479 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:05,160 It's hard to describe it, but it was like every bone in my body got hit with a sledgehammer. 480 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:11,040 The person behind me, as he was climbing over, excuse me, under that same tree, had his shotgun 481 00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:12,440 discharge. 482 00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:14,280 Now this was what was kind of crazy to me. 483 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,320 He didn't get shot directly with that slug. 484 00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:23,440 It was barely, it barely clipped my shoulder blade from a distance of just a couple of feet. 485 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:27,760 So close, I actually had powder burns marked on my skin. 486 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:31,880 I stood there for a moment with this, what the fuck just happened feeling? 487 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:35,360 And in a moment realized, holy shit, you've been shot. 488 00:28:35,360 --> 00:28:40,680 It was a long walk back to the road and around probably half a mile. 489 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:42,160 I was going into shot. 490 00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:46,760 If you know anything about deer hunting, you know if the blood trail looks like red foam, 491 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:50,320 like a shaving cream, that the animal has damaged lungs. 492 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:54,520 I started coughing up blood and when I saw the foam, I knew I was in real trouble. 493 00:28:54,520 --> 00:28:59,240 I walked and stumbled as best he could to the road, then they tried to call for help. 494 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:05,520 But he said the crazy thing was that he was grazed by the slug, like barely grazed by it, 495 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,000 the scapula, you know, his shoulder blade. 496 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:12,640 And a piece of meat, the doctor said, was about the size of a chicken breast was blown out. 497 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:16,720 The tissue anywhere around it was turned to mush, like frickin hamburger. 498 00:29:16,720 --> 00:29:19,800 It was a shattered bone and muscle turned to ground beef. 499 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:24,160 So while this is probably a little bit different, because it's a different type of shell, it still 500 00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:29,600 shows the fear to me and the pain of being, he was just clipped, right? 501 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:34,200 Not full on shot twice by a shotgun. 502 00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:35,880 And growing up, my daddy always told me something. 503 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:39,400 He would always say, Kelly, you need to have a shotgun in your house for protection. 504 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:40,400 And I'd be like, why a shotgun? 505 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:41,800 Why wouldn't you want a different type of gun? 506 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,360 And daddy always said this to me. 507 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,920 Most universally recognizable sound that you will hear when that gun is being racked, the 508 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:52,280 other person on the other end of it knows this is what death sounds like. 509 00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:56,080 And if you want to fuck around, you will find out when it comes to a shotgun. 510 00:29:56,080 --> 00:30:02,640 And that sound would be it, you know, in a human on human combat interaction. 511 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:06,160 So my thing is this was no mutual combat, right? 512 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:11,240 This was a defenseless woman on a screened in Southern porch. 513 00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,800 And to me, that's where we rock in our rockers, y'all. 514 00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:15,520 And that's where we drink our sweet tea. 515 00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:19,920 That's not where we expect to be shot twice brutally by someone who we thought might love 516 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:23,960 us or used to at least. 517 00:30:23,960 --> 00:30:28,240 So at the same time, after they're hearing these two blasts and realizing the extreme danger 518 00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:33,240 that Joni was in, Ada and Marcio both took off running from, you know, the front of the 519 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:36,000 house and they tore around to the back of the home. 520 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:38,720 And they were trying to get to Larry. 521 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:43,240 And when they got back there, they wanted to help help Joni, but it was just too late. 522 00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:47,720 So as they rounded the corner, Larry was already back getting into the truck and he was starting 523 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,200 to back out of the driveway. 524 00:30:49,200 --> 00:30:53,840 And Ada almost in shock is screaming, stop, stop, stop. 525 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:55,520 So Larry does believe it or not. 526 00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:57,560 He stops the truck. 527 00:30:57,560 --> 00:31:04,640 But to miss Ada's horror, she then sees Larry throw that shotgun up and point that shotgun 528 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:09,080 out the window towards her and her son. 529 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:13,760 So Larry knew that Marcio always carried a pistol. 530 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:18,680 So he started firing at Marcio who had then taken off running. 531 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:23,760 So Larry then fired at Marcio and literally, I mean, he's actually toward miss Ada at that 532 00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:29,440 point, but he's hitting Marcio's truck in the process because thinking quickly on his 533 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:33,880 feet, Marcio ran to his truck and he pulled out that gun that he was known to have and 534 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:38,000 he just started unloading on Larry as Larry was backing out of the driveway onto the main 535 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:39,000 roadway, right? 536 00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:43,440 Buh, buh, buh, buh, buh, he's just unloading his weapon. 537 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:48,920 He was, you know, Larry was trying to get away basically from the murder he had just committed, 538 00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:53,400 but as the truck tore away and it barreled down that road, Marcio shot again. 539 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:58,480 And this time he did hit the back of Larry's truck as it tore off into the distance. 540 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:02,520 Now with Larry gone in some distance between them and the immediate threat ended. 541 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:07,800 Ada and Marcio again returned to go try to find Joni who they knew was mortally wounded, 542 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:10,720 but they were praying that this wasn't the case. 543 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:12,760 But when they came up on her, they found her. 544 00:32:12,760 --> 00:32:18,000 She was lying face down and she was lying face down in some running water from the hot water 545 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:21,360 pipes which had been hit by Larry's gunfire. 546 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:23,600 And she was motionless. 547 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:29,640 So devastated and sickened by the sight that he saw, Marcio walked up and carefully 548 00:32:29,640 --> 00:32:32,760 pulled Joni from that water flow. 549 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:38,000 But he was able to tell when he pulled her away that she was gone, that she was no more. 550 00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:43,120 So in an effort to maintain her dignity and to show respect for her, Marcio grabbed 551 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:48,400 a sheet that was there and he covered her lifeless body with it. 552 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:53,920 And they immediately called 911 to try to get some help. 553 00:32:53,920 --> 00:33:00,280 So in shock, they're there, you know how in the hell had Ada and Marcio and Joni gone 554 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,640 from a normal day of yard work to this. 555 00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,200 What had just happened, right? 556 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:09,200 No attempts at saving Joni were going to be necessary. 557 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:14,240 What Larry did to her was beyond repair and he finished what he started out to do. 558 00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:19,600 It was a blitz attack that left one woman dead and two others scared other ever-loven 559 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,560 minds and y'all had happened in a second. 560 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:28,200 I mean, it probably happened quicker than it took me to tell the story just now. 561 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:32,240 Your life can change in an instant. 562 00:33:32,240 --> 00:33:34,360 But the story is not over yet. 563 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:40,000 So Larry now was moving to another location because killing himself now became his priority 564 00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:45,240 and at that point he then took a whole bottle of volume that he had after the shooting 565 00:33:45,240 --> 00:33:48,920 and he continued to drive two or three miles away. 566 00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:53,440 And he had originally broken into that first friend's house that I told you about not only 567 00:33:53,440 --> 00:34:00,880 did he get a shotgun, but he also grabbed a piece of hose like a garden hose and he decided 568 00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:05,000 to take that piece of hose that he took and he connected it to his tailpipe of the truck 569 00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:09,320 he was in and he started the truck and an attempt to commit suicide. 570 00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:10,680 So he had some duct tape. 571 00:34:10,680 --> 00:34:13,680 He connected that hose to the end of the tailpipe. 572 00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:18,600 He duct taped it as best that he could and then he pulled the other end of the hose into 573 00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:25,580 the truck window and he just started pumping that carbon monoxide into the cab of the truck. 574 00:34:25,580 --> 00:34:33,480 But just as he started getting groggy, the truck started to overheat and he had to get out 575 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:34,480 of the truck. 576 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:35,880 There was an ice chest with water in the back of it. 577 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:40,400 So he took that and tried to cool the engine and he allowed, you know, he cooled down, allowed 578 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,180 him to get back in there and try a second suicide attempt. 579 00:34:43,180 --> 00:34:47,100 But at that point the truck all together just quit running. 580 00:34:47,100 --> 00:34:49,020 So he had to make a new course of action. 581 00:34:49,020 --> 00:34:54,580 So he grabbed the shotgun and then he walked until he reached a pay phone and there he called 582 00:34:54,580 --> 00:34:57,980 his daughter Holly because he wanted to tell her goodbye. 583 00:34:57,980 --> 00:35:01,180 And I'm telling you now Larry has done some horrific things. 584 00:35:01,180 --> 00:35:03,020 My heart now is with Holly. 585 00:35:03,020 --> 00:35:05,020 I don't know her, by the way. 586 00:35:05,020 --> 00:35:06,420 But can you imagine, right? 587 00:35:06,420 --> 00:35:11,540 Because it turns out that Holly had gotten a phone call from her father the night before 588 00:35:11,540 --> 00:35:14,100 the shooting ever took place and she said he was very upset. 589 00:35:14,100 --> 00:35:15,100 He was crying. 590 00:35:15,100 --> 00:35:19,100 He said that he was going crazy and he was asking Holly, man, get your mama. 591 00:35:19,100 --> 00:35:20,300 I need to talk to your mama. 592 00:35:20,300 --> 00:35:24,660 I've tried to call her, but her phone number had changed and so he could not get a hold 593 00:35:24,660 --> 00:35:25,980 of her. 594 00:35:25,980 --> 00:35:31,900 So now here's Holly the next day and she's now receiving another call from her dad and 595 00:35:31,900 --> 00:35:33,900 now he says, I've done something bad. 596 00:35:33,900 --> 00:35:37,900 I need to talk to your mother, which is interesting. 597 00:35:37,900 --> 00:35:38,900 Y'all it's his ex-wife. 598 00:35:38,900 --> 00:35:40,500 They divorced one another. 599 00:35:40,500 --> 00:35:42,500 But I feel I fail. 600 00:35:42,500 --> 00:35:43,500 Oh my God. 601 00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:47,500 The most country thing I think I've ever said in my life, I apologize. 602 00:35:47,500 --> 00:35:51,860 But I feel like she divorced Larry because Larry wasn't doing what he was supposed to be 603 00:35:51,860 --> 00:35:52,860 doing. 604 00:35:52,860 --> 00:35:55,800 I don't know that for a fact, but that's what I get the feeling of, but he still is dependent 605 00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,500 on her, I guess, for emotional support. 606 00:35:58,500 --> 00:36:02,340 So Holly is like, okay, Daddy, let me try to get a hold of mom. 607 00:36:02,340 --> 00:36:03,780 I'm going to have her call you. 608 00:36:03,780 --> 00:36:10,260 So the caller ID indicated to Holly that her dad was calling from that pay phone and Larry 609 00:36:10,260 --> 00:36:14,260 was crying. 610 00:36:14,260 --> 00:36:17,260 He was really upset and Holly said, okay, let me get mama. 611 00:36:17,260 --> 00:36:19,260 I'm going to have her call you, but there was an issue. 612 00:36:19,260 --> 00:36:24,260 That pay phone that Larry was standing at would not accept calls. 613 00:36:24,260 --> 00:36:26,260 It would only let him make calls out. 614 00:36:26,260 --> 00:36:30,260 So no phone call ever came back through to Larry. 615 00:36:30,260 --> 00:36:33,060 So unable to speak to his ex-wife and right after killing his former lover, Larry decided he 616 00:36:33,060 --> 00:36:36,740 was going to go out with a bang literally. 617 00:36:36,740 --> 00:36:38,540 He decided, all right, I'm just going to shoot myself. 618 00:36:38,540 --> 00:36:39,540 I'm done. 619 00:36:39,540 --> 00:36:40,540 I'm still self now. 620 00:36:40,540 --> 00:36:47,260 And part of me wants to feel bad for him, but I can't because you did this to yourself. 621 00:36:47,260 --> 00:36:51,580 You brought this on yourself and you've just killed somebody and you've also burned down 622 00:36:51,580 --> 00:36:52,580 her mother's home. 623 00:36:52,580 --> 00:36:53,780 So there's another victim there. 624 00:36:53,780 --> 00:36:56,180 Your daughter is now a victim. 625 00:36:56,180 --> 00:36:59,060 She's going to go through her life horrified. 626 00:36:59,060 --> 00:37:02,860 I'm sure that she, if only that phone would have rang, maybe something different could have 627 00:37:02,860 --> 00:37:03,860 happened. 628 00:37:03,860 --> 00:37:04,860 I don't know. 629 00:37:04,860 --> 00:37:08,140 But Larry decided at this point he was going to shoot himself and end his life, but he ran 630 00:37:08,140 --> 00:37:13,780 into another issue that when he tried to place the shotgun under his throat, it made it where 631 00:37:13,780 --> 00:37:17,380 he was unable to effectively pull the trigger because of the length of the weapon. 632 00:37:17,380 --> 00:37:21,380 So thinking about other options, that's when Larry said, okay, let me just get an extension 633 00:37:21,380 --> 00:37:23,140 and then I could pull the trigger. 634 00:37:23,140 --> 00:37:27,380 So he walked around and he did find a stick that I read. 635 00:37:27,380 --> 00:37:31,700 He needed one that was kind of like a y-shaped stick and he was going to use that to be the 636 00:37:31,700 --> 00:37:33,500 extension to pull the trigger. 637 00:37:33,500 --> 00:37:36,780 So doing this though is a little bit easier said than done. 638 00:37:36,780 --> 00:37:42,620 So as he positioned the gun to try to do the extension, right, to make it shoot, the gun 639 00:37:42,620 --> 00:37:45,940 prematurely fired, but it did make contact with Larry. 640 00:37:45,940 --> 00:37:51,100 It actually struck him in the chest and it knocked him backwards. 641 00:37:51,100 --> 00:37:55,660 So Larry is now also potentially mortally wounded and he's going to need life saving care 642 00:37:55,660 --> 00:37:57,460 if he ever he was to survive. 643 00:37:57,460 --> 00:38:02,180 Now if this was a movie, Larry would have slumped down and slid to the ground and his eyes 644 00:38:02,180 --> 00:38:04,820 would have slowly glazed over and he'd be dead, right? 645 00:38:04,820 --> 00:38:09,180 But that's not how the order of the world works. 646 00:38:09,180 --> 00:38:13,420 When he did that, a few minutes later, the Cato pair of Sheriff's Office received a report 647 00:38:13,420 --> 00:38:17,860 of a gun fired in the vicinity of a nearby bar named Mud Puppies. 648 00:38:17,860 --> 00:38:21,420 And someone in there had heard the shot and they called 911. 649 00:38:21,420 --> 00:38:24,740 Obviously shots fired would have been of concern, right? 650 00:38:24,740 --> 00:38:29,100 Specifically around a bar where people are drinking, so deputies went out to investigate 651 00:38:29,100 --> 00:38:30,300 that report. 652 00:38:30,300 --> 00:38:34,700 And when deputies arrived, they searched the area and eventually they did find Larry lying 653 00:38:34,700 --> 00:38:39,100 near that pay phone with a self-inflicted gunshot wound to the chest. 654 00:38:39,100 --> 00:38:43,860 So an ambulance was immediately called as well as Sergeant Gary Freak who was notified 655 00:38:43,860 --> 00:38:45,780 about a man with a gunshot wound. 656 00:38:45,780 --> 00:38:51,060 So he and another Cato Sheriff's Office investigator named John May went to the scene where they 657 00:38:51,060 --> 00:38:53,100 too walked up and they did. 658 00:38:53,100 --> 00:38:57,660 In fact, observe a white male laying on the ground with a self-inflicted gunshot wound. 659 00:38:57,660 --> 00:39:02,540 Well there was a deputy James McLean who had arrived on scene right before them and 660 00:39:02,540 --> 00:39:05,740 I mean, he might have been one of the first ones on scene if not the first and he had applied 661 00:39:05,740 --> 00:39:09,060 a towel and pressure to the wound that Larry had. 662 00:39:09,060 --> 00:39:12,900 But Larry had continued to scream, please just let me die, just let me die. 663 00:39:12,900 --> 00:39:14,420 But you know, officers aren't going to do that, right? 664 00:39:14,420 --> 00:39:17,220 They're going to try to assist you. 665 00:39:17,220 --> 00:39:21,700 So he was able to get those two investigators up to date with the fact that, you know, 666 00:39:21,700 --> 00:39:23,980 the shot male was Larry Sharp. 667 00:39:23,980 --> 00:39:28,980 Now Sergeant Freak walked around and he found the gun that Larry had shot himself with. 668 00:39:28,980 --> 00:39:34,140 It was roughly 200 feet away from where Larry was laying and he did identify it as that 669 00:39:34,140 --> 00:39:36,180 12 gauge pump shotgun. 670 00:39:36,180 --> 00:39:41,500 Coincidentally though, investigator May who was on scene had earlier in that evening 671 00:39:41,500 --> 00:39:49,820 around 6 p.m. been called to the scene of a shooting where he found the body of Joni. 672 00:39:49,820 --> 00:39:54,100 So he was actually the one that responded to the death scene of Joni, Marcio identified 673 00:39:54,100 --> 00:39:56,460 Larry Sharp as the guy who had done this. 674 00:39:56,460 --> 00:40:00,580 And then now here he is to another guy that's been shot and sure enough, he knows what's 675 00:40:00,580 --> 00:40:01,580 going on. 676 00:40:01,580 --> 00:40:07,540 Now, what was even crazier about this was that Larry was still awake. 677 00:40:07,540 --> 00:40:09,620 He was lucid. 678 00:40:09,620 --> 00:40:10,620 He was able to talk. 679 00:40:10,620 --> 00:40:11,700 Maybe it was all the volume. 680 00:40:11,700 --> 00:40:14,500 I don't know, but he's got a gunshot chest to the, what? 681 00:40:14,500 --> 00:40:17,900 A gunshot wound at the chest and he's still able to talk. 682 00:40:17,900 --> 00:40:20,260 Y'all, he was alert, according to the reports. 683 00:40:20,260 --> 00:40:21,260 He was alert. 684 00:40:21,260 --> 00:40:22,420 He was conscious. 685 00:40:22,420 --> 00:40:26,740 And although he was in a lot of pain, he still was able to be Miranda's. 686 00:40:26,740 --> 00:40:30,140 They gave him his rights and they asked him, hey, did you shoot yourself? 687 00:40:30,140 --> 00:40:31,140 He said, yes. 688 00:40:31,140 --> 00:40:32,700 They said, did you shoot Joni? 689 00:40:32,700 --> 00:40:35,260 He said, yes, a very matter of factly. 690 00:40:35,260 --> 00:40:37,140 And they were like, why did you shoot her? 691 00:40:37,140 --> 00:40:41,380 And he even explained while he was being worked on, I shot her because she ran off with my 692 00:40:41,380 --> 00:40:43,460 best friend. 693 00:40:43,460 --> 00:40:47,980 He also said that the gun that he had just shot himself with was in fact the same one that 694 00:40:47,980 --> 00:40:51,100 he had killed Joni with earlier that day. 695 00:40:51,100 --> 00:40:56,220 And officers were able to retrieve several notes from Larry's pockets and deputies located 696 00:40:56,220 --> 00:40:59,940 the truck Larry drove nearby the bar where he was found. 697 00:40:59,940 --> 00:41:04,540 And the officers noted that the truck had several bullet holes in the bed of it and that 698 00:41:04,540 --> 00:41:07,820 hose was still connected to the tailpipe. 699 00:41:07,820 --> 00:41:12,580 This was Larry's truck and exactly what Marcio said happened seemed to be panning out 700 00:41:12,580 --> 00:41:15,420 right there with what they were seeing evidence wise. 701 00:41:15,420 --> 00:41:20,580 So Larry was arrested but transported to the LSU Medical Center where he continued to 702 00:41:20,580 --> 00:41:22,300 receive treatment. 703 00:41:22,300 --> 00:41:25,820 And at the hospital when doctors were trying to save Larry, he just kept pleading with the 704 00:41:25,820 --> 00:41:28,620 emergency responders, please just let me die. 705 00:41:28,620 --> 00:41:29,620 Just let me die. 706 00:41:29,620 --> 00:41:30,860 I don't want to live. 707 00:41:30,860 --> 00:41:33,820 But as the order of the world would have it, Larry would survive. 708 00:41:33,820 --> 00:41:36,540 His self-inflicted injury. 709 00:41:36,540 --> 00:41:39,740 And Larry never contested the fact that he shot Joni. 710 00:41:39,740 --> 00:41:44,540 And while he remained in the hospital, officers continued their investigation, including finding 711 00:41:44,540 --> 00:41:46,780 letters left at the hunting camp by Larry. 712 00:41:46,780 --> 00:41:49,340 Remember he wrote those letters before he barbed the truck. 713 00:41:49,340 --> 00:41:53,820 In one red, this is a direct quote, "I would have killed you, Marcio, but your mom was in the 714 00:41:53,820 --> 00:41:57,060 way you sorry bastard." 715 00:41:57,060 --> 00:42:01,100 Another one red, who it was like it was speaking to the reader of the note whenever they found 716 00:42:01,100 --> 00:42:02,700 it. 717 00:42:02,700 --> 00:42:08,180 Please go to my apartment to see how many times Joni had called me and it also said Joni 718 00:42:08,180 --> 00:42:13,060 came over about two weeks earlier and had sex with him several times. 719 00:42:13,060 --> 00:42:18,340 So I'm certainly not victim blaming here but it does seem to muddy it up, right? 720 00:42:18,340 --> 00:42:23,060 Maybe she was kind of going between the two men trying to, you know, couldn't cut ties. 721 00:42:23,060 --> 00:42:27,340 The note ended so I'm not the only bad one here. 722 00:42:27,340 --> 00:42:29,820 So he did recognize what he did was wrong. 723 00:42:29,820 --> 00:42:33,900 Another note said, and this was kind of chicken shit. 724 00:42:33,900 --> 00:42:37,660 But Marcio, I hope you dream about it every night. 725 00:42:37,660 --> 00:42:43,020 By the way, police, he sells two pounds of weed and then there was plus something else but 726 00:42:43,020 --> 00:42:44,780 it was, it was not legible. 727 00:42:44,780 --> 00:42:48,660 So he then calls Marcio out for being a drug dealer. 728 00:42:48,660 --> 00:42:51,100 Don't sell drugs, Marcio. 729 00:42:51,100 --> 00:42:53,380 Allegedly. 730 00:42:53,380 --> 00:42:56,180 A final one said, "Tell Roj." 731 00:42:56,180 --> 00:42:58,100 And I think it's Roj, ROGE. 732 00:42:58,100 --> 00:43:03,460 Tell Roj, who I would find out later, is a Texas police officer who knew Larry's ex-wife 733 00:43:03,460 --> 00:43:05,740 and had arrested him before. 734 00:43:05,740 --> 00:43:09,340 It said, "Tell Roj, if I could have gotten to town, he was next." 735 00:43:09,340 --> 00:43:13,460 So he was only an absolute death spiral of wanting to go kill all these people. 736 00:43:13,460 --> 00:43:17,340 But Larry would eventually recover and he would be released from the hospital where he would 737 00:43:17,340 --> 00:43:20,300 face trial for the charges of second degree murder. 738 00:43:20,300 --> 00:43:25,260 And there was a forensic psychologist named Dr. Mark Vigan, or Vi-Vigan, I don't know, 739 00:43:25,260 --> 00:43:32,780 V-I-G-E-N, who testified on behalf of the defense that argued Larry suffered from narcissistic 740 00:43:32,780 --> 00:43:36,060 personality disorder and a chemical dependency on drugs. 741 00:43:36,060 --> 00:43:37,260 And alcohol, we already knew that, right? 742 00:43:37,260 --> 00:43:39,420 We could have figured that out just listening to this. 743 00:43:39,420 --> 00:43:45,660 Now, he testified that Larry was very hurt and surprised and just became enraged whenever 744 00:43:45,660 --> 00:43:51,420 Joni rejected him finally for Marcio, especially since I guess they had been hooking up right 745 00:43:51,420 --> 00:43:53,100 then prior to that. 746 00:43:53,100 --> 00:43:58,500 But there was something that Dr. Vigan, or Vi-Vigan, said that was really interesting to me, 747 00:43:58,500 --> 00:44:02,900 and I won't harp on it, but he gave this analogy to explain how someone could be acting 748 00:44:02,900 --> 00:44:07,620 like so impulsively, but not be in total control of the entire situation. 749 00:44:07,620 --> 00:44:09,460 Now I wanted to share this explanation with you. 750 00:44:09,460 --> 00:44:13,780 It's for you to ponder, I'm not telling you what to think, but I kind of was struck by it. 751 00:44:13,780 --> 00:44:18,220 He argued that Larry could distinguish between right and wrong in the sense that he was 752 00:44:18,220 --> 00:44:23,740 making judgments, such as not to shoot Marcio's, you know, mom because he didn't shoot at Marcio 753 00:44:23,740 --> 00:44:26,100 because his mother was right there. 754 00:44:26,100 --> 00:44:32,700 But he also said that he was going to give this analogy to try to put yourself in the shoes 755 00:44:32,700 --> 00:44:33,700 of Larry. 756 00:44:33,700 --> 00:44:39,540 He said, "Imagine you were driving a car down the street when suddenly bees and wasps entered 757 00:44:39,540 --> 00:44:42,060 the car and started to attack you. 758 00:44:42,060 --> 00:44:46,500 The driver may have an accident or he may manage to control the car and get rid of the bees. 759 00:44:46,500 --> 00:44:53,220 He can still drive, he can still plan, but his planning, his judgment and his impulsiveness 760 00:44:53,220 --> 00:44:55,820 will be very poor." 761 00:44:55,820 --> 00:45:00,820 So man, on a psychological level, I thought, damn, that was pretty good explanation of what 762 00:45:00,820 --> 00:45:08,780 I guess Larry was going through, but, but, right, the proverbial butt, which by the way, 763 00:45:08,780 --> 00:45:12,620 Dr. Phil said this one time, "There's a different dream but and however. 764 00:45:12,620 --> 00:45:15,580 If someone says but, it means disregard everything before it. 765 00:45:15,580 --> 00:45:19,220 So I love you but, I don't want to be with you means I don't love you. 766 00:45:19,220 --> 00:45:24,540 But if someone says, "I love you, however, I don't want to be with you," that means don't 767 00:45:24,540 --> 00:45:26,740 disregard what I said before it. 768 00:45:26,740 --> 00:45:27,740 It still counts. 769 00:45:27,740 --> 00:45:29,980 So I'm going to throw that big butt in here. 770 00:45:29,980 --> 00:45:38,020 To me, Larry, whether he was hurt or not, I'm not doubting that this man was in the throes 771 00:45:38,020 --> 00:45:40,220 of an all-out-emotional turmoil. 772 00:45:40,220 --> 00:45:42,300 No doubt whatsoever. 773 00:45:42,300 --> 00:45:47,540 But he carried out his actions over an extended period of time and he calculated those actions 774 00:45:47,540 --> 00:45:48,540 in my opinion. 775 00:45:48,540 --> 00:45:52,820 I mean, he didn't shoot at Marcio because his mother was behind him and he didn't want 776 00:45:52,820 --> 00:45:56,580 to hurt someone who he felt wasn't involved or guilty. 777 00:45:56,580 --> 00:46:00,780 So that tells you there's a level of planning there and clearly to the normal person, Larry's 778 00:46:00,780 --> 00:46:04,460 thinking is unreasonable but it's pretty obvious that he was capable of understanding the 779 00:46:04,460 --> 00:46:11,020 consequences of what he did because he also begged to die multiple times and the officers 780 00:46:11,020 --> 00:46:12,460 and the doctors were still trying to treat him. 781 00:46:12,460 --> 00:46:14,020 He was begging to die. 782 00:46:14,020 --> 00:46:19,020 So the disorders that the doctors at trial diagnosed Larry with, you know, I'm not going 783 00:46:19,020 --> 00:46:20,540 to argue that what they said wasn't true. 784 00:46:20,540 --> 00:46:22,660 I think they made absolutely valid points. 785 00:46:22,660 --> 00:46:27,540 Others are not though, they did not diminish his capacity in my opinion to control his own 786 00:46:27,540 --> 00:46:28,540 behavior. 787 00:46:28,540 --> 00:46:31,540 And I know this sounds really ugly but Larry could have just killed himself. 788 00:46:31,540 --> 00:46:34,380 He did not have to go kill other people if he was so wounded by this. 789 00:46:34,380 --> 00:46:36,580 And I know that sounds ugly but it's the truth. 790 00:46:36,580 --> 00:46:38,580 I feel the same thing about school shooters. 791 00:46:38,580 --> 00:46:39,900 No one should have bullied you. 792 00:46:39,900 --> 00:46:41,460 No one should have talked shit about you. 793 00:46:41,460 --> 00:46:42,460 But you know what? 794 00:46:42,460 --> 00:46:44,980 When you get to the point where you want to start hurting other people including innocent 795 00:46:44,980 --> 00:46:51,220 people and innocent bystanders, go fucking shoot yourself, leave the innocent people alone. 796 00:46:51,220 --> 00:46:56,540 So the jury agreed with this belief I have as well in that the verdict with an 11 to 797 00:46:56,540 --> 00:47:01,460 one favor convicted him of that second degree murder and he was sentenced to life in prison 798 00:47:01,460 --> 00:47:05,340 and he is still serving that sentence today at Angola. 799 00:47:05,340 --> 00:47:06,700 But I want to tell you something. 800 00:47:06,700 --> 00:47:13,540 The story doesn't end there for me because my life personally actually intersects with 801 00:47:13,540 --> 00:47:15,540 Larry's years later. 802 00:47:15,540 --> 00:47:19,180 When this case took place, I would have been a sophomore in high school. 803 00:47:19,180 --> 00:47:21,180 All right, I had no concept of this. 804 00:47:21,180 --> 00:47:24,140 I was a dumb teenager, run around doing whatever. 805 00:47:24,140 --> 00:47:28,860 But years later, I had graduated college and I was working at a place known as Louisiana 806 00:47:28,860 --> 00:47:31,180 State Penitentiary at Angola. 807 00:47:31,180 --> 00:47:35,020 And I know a lot of people who listen to this know bloody Angola, right? 808 00:47:35,020 --> 00:47:39,580 No gym and no woody and that they're slaying everything about the Angola prison. 809 00:47:39,580 --> 00:47:44,460 But I had a job there and I worked there in classification which means I interacted with 810 00:47:44,460 --> 00:47:46,460 inmates day in and day out. 811 00:47:46,460 --> 00:47:53,300 And one of those inmates that I interacted with was an inmate by the name of Larry Sharp. 812 00:47:53,300 --> 00:47:57,540 Now, I never knew Larry's case until recently. 813 00:47:57,540 --> 00:47:58,540 Why? 814 00:47:58,540 --> 00:48:04,000 Because I made it a point to not look up my inmate's cases because I didn't want it to 815 00:48:04,000 --> 00:48:06,660 affect me doing my job. 816 00:48:06,660 --> 00:48:08,220 And we're emotional people. 817 00:48:08,220 --> 00:48:10,020 You have to separate the two. 818 00:48:10,020 --> 00:48:12,420 There is one in inmate that I did do a whole bunch of research on. 819 00:48:12,420 --> 00:48:13,420 I'm going to tell you all that story another day. 820 00:48:13,420 --> 00:48:14,740 I've got it in the books right now. 821 00:48:14,740 --> 00:48:17,100 You're going to like that one. 822 00:48:17,100 --> 00:48:22,980 But I knew Larry Sharp, DOC number 4443025. 823 00:48:22,980 --> 00:48:27,060 And I was stunned when I looked at this case up and I've got a visual I'm going to show 824 00:48:27,060 --> 00:48:28,060 you. 825 00:48:28,060 --> 00:48:30,020 If you're on Patreon, I'm going to let you see this, okay? 826 00:48:30,020 --> 00:48:32,860 But I'm kind of a sentimental person when things happen. 827 00:48:32,860 --> 00:48:37,220 You know, I keep little notes and I'm so glad I did because I'm able to be a better teacher 828 00:48:37,220 --> 00:48:40,020 as a result of it. 829 00:48:40,020 --> 00:48:49,540 And Larry Sharp actually wrote me and made me a card on a computer in the prison library. 830 00:48:49,540 --> 00:48:53,300 And I was stunned when he gave it to me. 831 00:48:53,300 --> 00:48:58,340 I remember Larry and again, I didn't know the story right until I've told it to you and I researched 832 00:48:58,340 --> 00:48:59,340 it. 833 00:48:59,340 --> 00:49:03,060 And if you would have told me that he was capable of doing what I just read, you know, 834 00:49:03,060 --> 00:49:06,580 read to you, I would have called bullshit. 835 00:49:06,580 --> 00:49:08,100 Bullshit all day long. 836 00:49:08,100 --> 00:49:14,140 If you would have told me he maybe did embezzlement, I'd say, yeah, for sure. 837 00:49:14,140 --> 00:49:17,980 If you said he did some other type of white collar crime or something like that, I'd say all 838 00:49:17,980 --> 00:49:19,700 day long, I could see him doing it. 839 00:49:19,700 --> 00:49:26,860 But the Larry Sharp I met does not fit the bill of what I just read to you. 840 00:49:26,860 --> 00:49:31,580 And that should be important because all I do is preach in this podcast that you don't 841 00:49:31,580 --> 00:49:37,340 know what people are capable of when they are in the throes of a meltdown. 842 00:49:37,340 --> 00:49:40,900 And just because you don't think someone is capable of doing something doesn't mean that 843 00:49:40,900 --> 00:49:42,900 they're not. 844 00:49:42,900 --> 00:49:44,940 It's insanity to think otherwise. 845 00:49:44,940 --> 00:49:48,740 But why did Larry give me this card? 846 00:49:48,740 --> 00:49:50,940 The front of it says we'll miss you. 847 00:49:50,940 --> 00:49:52,700 Proper grammar and everything. 848 00:49:52,700 --> 00:49:54,380 It's typed. 849 00:49:54,380 --> 00:49:58,980 And on the back it says, created expressly for and it has my name. 850 00:49:58,980 --> 00:50:03,300 And it's got his name in his DOC number, but he typed this, he even signed it with a smiley 851 00:50:03,300 --> 00:50:04,300 face. 852 00:50:04,300 --> 00:50:09,380 This is what the man who I just read to you, what barbarianism he just showed toward a woman. 853 00:50:09,380 --> 00:50:11,540 Listen what he wrote me. 854 00:50:11,540 --> 00:50:13,980 Miss Kelly. 855 00:50:13,980 --> 00:50:20,100 I appreciate the kindness, concern and compassion you showed to the inmates while working with 856 00:50:20,100 --> 00:50:21,420 us. 857 00:50:21,420 --> 00:50:27,100 It should be an example to the other employees that these qualities can be exhibited while 858 00:50:27,100 --> 00:50:30,260 still doing the job in a professional manner. 859 00:50:30,260 --> 00:50:35,900 Sometimes just showing genuine interest in an inmate's request for a special visit or a job 860 00:50:35,900 --> 00:50:39,100 change can mean a lot to them. 861 00:50:39,100 --> 00:50:44,820 These characteristics along with your personality will ensure a successful life in the business 862 00:50:44,820 --> 00:50:45,820 world. 863 00:50:45,820 --> 00:50:48,540 Again, thank you and we will miss you. 864 00:50:48,540 --> 00:50:52,460 May God bless you, Larry Sharp. 865 00:50:52,460 --> 00:50:55,740 And I remember when he handed me this because I was leaving the prison. 866 00:50:55,740 --> 00:50:59,420 It was my last day working and I had not told any inmates because I was like, hey, if somebody 867 00:50:59,420 --> 00:51:03,020 wants to kill me, I don't want to give them the opportunity, right? 868 00:51:03,020 --> 00:51:07,060 But he handed me this through a fence and I remember just being dumb struck by it that he 869 00:51:07,060 --> 00:51:10,340 took the time and you know, it's like the great vine in prison, y'all. 870 00:51:10,340 --> 00:51:14,940 I mean, they figure everything out before you, you don't have to say a word and they're 871 00:51:14,940 --> 00:51:15,940 going to figure it out. 872 00:51:15,940 --> 00:51:17,700 I still don't know how he knew. 873 00:51:17,700 --> 00:51:24,580 But that man went down and typed me this card and when he said, thank you for showing 874 00:51:24,580 --> 00:51:31,820 the kindness and the compassion and concern you showed to us. 875 00:51:31,820 --> 00:51:37,380 It makes you wonder, you know, where was that mentality when you pulled the trigger on 876 00:51:37,380 --> 00:51:38,980 Joni? 877 00:51:38,980 --> 00:51:43,780 You know, not once but twice. 878 00:51:43,780 --> 00:51:47,020 You know, you would like that from people, Larry. 879 00:51:47,020 --> 00:51:50,580 And I'm so thankful I was able to show it to you because I think that if you want love, 880 00:51:50,580 --> 00:51:54,140 you have to give love and if you want appreciation and kindness and concern, you have to show 881 00:51:54,140 --> 00:51:55,580 that for other people. 882 00:51:55,580 --> 00:52:02,180 But I just, if this is not an example to you listening, there can be two sides to a coin 883 00:52:02,180 --> 00:52:05,860 listen to what I'm telling you. 884 00:52:05,860 --> 00:52:09,180 Time can absolutely change a person. 885 00:52:09,180 --> 00:52:12,660 But what about those who never got the chance to grow and change? 886 00:52:12,660 --> 00:52:21,860 The Larry I saw is not the Larry that did this dastardly deed but it doesn't undo it. 887 00:52:21,860 --> 00:52:26,680 And those that had their life brutally ended at the hands of someone in a jealous suicidal 888 00:52:26,680 --> 00:52:32,820 rage, this is where, you know, I genuinely struggle with the understanding of where, where 889 00:52:32,820 --> 00:52:38,100 does the line of forgiveness meet, unforgivable? 890 00:52:38,100 --> 00:52:41,140 And Joni, y'all, she's no more. 891 00:52:41,140 --> 00:52:46,500 She's been gone now for almost 23 years but that in no way lessens her importance to this 892 00:52:46,500 --> 00:52:48,020 world. 893 00:52:48,020 --> 00:52:49,820 And this is a time I'll tell you, I can see it. 894 00:52:49,820 --> 00:52:54,220 I don't know and I don't think it's my job to decide that. 895 00:52:54,220 --> 00:52:56,600 It's, it's Joni's job. 896 00:52:56,600 --> 00:53:01,660 And the, the unchanging reality though is that she's not here to tell us how she feels 897 00:53:01,660 --> 00:53:08,620 or whether she would want to grant mercy to someone who so blatantly deprived it, you 898 00:53:08,620 --> 00:53:11,260 know, deprived her of it. 899 00:53:11,260 --> 00:53:19,060 My experience with Larry and older sober man is vastly different than what Joni experienced 900 00:53:19,060 --> 00:53:21,180 for damn sure. 901 00:53:21,180 --> 00:53:26,620 And that's something that I realize daily in true crime cases. 902 00:53:26,620 --> 00:53:32,900 So I'll tell you this, I don't know what she would say but I do know this. 903 00:53:32,900 --> 00:53:36,780 Over time the axe forgets but the tree always remembers. 904 00:53:37,180 --> 00:53:46,780 [MUSIC] 905 00:53:46,780 --> 00:53:49,360 (dramatic music) 906 00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:52,060 (dramatic music)